Roll Back Discussion

[Mel Smooth]

Irrelevant. The proposed MLR will only apply to elite golf - it will not apply to 99% of amateurs, including your 13yo. And even if it did, someone hitting the ball 200yds would not see any noticeable difference with a rolled-back ball - how could they when they wouldn't notice the difference in distance between a Titleist ProV1 and a Kirkland Signature.


If you just want to see guys smashing that ball anywhere with impunity, long drive contests are probably more your scene (rather than golf). However if you do actually want to watch golf, then something has to change to keep up - and it can't keep on being the courses.

And the players will decide what LIV do - not Feherty the clown trying to hype the product - and those that are in the majors aren't going to want to be adjusting to a different ball for the tournaments that really matter.

If you go back through the posts, you'll see I was responding to Backsticks' argument that the ball should be rolled back for everybody - I know the suggestion is to only bring it in as an option at some elite events - I still think it's a stupid idea - the courses are fine, the game is advancing, it's called progress.

 

[Backsticks]

If you go back through the posts, you'll see I was responding to Backsticks' argument that the ball should be rolled back for everybody - I know the suggestion is to only bring it in as an option at some elite events - I still think it's a stupid idea - the courses are fine, the game is advancing, it's called progress.

The feelings a 13 year old are irrelevant even in the hypothetical. I know the local rule wont apply to everyone yet, nor roll back as far as I wrote. The mistake was made 20 years ago. Its a pity. The authorities were asleep at the wheel. But this roll back is a step in the right direction.

Longer doesnt equal progress btw.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

The feelings a 13 year old are irrelevant even in the hypothetical. I know the local rule wont apply to everyone yet, nor roll back as far as I wrote. The mistake was made 20 years ago. Its a pity. The authorities were asleep at the wheel. But this roll back is a step in the right direction.

Longer doesnt equal progress btw.

Just as the feelings of anyone over the age of 60 are irrelevant then.

 

[Alan Clifford]

The simple answer to the pros whacking the ball miles is to move the bunkers on the courses they play. Put the obstacles where they will hit the ball. Simples.

And make the bunkers actual difficult hazards.

 

[Mel Smooth]

The feelings a 13 year old are irrelevant even in the hypothetical. I know the local rule wont apply to everyone yet, nor roll back as far as I wrote. The mistake was made 20 years ago. Its a pity. The authorities were asleep at the wheel. But this roll back is a step in the right direction.

Longer doesnt equal progress btw.

So when you play golf, you step on the first tee, pull out the driver, and hit it 50 yards less than you are capable do you? Of course longer is progress - the aim of golf is to get the ball in the hole as quickly as possible, the nearer you get to the hole the easier that becomes with the next shot. The whole game is built on distance gains through technological improvements, and has been since day 1.

You're views on the relevance of kids opinions are beyond embarrassing - but you're doing a good job of undermining your own credibility, so crack on...

 

[Backsticks]

So when you play golf, you step on the first tee, pull out the driver, and hit it 50 yards less than you are capable do you? Of course longer is progress - the aim of golf is to get the ball in the hole as quickly as possible, the nearer you get to the hole the easier that becomes with the next shot. The whole game is built on distance gains through technological improvements, and has been since day 1.

You are mixing two entirely different topics : whether the game of golf is better or worse for the distance the ball is hit, and, the influence of distance on determining ones score within a given a given set of rules.
Is this deliberate ? Or just misunderstanding on your part ?

 

[Deleted member 1147]

There have been loads of rollbacks of equipment over the years, and
Many didn’t get as much moaning as this one.
There was the driver roll back about 15 years ago, when the Callaway ERC was banned.
The wedge groove change
Different size balls
Etc etc

 

[Backsticks]

You're views on the relevance of kids opinions are beyond embarrassing - but you're doing a good job of undermining your own credibility, so crack on...

Kids opinions are most certainly irrelevant to this debate. Dont create a strawman argument here that I am knocking kids. But it takes adults to have a perspective on what is good for the overall game of golf, not 13 year olds. You are the one who brought one into the argument as your primary reason for the roll back being bad. You cant fault me for knocking that feeble one back at you.

 

[Backsticks]

There have been loads of rollbacks of equipment over the years, and
Many didn’t get as much moaning as this one.
There was the driver roll back about 15 years ago, when the Callaway ERC was banned.
The wedge groove change
Different size balls
Etc etc

The driver roll back wasnt really a roll back. It was a putting on of the brakes, at the status quo, before it got totally out of hand and everyone had 0.83+ drivers. I guess the regret now is that it wasnt a significant row back, maybe 0.8 COR or something. And we would be in this ball roll back mess.

 

[Mel Smooth]

You are mixing two entirely different topics : whether the game of golf is better or worse for the distance the ball is hit, and, the influence of distance on determining ones score within a given a given set of rules.
Is this deliberate ? Or just misunderstanding on your part ?

No I'm not, it's better to hit it as far as possible, and that is a fundamental part of the game. Always has been.

 

[IJames]

Yeah I can - I've got a 13 year old who wants to hit the ball as far as he possibly can, if I told him he was hitting it too far, and some old dudes are going to change the rules so that his drives drop below 200 yards, he'd have mixed emotions of disappointment, frustration, and resentment to the people that made those changes.

Actually, you'd be telling him rubbish - or perhaps even lying to him!

 

[Crow]

Yeah I can - I've got a 13 year old who wants to hit the ball as far as he possibly can, if I told him he was hitting it too far, and some old dudes are going to change the rules so that his drives drop below 200 yards, he'd have mixed emotions of disappointment, frustration, and resentment to the people that made those changes.


I'd feel exactly the same. I honestly do not give one of Augusta is getting overpowered, or if a few misty eyed people want to see Rory hitting a long iron into a green - it's a ridiculous notion that the entire game should regress because of a view of a very, very small minority. Anyway, it ain't happening on LIV, which is great news because if LIV stick two fingers up to the idea, the ball technology will remain in place to the mortals.

Even if the rollback applied to everyone, your son would still be able to hit the ball as far as he could.

The goalposts will have changed, but in a very short time a drive a 250 yards would get the wow factor that a drive of 300 does today, only now the golfer having hit a bullet down the middle will have a challenging second shot when playing a longer par 4 rather than a simple wedge.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

The current roll back would only affect those with SS of over 115.
Which would only affect about 4 players I know. Maybe 1 or 2 on here (Mendie probably being one of them)

 

[sweaty sock]

We'll get a little preview this week, the new tee on thirteen at augusta seems to now mean its a long iron in, alot of players, Dustin and Horschel included have already commented that its 100% a layup hole now as hitting a long iron in is not worth it...

If the result of a rollback means everyone plays the layup, then the hole becomes a simple drive, a simple second shot a simple wedge, and either 1 or 2 putts. Infinity more boring than currently and absolutely no seperation of the field.

So lets see how it plays this week, assuming they keep using the back tee...

 

[Deleted member 1147]

We'll get a little preview this week, the new tee on thirteen at augusta seems to now mean its a long iron in, alot of players, Dustin and Horschel included have already commented that its 100% a layup hole now as hitting a long iron in is not worth it...

If the result of a rollback means everyone plays the layup, then the hole becomes a simple drive, a simple second shot a simple wedge, and either 1 or 2 putts. Infinity more boring than currently and absolutely no seperation of the field.

So lets see how it plays this week, assuming they keep using the back tee...

Why can’t they hit long irons in? Faldo managed it in 1996.
Others did it in the Old days too.

 

[sweaty sock]

Why can’t they hit long irons in? Faldo managed it in 1996.
Others did it in the Old days too.

They can, they can hit driver off the deck in if they want, we'll know by Sunday if they do or not...

 

[garyinderry]

Monday practice rory hit a 5 iron off a hanging lie and tom kim hit a wood into 13.

I'm all for the change. The hole has been a gimmy for years. If everyone makes a birdie, no one makes a birdie.

How the hole is played will be dictated by the wind and softness of the greens.

 

[Imurg]

DJ reckons he'll be laying up all 4 days on 13.....

 

[Backsticks]

Playing it as a par 5 again is another way to put it.

Great. We have 13 as a par 5 again.
Or a risk reward longer iron/hybrid/7wood decision to go for it in two being the exception according to the player, tournament circumstances, and conditions. Not just an 8i for everyone. Which is what a par 4 is.

Without the distance technology escalation, there would have been no need to extend (by 85 yards now since 25 years ago).
We are back where we started.

 

[Depreston]

DJ reckons he'll be laying up all 4 days on 13.....

Tbf DJ probably hasn’t hit many 4/5 irons under any pressure in years and I’m not talking about him just playing LIV