Tending Flag

[USER1999]

I hate having the pin in when I chip. It makes the hole smaller, and the ball can ping off it and go anwhere. I almost never hole anything that hits the pin. If I run the ball over the hole, then at least I get to see how it runs out on the line of my next putt. If it pings off sideways, I haven't got a clue.

 

[Monty_Brown]

Depending on what the flags are made of, the ball hitting it can often bounce further away, than hitting the back of the cup which tends to cushion it more and slow it down. That is my view based on observation, not scientific investigation, so other people may prove me wrong.

But I tend to like it out if it's a close one, and leave in if the chip's from a long way away.

The threshold for those distances is similar to the distances or conditions in which I'd have the pin attended or taken out when putting.

 

[rosecott]

Yes and no. The person tending does not need to remove the flag but if you hit the flag you will incur a penalty if he has left it in.

Not necessarily so.

If he deliberately fails to remove the flag in order to penalise the other player, the flag attendant is disqualfied.

If he fails to remove the flag in order to prevent the other player's ball from passing the hole, he loses the hole in matchplay and it's a 2-stroke penalty for both players in strokeplay.

 

[ADB]

Not necessarily so.

If he deliberately fails to remove the flag in order to penalise the other player, the flag attendant is disqualfied.

If he fails to remove the flag in order to prevent the other player's ball from passing the hole, he loses the hole in matchplay and it's a 2-stroke penalty for both players in strokeplay.

What happens if the person attending the pin tries to remove the flag but fails to do so in time and subsequently the players ball hits the pin? Attendees fault or player penalised?

 

[rosecott]

What happens if the person attending the pin tries to remove the flag but fails to do so in time and subsequently the players ball hits the pin? Attendees fault or player penalised?

Player only penalised.

 

[bladeplayer]

Player only penalised.

That would be hard to take if you had asked him/her to tend the flag wouldnt it ? just wondering how would it be the players fault ? if some one asks me to tend the flag i always lift the flag when i get to it & hold it loosely in the hole ..

 

[Dreamer2]

I'm learning rules of golf all the time , mostly the ones i remember are the ones i didn't know was a penalty like this thread,,so now i no :cheers:

 

[Scottjd1]

To be honest i didnt know that if the flag is tended, even if you are off the green, the instruction to tend means that the flagstick cannot be hit by the ball !

However my group generally play in that if we ask for it to be tended, as soon as the ball is struck the flag is removed so it would be unlikely to happen, good to know though !!

 

[chrisd]

Not necessarily so.

If he deliberately fails to remove the flag in order to penalise the other player, the flag attendant is disqualfied.

If he fails to remove the flag in order to prevent the other player's ball from passing the hole, he loses the hole in matchplay and it's a 2-stroke penalty for both players in strokeplay.

You havn't covered the other old chestnut - the player attending pull up the flagstick, the cup rises out of the ground stuck firm to the flagstick, and the ball hits the cup and, of course, the ball cannot drop in the hole?


Chris

 

[JustOne]

He also didn't cover the guy takes the flag out of the hole and throws it at the opponent like a javelin, I think that's as good as making the chip if it hits him

 

[Pants]

the player attending pull up the flagstick, the cup rises out of the ground stuck firm to the flagstick, and the ball hits the cup and, of course, the ball cannot drop in the hole?


Chris

This actually happened last year to a friend's wife in a county KO match against another club.

No-one, including the walking referee, knew the answer and they rang the R and A from the course. Iirc the reply was - if the flagstick and attached liner is moving at the time the ball struck then there is no penalty as it is treated as an "outside agency", the stroke is cancelled and the shot replayed. If the liner had stuck and the ball struck it then again no penalty but the next shot is played from where the ball comes to rest.

I think ....:mmm:

 

[MashieNiblick]

You havn't covered the other old chestnut - the player attending pull up the flagstick, the cup rises out of the ground stuck firm to the flagstick, and the ball hits the cup and, of course, the ball cannot drop in the hole?

This actually happened last year to a friend's wife in a county KO match against another club.

No-one, including the walking referee, knew the answer and they rang the R and A from the course. Iirc the reply was - if the flagstick and attached liner is moving at the time the ball struck then there is no penalty as it is treated as an "outside agency", the stroke is cancelled and the shot replayed. If the liner had stuck and the ball struck it then again no penalty but the next shot is played from where the ball comes to rest.

I think ....:mmm:

Spot on. This has come up before.

Decision 17/8 Ball Strikes Hole-Liner Pulled Out with Flagstick

"Q. A player played a stroke from the putting green. The ball struck the hole-liner, which had stuck to the bottom of the flagstick and had come out of the hole when the person attending the flagstick removed the flagstick. Is there any penalty?

A. No. A hole-liner is an outside agency. Accordingly, if the hole-liner was moving when the ball struck it, the stroke is cancelled and the ball must be replaced – Rule 19-1b. If the hole-liner was not moving, the ball must be played as it lies – Rule 19-1. In case of doubt, the ball must be played as it lies."

 

[richart]

As I understand, you can have the flag tended from the tee if you so wish.

Love to see you ask that in your fourball better ball at the weekend.

Do you have to attend the flag for someone when they are off the green ? I am not going to walk fifty yards up the course to attend the flag for some joker that is likely to thin it head height at me. Presumably you can have it attended when off the green if someone is prepared to do it ?

 

[rosecott]

You can decline to attend the flagstick.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Love to see you ask that in your fourball better ball at the weekend.

Do you have to attend the flag for someone when they are off the green ? I am not going to walk fifty yards up the course to attend the flag for some joker that is likely to thin it head height at me. Presumably you can have it attended when off the green if someone is prepared to do it ?

Those R&A guys have thought of that

Decision 17-1/2 Opponent or Fellow-Competitor Declines to Attend Flagstick

"Q. Does a player have any redress if he requests his opponent or a fellow-competitor to attend the flagstick for him and the opponent or fellow-competitor declines?

"A. No."

 

[richart]

Those R&A guys have thought of that

Decision 17-1/2 Opponent or Fellow-Competitor Declines to Attend Flagstick

"Q. Does a player have any redress if he requests his opponent or a fellow-competitor to attend the flagstick for him and the opponent or fellow-competitor declines?

"A. No."

Thanks for that:whoooes the rule not come with any choice words that you can direct at your opponent Mashie ?

 

[MashieNiblick]

Thanks for that:whoooes the rule not come with any choice words that you can direct at your opponent Mashie ?

Not as far as I am aware, although I believe there is an accepted convention in such cases that reference is made to other places that the flag stick may be inserted.