tending the flag

[hovis]

Today my pal was tending the flag but not paying attention. I hit my putt and it hit the pin and come to rest 3ft from the pin.

Am i correct in saying a penalty would only apply if i had holed it?

 

[nemicu]

Nope - you still get a penalty for hitting the pin and the ball is played as it lies. If however your PP deliberately retained the flag with the express intention of causing your ball to miss, they are disqualified and in equity the stroke should be replayed with no penalty.
See decision 17-3/2

 

[hovis]

Much obliged. That one left us all scratching our heads

 

[pbrown7582]

Despite your PP error he is acting on your behalf so its your penalty

 

[chrisd]

Despite your PP error he is acting on your behalf so its your penalty

Perfectly correct,so if you would kick yourself for such a basic error, under the rules, you're entitled to kick him!

 

[atticusfinch]

Much obliged. That one left us all scratching our heads

For future reference it's in rule 17.

 

[Snelly]

I like the local rule that they have at the RAC Club which is that you can have the flag in or out but never attended. This is designed to stop crowned holes and speed up play. It does both and in my view, is an excellent idea.

 

[rulefan]

I like the local rule that they have at the RAC Club which is that you can have the flag in or out but never attended. This is designed to stop crowned holes and speed up play. It does both and in my view, is an excellent idea.

It is of course an 'illegal' Local Rule.

Crowned holes are not caused by attended flagsticks. They are the result of the surrounds of a new hole not being 'tamped down' properly.

 

[Snelly]

It is of course an 'illegal' Local Rule.

Crowned holes are not caused by attended flagsticks. They are the result of the surrounds of a new hole not being 'tamped down' properly.

Why is it illegal?

I always thought that crowned holes are caused by golfers putting their leading foot too close to the hole when they are retrieving their ball from it.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

By saying 'not attending' the flag do you mean also that the flag isn't removed when the ball is putted from on the green?

 

[Fyldewhite]

Crowned holes are predominantly cased by footfall around the hole. Basically every player on the course every day will put all their weight on one foot about 12 inches away from each hole. If a hole is crowned immediately after being sunk then obviously it's not been done right but most times this is not the case. They start off OK then get worse over time. Made worse by soft greens, busy courses and not moving the holes enough.

Was always told to attend the flag at arms length but I'm sure this was to avoid spike marks close to the hole rather than crowning.

 

[duncan mackie]

Why is it illegal?

.

Because the Rules of Golf state that

17-1. Flagstick Attended, Removed or Held Up

Before making a stroke from anywhere on the course, the player may have the flagstick attended, removed or held up to indicate the position of the hole.

and

A Rule of Golf must not be waived by a Local Rule. However, if a Committee considers that local abnormal conditions interfere with the proper playing of the game to the extent that it is necessary to make a Local Rule that modifies the Rules of Golf, the Local Rule must be authorised..........

Rulefan is strongly suggesting that the R&A would not authorise such a LR; and I agree with that view.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I'm sure @snelly must know all this and that the RAC Club wouldn't have such a LR rule. Maybe the LR is that when attending the flag you don't stand holding it - but close enough to be deemed to be attending it and able to lean across and lift it out of the hole after the putt is struck.

 

[Snelly]

By saying 'not attending' the flag do you mean also that the flag isn't removed when the ball is putted from on the green?

Yes. It is a club rule. For any putt, you can have the flag in or out but not attended.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Yes. It is a club rule. For any putt, you can have the flag in or out but not attended.

But that's nuts! Surely a player must always have the right to have the flag attended when putting if he wants - especially if putting from distance.

 

[pbrown7582]

We have the same LR for bounce games in winter but rules of golf must be adhered to in comps.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

re: RAC club - Are we talking competition (qualifiers) or for casual golf?

 

[North Mimms]

We have the same LR for bounce games in winter but rules of golf must be adhered to in comps.

We are encouraged NOT to tend pin during winter outside competions

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

We have the same LR for bounce games in winter but rules of golf must be adhered to in comps.

But to attend the flag you don't have to actually be holding it - you can stand a little bit away from the flag and still be attending it - and so when putt is struck you just step in and remove flag. If you want to prevent damage by folk standing still holding the flag do it that way.

 

[Snelly]

I'm sure @snelly must know all this and that the RAC Club wouldn't have such a LR rule. Maybe the LR is that when attending the flag you don't stand holding it - but close enough to be deemed to be attending it and able to lean across and lift it out of the hole after the putt is struck.

No it isn't that. I have played there quite a bit with members. Just in or out.

And whilst I know the rules about flags etc, I did not know that a club local rule could be deemed as illegal though.

Quite interesting...