Provision for local rule?

USER1999

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We have a private Tarmac road, leading from the car park out to the 10th tee. It runs parallel to the 18th fairway. It's only in play if you push your second shot out to the right, but it's not uncommon for balls to hit the road, and ping off it onto the practice chipping area. This is still in play, and not OB. The 18th is a par five, which dog legs right to left, so you do need to be down the right hand side, near the road to get the best shot in.

If your ball comes to rest on the road, you get a free drop off it.

If the road interferes with your stance, you get a free drop away from it.

If your ball does the tin cup thing, and bounces 4 times down the road, adding a hundred yards or more to your shot, you can end up OB in the car park. I've done this 3 times this year, twice in comps. Then it's reload under penalty, and play the shot again, despite it not really being that bad a shot. A yard either way, and it would be fine.

Is there any way you can have a local rule where by a shot that hits the road can be replayed with out penalty?
 
I can't see any way of allowing that. The roadway is an outside agency and however the ball deflects from it or wherever your ball bounces to is a rub of the green. Are you looking to make it more equitable and have the same outcome for everyone regardless of whether their ball is over the road but playable from the practice ground or, after a wild bounce, OB in the car park? Then make the road and beyond, (or just beyond the road) including the practice ground, OOB. That makes the outcome the same for everyone.
 
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Not a fan of internal OB. There's no advantage gained from being over the other side of the road, so no real need.

I'm thinking of it more like the local rules you get with power cables, where you get the option of replaying the shot without penalty if you hit the cable.

Yes, its rub of the green etc, but one shot can clip the road and be ok, and another can be a disaster.

I hit a 370 yard 5 iron there last year, when I was meant to be playing it safe!
 
Not a fan of internal OB. There's no advantage gained from being over the other side of the road, so no real need.

I'm thinking of it more like the local rules you get with power cables, where you get the option of replaying the shot without penalty if you hit the cable.

Yes, its rub of the green etc, but one shot can clip the road and be ok, and another can be a disaster.

I hit a 370 yard 5 iron there last year, when I was meant to be playing it safe!

I think you are contradicting yourself. You say there is no need for OOB - which would make the outcome of bounces off the road the same for everyone, but complain about the inequity of bounces off the road. :confused:

The difference between the road and a power cable is that there is a Decision that specifically authorises a local rule (33-8/13) for hitting a power line, but there isn't a Decision allowing a similar one for hitting the road. And I reckon that is because a power line crossing a hole can deflect a perfectly good straight shot whereas when your ball hits a road to the side of the hole, it is not a perfectly good straight shot but a squinty one. Getting to replay a good shot that hits power line = fairness; getting to replay bad shot that bounces off a roadway = a mulligan. The Rules don't offer mulligans. :)
 
we have that at our place, but its not an option, if you hit, you must reload, no matter where the ball ends up.

Power lines are normally compulsory reload - no penalty.

I'd suggest OB would be more appropriate. Though that doesn't actually help the danger element, merely the 'equitable result'. It does seem like an area fraught with danger - a road to 10 where balls from 18 are likely to land - and then ping into the car-park - doesn't seem a safe place to be!

Time for SiLH to organise a Risk Assessment?
 
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Does making some where OB make it safer?

To get a ball into the carpark requires roughly 4 huge bounces down the road, straight ones too. It should be ridiculously hard to achieve. I'm just good at it.

Depending on your drive, it's often a result of not getting a few yards of draw with the second shot. It's not a wild slice or anything.
 
Does making some where OB make it safer?

To get a ball into the carpark requires roughly 4 huge bounces down the road, straight ones too. It should be ridiculously hard to achieve. I'm just good at it.

Depending on your drive, it's often a result of not getting a few yards of draw with the second shot. It's not a wild slice or anything.

Replaying without penalty doesn't make anything safer either, which was your original suggestion.

I didn't realise that safety was the main concern?
 
So am I reading this right ?

You want a local rule in place for when you hit a poor shot and it bounces on the road then into the car park meaning it has gone out of bounds ?

What next ? Local rule allowing someone to play it again when it goes into a pond ?

Surely the best thing to do is the simple thing - don't hit it onto the road
 
As I keep saying, it is very difficult to hit it into the car park. It requires about 4 to 5 bounces, on a curving single track road, over a distance of about 140 yards. Most similar shots will not be punished in this way, just the complete flukes.

If you ever played the hole, you would see that it is not necessarily a bad shot that this happens to.

Making every where else OB is not the answer, it would just make an already narrow and tricky closing hole even harder.

Clearly there can be no local rule, so nothing will change, but it is not much fun when it happens to stuff up the end of your card. Especially when others get away with it.
 
Sorry but that's the nature of golf - if you land on a path and get an unlucky bounce well I sorry but don't hit it towards the path - harsh I know.

You should be thankful that it isn't OOB. The 18th at Wrag Barn has a path going up the right of the hole but it's classed as OOB
 
As I keep saying, it is very difficult to hit it into the car park. It requires about 4 to 5 bounces, on a curving single track road, over a distance of about 140 yards. Most similar shots will not be punished in this way, just the complete flukes.

If you ever played the hole, you would see that it is not necessarily a bad shot that this happens to.

Making every where else OB is not the answer, it would just make an already narrow and tricky closing hole even harder.

Clearly there can be no local rule, so nothing will change, but it is not much fun when it happens to stuff up the end of your card. Especially when others get away with it.

Maybe you could start a campaign to abolish "rub of the green".
 
Power lines are normally compulsory reload - no penalty.

I'd suggest OB would be more appropriate. Though that doesn't actually help the danger element, merely the 'equitable result'. It does seem like an area fraught with danger - a road to 10 where balls from 18 are likely to land - and then ping into the car-park - doesn't seem a safe place to be!

Time for SiLH to organise a Risk Assessment?

Correct assessment that there is such as a requirement in this sitution.

Strikes me that if you hit the road and go OoB then tough - you shouldn't have hit your shot there. If you clear the road and end up in the practice area and that IS NOT OoB then fortunate. However how can a practice area NOT be OOB? Any numbskull of a Risk Manager will tell you that you don't want folk playing into or from a practice ground - besides - it's a practice ground - not a play ground.

But here's the clincher for me

The 18th is a par five, which dog legs right to left, so you do need to be down the right hand side, near the road to get the best shot in

Each player decides their own strategy for a hole - and that will include a risk assessment :) In this case no player HAS to play down the RHS - especially as it is a par 5 (what is the SI btw) - as there is a risk of OOB. If you choose to take that risk you chooose to accept any outcome. Your choice.
 
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When you say "best shot in" I assume you are talking about going for it in 2? If so, it's a par 5, you aren't supposed to hit it in 2. Take less club off the tee and lay up.
 
When you say "best shot in" I assume you are talking about going for it in 2? If so, it's a par 5, you aren't supposed to hit it in 2. Take less club off the tee and lay up.

Ah @HawkeyeMS - are we getting to the nub of the matter. The issue isn't actually any 'unfairness' about the hole layout, road proximity etc - it's that the layout puts at risk a player's ability to have a go at getting up in two. And why I asked about the SI. Play the hole as it is presented and given any stroke you may have through stroke index. Proximity of the road and the risk it presents may well mean that the SI for the hole is lower than it might oterhwise have been.
 
The proximity of the road to the fairway landing zone and the possible consequences of any bounce would be taken account of in the rating process.

The SI would depend on whether the club was using 'match play' or 'difficulty' criteria.
In either case it is the same for all.

If a bogey player can't reach it, that is where slope will eventually come in.
 
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