Questions about the WHS

[Leslie Nielson]

Hi I'm learning about the WHS and need some help

This example of a casual round of strokeplay is what I believe to be true

Par 72 course

Player A: Course Handicap 5

Player B: Course Handicap 10

Player A: Gross score 77. Net score 72 or par

Player B: Gross score 81. Net score 71 or -1

Player B wins the match

The Adjusted Gross Scores are needed to calculate Score Differentials and have nothing to do with who wins

Is this information correct? Please correct me if it's not

Thanks

 

[bobmac]

As someone who has played golf for about 50 years, got a degree in golf, 15 years as a professional and the rest mostly Cat I, I have no idea.
A genius will be along shortly to explain it to you.

 

[BubbaP]

No expert, but will have a punt.

The competition handicaps would remain at 5 & 10

Assuming the format is regular strokeplay (aka medal play), the yes:
Net 71 beats net 72.

Oh, and par is irrelevant ?

PS what of the world was the comp in?

 

[Val]

Hi I'm learning about the WHS and need some help

This example of a casual round of strokeplay is what I believe to be true

Par 72 course

Player A: Course Handicap 5

Player B: Course Handicap 10

Player A: Gross score 77. Net score 72 or par

Player B: Gross score 81. Net score 71 or -1

Player B wins the match

The Adjusted Gross Scores are needed to calculate Score Differentials and have nothing to do with who wins

Is this information correct? Please correct me if it's not

Thanks

Net 71 beats net 72. Any adjustments are for handicapping and nothing to do with the result.

I think ?

 

[rulefan]

The Adjusted Gross Scores are needed to calculate Score Differentials and have nothing to do with who wins

Is this information correct? Please correct me if it's not

Thanks

The term Score Differential is only used for WHS handicap calculations and is based on the adjusted gross score in strokeplay (ie medal or stableford)..

However, you start by saying it is strokeplay but end by saying it was a match. Which was it, no of holes won or total score (net or gross)? The latter I guess.

 

[jim8flog]

Hi I'm learning about the WHS and need some help

This example of a casual round of strokeplay is what I believe to be true

Par 72 course

Player A: Course Handicap 5

Player B: Course Handicap 10

Player A: Gross score 77. Net score 72 or par

Player B: Gross score 81. Net score 71 or -1

Player B wins the match

The Adjusted Gross Scores are needed to calculate Score Differentials and have nothing to do with who wins

Is this information correct? Please correct me if it's not

Thanks

The scores would only count for handicapping if they had preregistered for that purpose prior to commencing the round. If they had not then score differentials are irrelevant.

 

[Voyager EMH]

Correct. Agree with all above comments.
The two players appear to be having an individual strokeplay game where the lowest nett wins.

However, you have rounded course handicaps to a whole number. That is OK unless you are in Scotland.
In Scotland, either player might have a Playing Handicap one shot lower than course handicap, depending on what their unrounded course handicaps are.
This could affect the final result of the game.

Unless I've got it all round me neck, again.

 

[nickjdavis]

The two players appear to be having an individual strokeplay game where the lowest nett wins.

.

In which case surely the 95% allowance needs to be applied to the Course Handicap's as the format is singles strokeplay? (Its almost like a medal comp with only two players in it).

(It actually doesn't make any difference in this example as both players would still have playing handicaps of 5 and 10)

 

[Voyager EMH]

In which case surely the 95% allowance needs to be applied to the Course Handicap's as the format is singles strokeplay? (Its almost like a medal comp with only two players in it).

(It actually doesn't make any difference in this example as both players would still have playing handicaps of 5 and 10)

True, but could be different in Scotland.

It might be different in Scotland if CH of Player A is 5.3 and CH of Player B is 9.6.
Player A will have a PH of 5 (the same)
Player B's PH would then be 9 (95% of 9.6 = 9.12 then rounded to 9)
The match would then be a tie.
In Scotland, Course Handicap is not rounded to a whole number in the process of Playing Handicap calculation. I play in England, but I have come to appreciate the Scottish Playing Handicap calculation for individual strokeplay, as it eliminates the disproportionate "lump" of players with a PH of ten.

 

[nickjdavis]

True, but could be different in Scotland.

It might be different in Scotland if CH of Player A is 5.3 and CH of Player B is 9.6.
Player A will have a PH of 5 (the same)
Player B's PH would then be 9 (95% of 9.6 = 9.12 then rounded to 9)
The match would then be a tie.
In Scotland, Course Handicap is not rounded to a whole number in the process of Playing Handicap calculation. I play in England, but I have come to appreciate the Scottish Playing Handicap calculation for individual strokeplay, as it eliminates the disproportionate "lump" of players with a PH of ten.

That's fair enough...the OP just needs to be aware that its not the Course Handicaps that are use to calculate nett scores and depending on where he is the calculation method for arriving at the Playing Handicap might vary....I think we've covered it between us!!!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

The scores would only count for handicapping if they had preregistered for that purpose prior to commencing the round. If they had not then score differentials are irrelevant.

Just picking up this old thread.

I didn’t pre-register my casual round away from home at Hollinwell today. Are there any circumstances under which my round could be included in my handicap record. I putted out every hole and me and my partner played strictly to the rules at all times. If it makes any difference (though not sure why it might) my partner today was my club head pro. Btw - I haven‘t asked him, and I don’t expect that I will be able to get the round included… but I thought I’d ask - just in case.

 

[nickjdavis]

No....otherwise everyone would be picking and choosing which general play rounds they decide to have included in their record.

Its the whole point of preregistering, of which I am sure you are aware.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

No....otherwise everyone would be picking and choosing which general play rounds they decide to have included in their record.

Its the whole point of preregistering, of which I am sure you are aware.

I know…absolutely - just that being keen to get my H/I down I do a knock yesterday that would bring my H/I down by 0.7…and I rather fancied that cut. I was wondering if there were any extraordinary contexts or circumstances when it was possible. No matter.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I know…absolutely - just that being keen to get my H/I down I do a knock yesterday that would bring my H/I down by 0.7…and I rather fancied that cut. I was wondering if there were any extraordinary contexts or circumstances when it was possible. No matter.

Why didn’t you pre register then ?‍

 

[jim8flog]

Just picking up this old thread.

I didn’t pre-register my casual round away from home at Hollinwell today. Are there any circumstances under which my round could be included in my handicap record. I putted out every hole and me and my partner played strictly to the rules at all times. If it makes any difference (though not sure why it might) my partner today was my club head pro. Btw - I haven‘t asked him, and I don’t expect that I will be able to get the round included… but I thought I’d ask - just in case.

As per NickjDavis

If it had been a bad round would you also be trying to get it added?

 

[Swango1980]

I know…absolutely - just that being keen to get my H/I down I do a knock yesterday that would bring my H/I down by 0.7…and I rather fancied that cut. I was wondering if there were any extraordinary contexts or circumstances when it was possible. No matter.

That is exactly why you need to pre-register (there isn't a post-register option). You are admitting you are happy to pick and choose your rounds as to what goes to your handicap record. It may appear more "honourable" to want handicap cuts than increases. However, there are plenty of very low handicappers who desperately want to keep a low handicap, and would happily just submit their best scores if they had the chance. Or, any golfer who needs a low enough handicap to qualify for a particular event / team.

Furthermore, if you just submitted these good scores when you had them, your handicap would be too low. This could, in principle, have an impact on the PCC calculation (although hard to know, as no one knows how it works and it rarely seems to change anyway).

 

[IanM]

There is a "post round" option!! We tested this recently on the Wales golf app. Might not be same in England or Scotland.

A 9 hole scorecard was created after the round. It makes you wait an hour before you can enter and confirm the scorecard. Score was accepted without issue. For the record, the score entered was legitimately played except for the lack of preregistration.

So, if you have a mate who doesn't care, you could potentially key whatever you like!

Unless clubs check for lots of away general play cards, (not sure if this gets flagged anywhere) this is easy to abuse. You don't even need to leave your house if you are close enough to the course!

Mind you, I remember getting castigated for suggesting this as a risk when it was launched.

 

[Swango1980]

There is a "post round" option!! We tested this recently on the Wales golf app. Might not be same in England or Scotland.

A 9 hole scorecard was created after the round. It makes you wait an hour before you can enter and confirm the scorecard. Score was accepted without issue. For the record, the score entered was legitimately played except for the lack of preregistration.

So, if you have a mate who doesn't care, you could potentially key whatever you like!

Unless clubs check for lots of away general play cards, (not sure if this gets flagged anywhere) this is easy to abuse. You don't even need to leave your house if you are close enough to the course!

Mind you, I remember getting castigated for suggesting this as a risk when it was launched.

Of course, there are ways in which golfers can manipulate the system. The technology doesn't know exactly when a golfer teed off. There is a delay in the software between pre-registration and score entry to effectively discourage golfers from cheating the system. However, if they really really wanted to, they could do so (or simply go out the following day, pre-register, and then enter the previous days score afterwards).

The actions above would warrant disciplinary action by the Committee (warning first in case the golfer was ignorant that this really isn't acceptable, and any harder punishments thereafter). Whether or not this type of behaviour is easily identified by the Committee, or whether they are inclined to act at all, is another matter. I have already been told, word of mouth, that there are several golfers at my club (regular golfers that play in a big group in non-competition days) who are somehow able submit their poor scores from that social golf, but never submit the good ones (they play for a lot of money, but don't want the good days to reduce their handicap). I do not know the details, but if true then it is still clearly easy for golfers to cheat the system, and I wonder how many club Committees genuinely have volunteers that regularly check for this and try and stamp it out?

 

[wjemather]

There is a "post round" option!! We tested this recently on the Wales golf app. Might not be same in England or Scotland.

A 9 hole scorecard was created after the round. It makes you wait an hour before you can enter and confirm the scorecard. Score was accepted without issue. For the record, the score entered was legitimately played except for the lack of preregistration.

So, if you have a mate who doesn't care, you could potentially key whatever you like!

Unless clubs check for lots of away general play cards, (not sure if this gets flagged anywhere) this is easy to abuse. You don't even need to leave your house if you are close enough to the course!

Mind you, I remember getting castigated for suggesting this as a risk when it was launched.

As you say, such practice requires an equally unscrupulous accomplice. It's no different from filing a fictitious score without actually playing. Just like competitions, it is not possible for a member of the committee to witness every round submitted or every stroke played, so trust is put in the players. An extremely small minority will abuse that trust but it doesn't mean the system is flawed, and any "fix" would make the system unworkable.