Outside influence?

Canfordhacker

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This happened to my group today in a comp.

My group drove up the par 5 6th. There is water from the tee down the left for c 150 yards, which also separates the 6th from the 7th, which comes back down the other way. My FC Player A's drive we had clearly seen bounce and roll down the left side of our fairway. Whilst looking for FC Player B's ball in the water short and left of A's ball, another ball trundled towards us on our fairway. turns out it was Player C, playing the 7th, who had chipped down our fairway and was planning to approach over the water. We continued up our fairway and couldn't find A's ball anywhere. It was an absolute no brainer that we would find it. Went back and asked C whether he had played the right ball, and he stated "it was my Callaway" and headed round the water to the 7th green. We continued our search for remainder of 3 minutes without success, though virtually certain by this time that C had played A's ball, which was also a Callaway.

What would you do at this point?
 
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rulie

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After three minutes, it is a lost ball, even if player D had played it (although I'm not sure where player D became involved?)
 

salfordlad

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What I would do is ask C's playing colleagues to check whether A's mark is on the Callaway that C has hit. Simple fact is people sometimes make mistakes on the course.
 

Colin L

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Edited to correct error with D - it was C.

So does virtual certainty of an outside influence not come into play here?

Whether you had virtual certainty of the ball being moved by an outside influence would be a consideration. On the basis of what you have described, my view would be that you didn't have the degree of certainty needed that the other player took the ball.
 

Canfordhacker

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Thanks Colin, I was looking for an opinion as to whether we had enough.

Fact is, we found another Callaway further up under the trees in pretty much plain sight. Our assumption is that he didn't realise it had caught a tree and dropped down, and walked towards Player A's ball 60 yards further on, saw it was a Callaway, didn't have line of sight to 7th green (he was on our fairway FFS!) and chipped it down our fairway and hit it onto the 7th green. We couldn't find him in the clubhouse later to ask him to identify the one we found, but we are certain it was his.
 

mikejohnchapman

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Without doubt one of the most frustrating situations in golf. A chap I play with now marks his ball with a thick blue line to try to avoid problems having "lost" a couple of balls in similar circumstances.
 

rulie

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Edited to correct error with D - it was C.

So does virtual certainty of an outside influence not come into play here?
Knowledge or virtual certainty in this case must be established before the three minute search time expires. If not, the ball is lost.
 

jim8flog

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This has made me think of good idea for future games- put a line through the manufacturer name to make it hard to read.

(It has happened to me before and I had not realised I was playing a wrong ball until it was too late when picking up the ball on the putting green)
 

Tashyboy

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This has made me think of good idea for future games- put a line through the manufacturer name to make it hard to read.

(It has happened to me before and I had not realised I was playing a wrong ball until it was too late when picking up the ball on the putting green)
Which is not a bad idea at all. I nobbed one off our first tee today into some trees. I never saw where it went it was that bad. A Pp did and found it, Titliest number 3. I got my three wood out and absolutely mullered it out of the trees. Only I was inches from hitting the ball and thought hang on my numbers black not red. I had hit the wrong ball. Ironically I hit it that well it flew through the other side of the fairway and is still lost. ?
 

Neilds

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Played with a guy last year who hit his second into the trees so dropped a new ball. Hit this one through the green and found it in the light rough. Pitched onto the green and then proceeded to mark his ball and clean it. He then said it wasn't his ball as he played X make and this was a Y. Marker was picked up. We searched for the 3 minutes for his ball and couldn't find another ball, should have been easy to spot as rough wasn't bad at all. Turns out the ball in his pocket was his , just forgot he had pulled a random ball out of his bag, and not one of his usual ones.
 

DickInShorts

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I now mark my golf balls in 3 different colours for each sleeve - one red one blue one black - each has a line around it and my initials by name.
I carry a spare of a different colour in my pocket for use - if required - as a provisional.
When playing a provisional I can then state “ this is a Vice with blue markings - and the original had black” so not easy to get confused
 

SwingsitlikeHogan

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I mark my ball with my family ‘brand mark’ as on my grandparents headstone, my three initials written on top of each other positioned right above the ball brand both ‘sides’ of ball.

No excuses for another player hitting it.
 
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