Rant time - electric trolley batteries

Duncan , my battery usage would be similar to that of Chris , my thinking is that even if i had not used the battery i would not expect it to be in great condition after that amount of time . If people are using a trolley as much as you state then i think they have had their monies worth out of it . How many hours /cycles would you expect a battery to last ? .
If a car does 10,000 miles between servicing , some would do that in a month others may take 2 years ,
 
fundy said:
Geez, what is it with leccy trolley batteries. For the 3rd battery running, a few months after the warranty expires and my supposed 36 hole battery struggles to get to the turn, yep it has a 1/4 capacity maximum. Its as if they put a timer in them and they fail on request as soon as the warranty runs out!

As for Motocaddy and their customer service, its quite a while since I came across a retail company who treat their customers with complete and utter contempt, which in the current environment cant bode well for their long term success. This is the second time Ive had cause to have to use their customer services and thankfully will be the last as I will never be dealing with them again!


Ok rant over, any one make a decent recommendation for a replacement battery? Going to need a new charger too on all accounts? Think I asked this 15mths or so ago but is it worth going the lithium route?[/QUOTE ]
So you think you've got battery problems , check out the new BA 787 airbus lithium ion battery thats overheating and going on fire costing millions now that a problem
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andycap said:
Duncan , my battery usage would be similar to that of Chris , my thinking is that even if i had not used the battery i would not expect it to be in great condition after that amount of time . If people are using a trolley as much as you state then i think they have had their monies worth out of it . How many hours /cycles would you expect a battery to last ? .
If a car does 10,000 miles between servicing , some would do that in a month others may take 2 years ,
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with lead acid batteries it's a function of how often they are discharged, how far and how long they are left before being fully charged again.

in a car, in regular use, they aren't really discharged at all (although the clock and alarm system in one of mine takes it's toll when it's not used for a few weeks!). On a boat the engine start battery will normally outlast the domestic batteries by about 3:1 timewise for the same reason.
 
Mark_G said:
As Duncan says, the problem is the technology of lead acid batteries is not suited to deep discharge, lithium is a much better choice. I used to race radio controlled cars, and have used nicads, nimhs, and lithium batteries doing unspeakable things with charge current and discharge rates. The lithium batteries were superb, with dedicated charging routines they had virtually no noticeable drop off in performance, if I could afford it I would definitely plump for lithium. I have recently been looking for golf trolley batteries myself and my normal suppliers for batteries have stopped supplying golf trolley batteries as, in their words, "they are more trouble than they are worth"
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I too was involved with RC model cars for many years... I believe that to prolong the life of a battery you need to adopt a proper maintenance schedule and use a decent quality charger... Meaning, most probably not the one supplied... Others, of course, would advise differently...
 
Maybe I've been lucky, but my Powakaddy battery has been pretty good. Even with the course being a mudbath it doesn't seem to struggle with power loss towards the end of the round.

Mines lives on it's charger in the kitchen. Not sure if keeping it warm helps.
 
MegaSteve said:
I too was involved with RC model cars for many years... I believe that to prolong the life of a battery you need to adopt a proper maintenance schedule and use a decent quality charger... Meaning, most probably not the one supplied... Others, of course, would advise differently...
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Well of course you get what you pay for, I used two £300 chargers, but that was more for ultimate power. My 12 volt heavy duty supply batteries used to last 18 months before they were replaced and they were charged on a £400 charger. A high quality charger will get the best out of a battery but letting a lead acid battery discharge past its critical point will permanently reduce a batteries capacity.
 
duncan mackie said:
the real problem is that lead acid batteries are entirely the wrong solution in this application, for anything but price - and we buy on price.

not only do they have a nominal cycle usage but they dislike actually being discharged lower than about 80%. Great storage solution, poor discharge cycle. a 36 used for 18 each time will do better - but it's heavier etc there are some better lead acid technilogies out there, but I don't know about their availability in golf sized units (boats and lorries but not golf carts!)

you can help by charging straight away - and minutes matter, days can be disaster etc top range charging systems will also help. storing in a 'nice' environment helps too.

lithium is more appropriate but if used heavily it's probably not going to deliver a great deal more in terms of total cycle - just easier to handle.
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Don’t know where you get that 80% information from. Lead acid batteries for golf trolleys (deep cycle battery) are designed to be near fully discharged but they don’t have the same initial energy like a car battery. Car batteries for instance are designed for a big discharge in short bursts, like starting the car. The way they are made up, the lead plate thickness and such like, determine how the battery behaves and how it can charge and discharge.

I could go into more but this pops up every now and then. My job in R&D means many batteries off all types pass through my hands for testing. Even battery manufacturers take my data for reference.

If you play lots of golf then expect to change your battery every 18 months or so. If you have a tour bag with lots of gear then it will drain the battery more…..no news there. Run it through rough and it will draw much more from the battery and the motor will draw much more current to drive it. Run your trolley round a soft, wet courses will do the same.

Batteries don’t last for ever…………Charge them up as soon as you get home. Don’t……don’t keep them on charge once they are fully charged. Once charged a good battery will not loose anything from one week to the next. If it does, there is something wrong. Don’t get me wrong, you can keep it on charge if you want, but you should not need to.

All this depends on how much golf you play, what kind of course, course conditions, bag size weight and such like.
 
Not read the complete thread but I would never purchase anything from Motocaddy ever again. This is my experience of their customer services

Purchased an S1 trolley. While still in the warranty my battery over charged and swelled like a balloon, so that would either be the battery or the Mototcaddy charger. I had registered my product online with them and sent in the warranty card. When I contacted them about my problem I got told that unless I had my receipt from American Golf, they were not prepared to do anything about it. So what is the point in sending in the warranty card and registering the product online then? I got my mates old battery off him after he upgraded to a motocaddy 36 holer, but that struggles if you try 2 rounds over a demanding course, that bad that it is almost dead after about 27 holes.

So what do I do now then? By a lithium battery for £300 that will still not last 2 rounds if needed, but will definitely do 1 with no bother. Or do i save all the hassle of charging batteries and having to remember to put it on the night before playing and get a good quality push trolley?
 
Tommo21 said:
Don’t……don’t keep them on charge once they are fully charged. Once charged a good battery will not loose anything from one week to the next. If it does, there is something wrong. Don’t get me wrong, you can keep it on charge if you want, but you should not need to.
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My powakaddy instructions state that leaving the battery on charge is the thing to do if it's not being used for a couple of weeks. Similarly, if I'm not going to use my car for a few weeks I put it in the garage on a trickle charger.
 
Tommo, are you not talking about a battery in the perfect world, one that has no losses and can hold it's charge for weeks on end. The reality of the situation is that we do not live in a perfect world and leaving the batteries on trickle charge is better for them than allowing them to part discharge then charge them up and I know that from my job. Also saying that you should expect to change your battery every 18 months is a load of rubbish, maybe 30 months is more like it. Ok maybe 18 months if you are playing a lot of golf somewhere that is is up the side of a hill, but hat is not the average battery usage. The trolley companies are not going to take a battery that is only expected to last 18 months on average and give it a 2 year warranty. If this is was the case then they would lose a fortune from having to give out free batteries all the time. I would definitely expect to be changing a battery after the 2 to 2 1/2 year mark with normal usage, so if your battery does last you 3 then you have done well out of it.

But sod all of that, I am off to buy a Stewart Z3. I am fed up with the hassle of a battery trolley.
 
MadAdey said:
Tommo, are you not talking about a battery in the perfect world, one that has no losses and can hold it's charge for weeks on end. The reality of the situation is that we do not live in a perfect world and leaving the batteries on trickle charge is better for them than allowing them to part discharge then charge them up and I know that from my job. Also saying that you should expect to change your battery every 18 months is a load of rubbish, maybe 30 months is more like it. Ok maybe 18 months if you are playing a lot of golf somewhere that is is up the side of a hill, but hat is not the average battery usage. The trolley companies are not going to take a battery that is only expected to last 18 months on average and give it a 2 year warranty. If this is was the case then they would lose a fortune from having to give out free batteries all the time. I would definitely expect to be changing a battery after the 2 to 2 1/2 year mark with normal usage, so if your battery does last you 3 then you have done well out of it.

But sod all of that, I am off to buy a Stewart Z3. I am fed up with the hassle of a battery trolley.
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Who said anything about a perfect world, where did that come from…..In fact I gave lots of reasons why a battery can run down quicker. If you play a lot of golf, I play 5 rounds a week, with a tour bag that more and more are using then you wont get 3 years.

Who said anything about part discharge, then charge again…..You did not me.

I said, if you charge it fully then it should be fine for the next round..absoulutly fine. If a good lead acid battery losses voltage in a week then it’s knackered…………full stop. I have lead acid batteries, golf trolley types, that will not loose anymore than 0.5 of a volt in 6 months.

Golf trolley companies may well give you 2 years warranty and batteries do go before then. That’s why we’re talking about it now…….are we not.
 
The only trolley batteries Ive seen with more than a 12 month warranty are the newer lithium ones which come with 2 yrs plus part discount against a future battery if fail in yrs 3,4 or 5.

What battery do you use/recommend Tommo? The more I read the more it seems the cheapest option with a 12 mth guarantee makes sense. Last time I bought one of the dearest yet made no difference!
 
StrangelyBrown said:
My powakaddy instructions state that leaving the battery on charge is the thing to do if it's not being used for a couple of weeks. Similarly, if I'm not going to use my car for a few weeks I put it in the garage on a trickle charger.
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Thats what they want you to do..........Car batteries, like I said before are not the same and are made different. Cars have stuff running when the car is not in use, so the battery will loose a little voltage over a few weeks.

Here is the best tip for you guys, get a little multimeter or voltmeter, they cost very little these days. Charge your battery fully then check the voltage after about 15 mins as it tends to die back a little after disconnection. Check it again the next day. If it's lost voltage then something is wrong.

That way you guys will get to know what your battery is doing.
 
Tommo21 said:
Who said anything about a perfect world, where did that come from…..In fact I gave lots of reasons why a battery can run down quicker. If you play a lot of golf, I play 5 rounds a week, with a tour bag that more and more are using then you wont get 3 years.

Who said anything about part discharge, then charge again…..You did not me.

I said, if you charge it fully then it should be fine for the next round..absoulutly fine. If a good lead acid battery losses voltage in a week then it’s knackered…………full stop. I have lead acid batteries, golf trolley types, that will not loose anymore than 0.5 of a volt in 6 months.

Golf trolley companies may well give you 2 years warranty and batteries do go before then. That’s why we’re talking about it now…….are we not.
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I would love to know what these miracle batteries are that you own. As a rechargeable battery will lose charge through a process of the chemical reaction that is happening inside it. I have placed a quote below from a leading battery manufacturer to back this up:

DO remember to recharge your battery a few hours before you want to use it. Rechargeable batteries lose a percentage of their charge each day when left off the charger.


 
fundy said:
The only trolley batteries Ive seen with more than a 12 month warranty are the newer lithium ones which come with 2 yrs plus part discount against a future battery if fail in yrs 3,4 or 5.

What battery do you use/recommend Tommo? The more I read the more it seems the cheapest option with a 12 mth guarantee makes sense. Last time I bought one of the dearest yet made no difference!
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Cant recommend any mate and I’ll tell you why. Most trolley makers will have more than one supplier/make of battery. If they only have one then it’s folly to put their eggs in one basket. Most will change suppliers from time to time and sometimes the same make of battery can be made in different countries with different quality results. Some batteries are the same with different names.

Not a good answer eh.
 
Tommo21 said:
Cant recommend any mate and I’ll tell you why. Most trolley makers will have more than one supplier/make of battery. If they only have one then it’s folly to put their eggs in one basket. Most will change suppliers from time to time and sometimes the same make of battery can be made in different countries with different quality results. Some batteries are the same with different names.

Not a good answer eh.
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Nope not really lol.

The problem is everyone can add to the criticism, not one person seems to be able to tell me which battery to go and buy, not the best of adverts for the industry. Think im gonna go the cheap and cheerful route so i dont feel hard done by when its internal alarm goes off and it self destroys straight after the warranty runs out :p
 
In my experience of using leisure batteries Numax or Exide were as good as any [for the price]... If you had plenty to spend then Optima was considered a good option... Not sure if any of these do models to suit golf trollies...

I used to use chargers that had a maintenance cycle option... Which, I believe, worked for me... But as I said earlier others will advise different... Wasn't averse either, to drain out the acid and refill with new... Felt it gave me a few extra cycles but was hardly a scientific test...
 
fundy said:
Nope not really lol.

The problem is everyone can add to the criticism, not one person seems to be able to tell me which battery to go and buy, not the best of adverts for the industry. Think im gonna go the cheap and cheerful route so i dont feel hard done by when its internal alarm goes off and it self destroys straight after the warranty runs out :p
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As someone said a couple of pages back, you should always buy lithium, but unfortunately not everyone can afford to.

And you should buy Motocaddy, they are the biggest for a reason, and that reason is their trollies are the most reliable on the market right now.

Yes the OP has had issues, but for every OP, there are 20 dis-satisfied Powakaddy customers.
 
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