Scotland Debate

[SocketRocket]

What Tory/UKIP coalition government ? - no such thing and it won't ever happen

And what makes you think that?

You have seen that a great number of people in the country want change and are dissatisfied with the way the EU affects the running of our country. Unless the Conservatives or Labour are prepared to face up to what the electorate wants and create policies that address these concerns then UKIP may well gain parliamentary seats in the next election and these seats could be the ones that decide who becomes the government. Just like the Lib Dems did last time.

To write them off is IMO a mistake.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

What are the figures from Salmond ?

Klazon......Nobody knows.

Negotiable of course.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

And what makes you think that?

You have seen that a great number of people in the country want change and are dissatisfied with the EU affects the way our country is run. Unless the Conservatives or Labour are prepared to face up to what the electorate wants and create policies that address these concerns then UKIP may well gain parliamentary seats in the next election and these seats could be the ones that decide who becomes the government. Just like the Lib Dems did last time.

Because I believe it was more a "protest" vote and when it came down to a GE UKIP will actually struggle to gain any seats let alone enough to get a chance of coalition - but we will find out next year I guess

 

[SocketRocket]

Because I believe it was more a "protest" vote and when it came down to a GE UKIP will actually struggle to gain any seats let alone enough to get a chance of coalition - but we will find out next year I guess

Dont underestimate the power of the quiet man voting against his life being changed without his permission.

 

[c1973]

Dont underestimate the power of the quiet man voting against his life being changed without his permission.

For a second there I thought Darth Vader had entered the debate. Tailed off a bit though.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It is if it's money to replicate infrastructure that we already have within the UK. i.e. if it's money that only needs to be spent if we go for independence and could otherwise have been spent on something entirely different.

Or if it's the cost of setting up an infrastructure, systems and services from scratch - which clearly Scotland wouldn't be doing.

 

[Adi2Dassler]

So the Whitehall statement on the set up costs for a new Scotland were base don London School of Economics data,yes?

Well, it would seem that the LSE contradict the spin applied to their numbers...

https://twitter.com/PJDunleavy

I wonder if this will get the same type of coverage from the MSM.....

 

[Val]

Exactly what I thought, complete non story.
It is a two way cost remember so when the percentages add up it will not be too much for Scotland.

I am beginning to lose faith in Treasury statements, they should be impartial at this time. Whiffs of desperation

Ok, why is it a non story?

Also where does this spare cash come from?

 

[FairwayDodger]

So the Whitehall statement on the set up costs for a new Scotland were base don London School of Economics data,yes?

Well, it would seem that the LSE contradict the spin applied to their numbers...

https://twitter.com/PJDunleavy

I wonder if this will get the same type of coverage from the MSM.....

It's behind a paywall...... so probably not! :ears:

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Ok, why is it a non story?

Also where does this spare cash come from?

There is always spare cash around, look how much of it the UK government spent on the Somerset levels this winter.
Non story as it was always going to happen if Scotland won independence.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Scottish independence: New claims on economic outcome


The UK and Scottish governments are vigorously arguing for their own projections of the consequences of independence

Contrasting claims about the costs and benefits of Scottish independence are to be put to voters.

The Scottish government will argue that independence could bring about an economic bonus worth £2,000 for each household.

The UK government will say that keeping the Union will ensure a dividend for everyone in Scotland.

Treasury ministers are preparing to publish their costing of the White Paper plans for independence.

The challenges it has identified for an independent Scotland include an ageing population, declining oil revenues and the potential for higher interest rates.

The Treasury analysis will be published by Chief Secretary to the Treasury Danny Alexander.

Mr Alexander told the BBC's Scotland 2014 programme: "One of the frustrations here is that the nationalist government has not set out any costs at all of setting up a new state - they seem to assume it's free.

"Just like they seem to assume that you can get all the oil out of the North Sea for free, just as they seem to think that they can get away with trying to bamboozle people to vote for independence on the basis of numbers that simply don't add up - on oil revenues, on set up costs, on tax and on spending."

The Scottish government has rejected the view that the costs of independence are greater than the benefits.

'Benefits of wealth'

First Minister Alex Salmond said: "The reality is Scotland is one of the wealthiest countries in the world, more prosperous per head than the UK, France and Japan, but we need the powers of independence to ensure that that wealth properly benefits everyone in our society."

The Scotland Office has said the paper will show "there is a significant benefit for each and every Scottish man, woman and child as part of the union".

The Scottish government has claimed that the Treasury calculations rest on a misinterpretation of research carried out by the London School of Economics (LSE).

LSE academic Patrick Dunleavy posted on his Twitter account: "UK Treasury press release on #Scotland costs of government badly misrepresents LSE research."

Mr Salmond added: "This is a devastating verdict on the Treasury's figures from one of the authors of the report they have been using to base their work on.

"And it totally undermines everything they have to say this week about the finances of an independent Scotland."

Mr Alexander said the figures on start-up costs were based on research by Professor Robert Young from Canada.

UK assets

The Scotland Office has questioned claims from the Scottish government that an independent Scotland would be entitled to a share of UK assets.

A spokesman said: "John Swinney now seems to have reduced his independence dream to an episode of Cash in the Attic.

"His financial plan for independence now hinges on how much he might be able to get for 'Scotland's share' of the UK Embassy in Tokyo or the new HMS Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier.

"In private, Mr Swinney told his Cabinet colleagues that it would cost £600m a year for an independent Scotland to set up one government department to collect tax. He should now tell everyone in Scotland what the total bill for independence would be."

 

[Old Skier]

There is always spare cash around

Sounds like a basis for Scotish economics. Not sure how wee eek is able to produce any further figures because until negotiations have started how does he know what assets are going to be passed on or what will be charged by RUK for services that he may wish to buy into.
I accept that the guppyment figures are most probably worst case.

On another point. It appears there are more Scots and Nigerians living south of the border and have chosen the high capacity ground of FULHAM to play a game of kiss ball. I presume the betting scam came to light when so much money went on Nigeria to lose.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

So Danny Boy has produced a report that is negative towards independence.

The fact that he will be unemployed if Scotland become independent does not see to have been considered.

 

[Old Skier]

So Danny Boy has produced a report that is negative towards independence.

The fact that he will be unemployed if Scotland become independent does not see to have been considered.

So once again the argument is that it's negative so it's wrong. Great strap line.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

So once again the argument is that it's negative so it's wrong. Great strap line.

Keep swallowing the 'yes minister' line if you wish. I don't buy it.

Everything that has come out of the UK treasury is negative towards an independent Scotland, do you not question that.

There are many reports that suggest Scotland will be richer outside of the UK

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Keep swallowing the 'yes minister' line if you wish. I don't buy it.

Everything that has come out of the UK treasury is negative towards an independent Scotland, do you not question that.

There are many reports that suggest Scotland will be richer outside of the UK

So because it's negative toward and independent Scotland it's wrong ?

Which reports suggest Scotland will be richer ? Who are they from and do they contain figures ?

 

[c1973]

Every report from the yes campaign is positive to an independent Scotland, do you not question that Doon?

 

[Adi2Dassler]

Everything that has come out of the UK treasury is negative towards an independent Scotland, do you not question that.

Every report from the yes campaign is positive to an independent Scotland, do you not question that Doon?

And here in lies the problem.Neither side are prepared to accept that the other lot might be right occasionally.

It's really quite small time thinking from both when it comes to nation building.

 

[c1973]

And here in lies the problem.Neither side are prepared to accept that the other lot might be right occasionally.

It's really quite small time thinking from both when it comes to nation building.

Now there's something I agree with.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

And here in lies the problem.Neither side are prepared to accept that the other lot might be right occasionally.

It's really quite small time thinking from both when it comes to nation building.

Maybe because it's not really expected to happen from either side and isn't being taken very serious by the majority ?