Should I get PGA qualified?

[Doon frae Troon]

In some ways it is sad that the PGA has such a stranglehold on coaching/advice.

I could name Harold Swash and Paul Trevillion as putting 'thinkers'
John Shade, Ronnie's father who was a greenkeeper and invented a whole new way of swinging with his square to square method.
Perhaps there is a case for the monopolies commission.

 

[JustOne]

In some ways it is sad that the PGA has such a stranglehold on coaching/advice.

I could name Harold Swash and Paul Trevillion as putting 'thinkers'
John Shade, Ronnie's father who was a greenkeeper and invented a whole new way of swinging with his square to square method.
Perhaps there is a case for the monopolies commission.

Indeed. There are many well respected golf coaches who were never PGA qualified, many of whom contributed to The Golfing Machine and is the 'bible' that many pros swear by. It just popped to mind.... do you happen to know if Mo Norman was a qualified instructor? I find it hard to believe he'd pass the test.

 

[Smiffy]

Why all the hatred and venom aimed at James? Yes, he has his faults (don't we all). I've met and played with the guy loads of times. I can honestly say that there aren't that many guys I have met who are as funny as him to spend some time with. Just as long as the conversation doesn't get on to sex....
He has had a lot of flak aimed at him over the years. But I've never seen him react badly before, resort to name calling, or lose his rag. He's one of the most laid back guys you can meet on here.

 

[Whee]

Why all the hatred and venom aimed at James? Yes, he has his faults (don't we all). I've met and played with the guy loads of times. I can honestly say that there aren't that many guys I have met who are as funny as him to spend some time with. Just as long as the conversation doesn't get on to sex....
He has had a lot of flak aimed at him over the years. But I've never seen him react badly before, resort to name calling, or lose his rag. He's one of the most laid back guys you can meet on here.

I'll echo your thoughts there Smiffy, although I don't know Just One, i've always found his posts to be helpful, well thought out and constructive - much the same way Bob's posts are.

 

[SocketRocket]

Sensible?

You left the forum to go slate me behind my back (like a child) on the other 'uber secret forum' where there's nothing but swearing and duplicate posts from here. I saw your posts backstabbing me, have a good laugh why don't you. Go to the swearing place... I'm sure you'll sell a lot of V-Easys from there!! I'm surprised to see you can even show your face back here.

Well said James.

 

[Mungoscorner]

Sensible?

You left the forum to go slate me behind my back (like a child) on the other 'uber secret forum' where there's nothing but swearing and duplicate posts from here. I saw your posts backstabbing me, have a good laugh why don't you. Go to the swearing place... I'm sure you'll sell a lot of V-Easys from there!! I'm surprised to see you can even show your face back here.

Insinuating that a forum member is here purely for financial gain ? (selling V easy's)
I do hope an infraction is forthcoming, as per forum rules.

 

[stevek1969]

With respect, not sure I agree with that. With football, in my experience unless you've played the game at a decent level ie. professionally / very high standard semi professionally, then a parent will not know more about coaching kids football than a qualified coach - there is much more to it than just kicking a ball around. And kids football is so much different to adults football. Lost count the number of times my parents have told me that I should be doing certain drills; or that their son "is a striker". I politely ignore them and just get on with the programme I have devised for their development as what the parents have been coached 20+ years ago is so out of date it's frightening.

I did mate playing semi pro or junior up here until illness curtailed me a 23, my family were pro's both dad and brother so i no my stuff, my dad taught us from 11 till 15 and all training was done with a ball each the only way it should be IMO ,to much is put on how big you are how far you kick it ,i listen to some of the teams he plays against and some of these other coaches are shocking.

I was in Holland a few years back meeting some friends and watch the way they do it ,all the age groups have a different size pitch and goals to suit and the emphasis on ball work is immense, i think we're missing a trick here.

My young lads mates play for a pro team and there on a diet at 14 years old now thats taking it a bit to far.

 

[User20205]

Insinuating that a forum member is here purely for financial gain ? (selling V easy's)
I do hope an infraction is forthcoming, as per forum rules.

We'll all be banned at this rate mate

Is what your doing the forum version of waving an imaginary yellow card??

 

[Deleted member 1418]

I did mate playing semi pro or junior up here until illness curtailed me a 23, my family were pro's both dad and brother so i no my stuff, my dad taught us from 11 till 15 and all training was done with a ball each the only way it should be IMO ,to much is put on how big you are how far you kick it ,i listen to some of the teams he plays against and some of these other coaches are shocking.

I was in Holland a few years back meeting some friends and watch the way they do it ,all the age groups have a different size pitch and goals to suit and the emphasis on ball work is immense, i think we're missing a trick here.

My young lads mates play for a pro team and there on a diet at 14 years old now thats taking it a bit to far.

Well that's ok then! :ears: All that you've mentioned above is exactly what is happening now in England with the guidelines put in place by the English FA. As I have said in previous posts on the subject, it's about 20 years too late but at least it's a start. Do you know what qualifications your kids coaches have? I cannot continue being an FA registered coach unless I undertake a certain amount of personal development each year.

 

[Mungoscorner]

We'll all be banned at this rate mate

Is what your doing the forum version of waving an imaginary yellow card??

I like consistency, "whats good for the goose is good for the gander".

Rules are rules.

 

[JustOne]

PS If i was getting my house rewired, I'd be looking for a electrical contractor registered with SELECT and if I was to need a plumber I'd be going to a SNIPEF registered company. So it follows that if I was needing lessons, I'd go to a PGA Pro.

I was just thinking about this and something entered my feeble little brain..... here goes....


If you employed a fully qualified plumber would you be happy if he came to fix your boiler and patched it up with a bit of cardboard tube and a paper clip? and says... "there, try that and see how it goes for a couple of weeks, it's not going to give you hot water but it should get warm which is better than you're getting right now"

 

[stevek1969]

Well that's ok then! :ears: All that you've mentioned above is exactly what is happening now in England with the guidelines put in place by the English FA. As I have said in previous posts on the subject, it's about 20 years too late but at least it's a start. Do you know what qualifications your kids coaches have? I cannot continue being an FA registered coach unless I undertake a certain amount of personal development each year.

Haha, in Scotland we're 25 years behind, they've just awarded Edinburgh with a cheaper version of what St Georges is . I think there level 3 trained ,last year they had a young lad doing it as well but he's been snapped up by Dundee FC to run there youth set up, i'm not sure if they do development classes every year .

Up here Dundee United for the past 4 years have doing scholarships with the school my young lad goes to ,training before and after school as well as academic work and i've seen some really good players there, do any of the English clubs do similar or do they all do it.

 

[Smiffy]

Insinuating that a forum member is here purely for financial gain ? (selling V easy's)
I do hope an infraction is forthcoming, as per forum rules.

Is there a forum rule for insinuating that a forum member is here for financial gain then??? That's a new one on me.
I hope there's not one for insinuating that a forum member is a compulsive liar

 

[Deleted member 1418]

Up here Dundee United for the past 4 years have doing scholarships with the school my young lad goes to ,training before and after school as well as academic work and i've seen some really good players there, do any of the English clubs do similar or do they all do it.

A number do - think it depends on the club and resources. I lost a lad to Watford Academy for this season (he is 9) and he has the option of being schooled as well as his football coaching. He's not allowed to play school football or for a local team, so I think that can only benefit him. Watford have excellent links with all the local clubs in their 'catchment area' so get a lot of boys to look at. My club also has about 15 boys in their development centre, as well as another 10 at Arsenal and Spurs development centres, so we as a club must be doing something right!!

Anyway, back to JustOne and his dilemma seeing as we've sorted kids football coaching in England and Scotland!!

 

[Birchy]

I was just thinking about this and something entered my feeble little brain..... here goes....


If you employed a fully qualified plumber would you be happy if he came to fix your boiler and patched it up with a bit of cardboard tube and a paper clip? and says... "there, try that and see how it goes for a couple of weeks, it's not going to give you hot water but it should get warm which is better than you're getting right now"

You seem to keep tarring fully qualified professionals with this quick fix jibe.

If you got fully qualified do you think your gonna get 12 or 8 hours etc with people who want a lesson? How much are you likely to teach them in 30 mins - an hour? Similar to a current PGA professional imo so how would you feel if people said you only give quick fixes?

Would i have a lesson with an unqualified person? Yes because i know plenty qualified people at things who are useless and many unqualified who are good. The qualification will get a lot more people giving you the chance to teach them though.

From my limited experience in golf i dont think theres that much money in it and would possibly become a less enjoyable grind for you if you took this on. Its a shame theres not many more ways into golf teaching as it seems there could be some good teachers out there being lost to the game.

 

[JustOne]

You seem to keep tarring fully qualified professionals with this quick fix jibe.

If you got fully qualified do you think your gonna get 12 or 8 hours etc with people who want a lesson? How much are you likely to teach them in 30 mins - an hour? Similar to a current PGA professional imo so how would you feel if people said you only give quick fixes?

Would i have a lesson with an unqualified person? Yes because i know plenty qualified people at things who are useless and many unqualified who are good. The qualification will get a lot more people giving you the chance to teach them though.

From my limited experience in golf i dont think theres that much money in it and would possibly become a less enjoyable grind for you if you took this on. Its a shame theres not many more ways into golf teaching as it seems there could be some good teachers out there being lost to the game.

(Despite your opinions of me that I've read recently elsewhere) I totally agree with your post. I'm not a great one for the quick-fix attitude but ultimately (and ironically) that's EXACTLY what most 'tips' on the forum actually are. What would I teach if I had 30 minutes? I'd teach IMPACT to every single person that didn't know it. If you make a golf swing and you don't know what impact is then where exactly are you trying to swing the club to? That would be like jumping in a taxi but not knowing your own destination.

I agree I might enjoy it less but that said I have ideas of things I would do... for example make a small brochure that covers the key aspects of a swing and give it to every person that I teach, so even in 30 minutes they'd walk away with something :thup:

 

[SocketRocket]

I like consistency, "whats good for the goose is good for the gander".

Rules are rules.

The alternative is to hang out in a corner of the school yard with a bunch of whispering, hard done by, adolesents that have nothing original to say and feed on each others bitterness.

 

[SocketRocket]

(Despite your opinions of me that I've read recently elsewhere) I totally agree with your post. I'm not a great one for the quick-fix attitude but ultimately (and ironically) that's EXACTLY what most 'tips' on the forum actually are. What would I teach if I had 30 minutes? I'd teach IMPACT to every single person that didn't know it. If you make a golf swing and you don't know what impact is then where exactly are you trying to swing the club to? That would be like jumping in a taxi but not knowing your own destination.

I agree I might enjoy it less but that said I have ideas of things I would do... for example make a small brochure that covers the key aspects of a swing and give it to every person that I teach, so even in 30 minutes they'd walk away with something :thup:

You have something there. I have never had a coach explain anything about impact conditions and how everthing else is just a means to this end.

 

[Hobbit]

I was just thinking about this and something entered my feeble little brain..... here goes....


If you employed a fully qualified plumber would you be happy if he came to fix your boiler and patched it up with a bit of cardboard tube and a paper clip? and says... "there, try that and see how it goes for a couple of weeks, it's not going to give you hot water but it should get warm which is better than you're getting right now"

So, do all fully qualified plumbers fix leaking pipes with cardboard and a paperclip? If they did, word of mouth would have seen them go out of business a long time ago.

But going back to your original question, that depends on why you might feel there would be a need to be qualified. If it was to make a living wage from coaching, I'd say the answer is yes. It may well be that a lesser qualification, either a Level 1 PGA or a WGT ticket might achieve that if all you want is the coaching side.

If you're looking for a wider acknowledgement, and credibility, for the one-2-one's you do, it's pretty clear from some of the responses in some of your threads that you need something formal.

But a (rhetorical) question back to you. If you'd been taught how to teach would you achieve more in less time by being able to get the message across sooner and clearer?

 

[Mungoscorner]

Is there a forum rule for insinuating that a forum member is here for financial gain then??? That's a new one on me.
I hope there's not one for insinuating that a forum member is a compulsive liar

•Defamation - 6 Points, Expires 90
Any intentional false communication, either written or spoken, that harms a person's reputation; decreases the respect, regard, or confidence in which a person is held; or induces disparaging, hostile, or disagreeable opinions or feelings against a person.

Were there a rule about being a compulsive liar, a few people would be banned.