Lift, Clean And Place

Crazyface

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It can't be a coincidence that I'm just playing well. I think it's down to using the LC&P rules that we have in winter. This has got me thinking. Should golf use this all the time? I'd vote for it. It's a bit radical, and I'm sure some (maybe all) will shoot me down on this. Hey I'm just thinking that's all. I mean snooker players ask for snooker balls to be cleaned when they think it needs doing. It would mean we all get a good lie all the time so the game would become a bit easier and maybe a a lot more enjoyable as we would hit more good shots, in theory. There would still be the skill factor in place, I mean, you've still got to be damn good to get down to scratch, or even single figures. Still be able to get out of bunkers. Chip over them. Read greens when putting etc etc.

Go on then, shoot away.
 

HomerJSimpson

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I benefitted from a great driving weekend so managed to lift clean and place regularly. I usually don't see a fairway until winter rules disappear. It does put a premium on hitting the short stuff and as a short hitter it's always a compromise between trying to get as much distance as I can with being accurate. As some of the par fours are out of my range in winter I'll take hitting the fairway, cleaning and using my stroke to play as a par 5. Makes it far easier than hitting a muddy ball from the rough and having to scramble to make a 5 at best

Definitely not all year round for me though
 

Imurg

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I have to say that even though we've been on Preferred lies for 2 weeks now I've only done it half a handful of times and then only if there's mud on the ball.
We're quite lucky in that respect.
 

RichA

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I only lift, clean and place if there is a clod of mud on my ball. I got some great connections off the fairway with my irons at the weekend. For me, it's just the softer ground that makes me play better when it's damp.
 

BiMGuy

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Nooooooooo. It would only slow things down more.

Nor do I agree with getting a drop from a divot. There would be endless arguments about what is, and what isn’t a divot.
 

pendodave

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Ours is a soggy clay based course, so when we're playing social golf it's l/c/p everywhere to keep things moving along and making the experience more palatable.
I envy those living near sand, but for some reason, it's not considered justification for uprooting the entire family...
If I'm playing with beginner golfers, I'm perfectly happy for them to tee everything up or move the ball onto the fairway. At least that way they get the best chance to hit some decent shots and want to come back.
 

harpo_72

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I have to say that even though we've been on Preferred lies for 2 weeks now I've only done it half a handful of times and then only if there's mud on the ball.
We're quite lucky in that respect.
Good drainage is the key, leaves were a pain at Ellesborough but they have industrial kit.
My current track drains well, but we are on fairway mats, honestly speaking I really enjoy winter golf now. I think if your allowed relief you use it irrespective of if you think that will be fine.. your being handed a chance to improve.

The age old divot question.. well to get out I go steep, so it’s only going to get deeper and longer, course looks great after my efforts… not.
 

timd77

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What’s the thoughts on using LCP to your advantage and placing the ball on a worm cast to tee it up a bit?
 

Orikoru

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I swear someone says this every winter!

Personally as said above, I don't clean and place on every shot. I do when there's mud on the ball obviously. Other than that, I do it every time I'm hitting a fairway wood, so you can make sure it's sitting nicely. But I see that as a trade-off with the fact it's winter, the ball doesn't go as far, so you're forced to hit fairway woods more often. If I was doing that all year round, I don't know, it would feel a bit like cheating at first. It would get around the divots issue as well of course.

I don't think I feel strongly either way. It will probably never happen anyway, if I did though I'd be fine with it. At my old course there was one summer where it was pick and place all year round on four of the fairways - but it was after that heatwave a few years back when these particularly fairways were in atrocious condition. The pick and place was so you could actually find a bit of grass to put it on.
 

Rlburnside

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We must be one of the very few courses that is allowed lcp all year what’s more it’s one club length,used to be two when our course first opened.

I wouldn’t like to see lcp introduced all the time as a rule.
 

rksquire

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It's a necessary evil I feel at the moment (L, C & P through the green) as even in the fairway we have plugged balls or mud balls.... but I think, high handicappers in particular, suffer come Spring when you can't do it anymore, particularly in our rough! Our ground is quite soft so to keep playing well-ish you have to 'pick' the ball on the fairway & chipping around the green means you always have a nice lie as well.....when the rule is dispensed with and we have to play it like it lies with the ball sitting down, or on bare lies it makes quite a difference but even so I wouldn't be in favour having the rule in place all year round.
 

jim8flog

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We must be one of the very few courses that is allowed lcp all year what’s more it’s one club length,used to be two when our course first opened.

I wouldn’t like to see lcp introduced all the time as a rule.

Do you still get to play qualifying comps and allow general play cards? I always understood you have to get permission from the Area Authority, it must be limited to defined areas and that it must still be 6".
 

jim8flog

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My personal view is allow lift clean and replace not lift clean and place.

Trouble is far too many players would ignore the replace.
 

rulefan

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We must be one of the very few courses that is allowed lcp all year what’s more it’s one club length,used to be two when our course first opened.

I wouldn’t like to see lcp introduced all the time as a rule.
Have both (ie lcp and 1cl) been approved by the county. WHS mandates 6". Has your club been authorised to run 'qualifiers'?
 

rulefan

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For some reason, under our Winter Rules we have deemed bunkers GUR, maybe this should be permanent as well?
CONGU 19 July
With no restrictions on bunker rakes on the course, a local rule to allow preferred lies in bunkers is not permitted (apart from situations already covered under the Rules of Golf and the appropriate Model Local Rules utilised) and generally making all bunkers GUR is no longer permitted
 

Rlburnside

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Do you still get to play qualifying comps and allow general play cards? I always understood you have to get permission from the Area Authority, it must be limited to defined areas and that it must still be 6".

Yes we play qualifying competitions and now general play rounds,

Our course was built in the 70s and was basically built on a peat hill so the fairways were very rough that’s why I assume we got special dispensation for lcp all year.

Our course has come on fantastically well even to the point the SGU have said our closing hole is one of the best in Scotland.

I always think our course is a throwback to how golf was played years and years ago.
 

Rlburnside

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Have both (ie lcp and 1cl) been approved by the county. WHS mandates 6". Has your club been authorised to run 'qualifiers'?

One of the rules experts asked me this before maybe you, yes i assume it has been approved as I know we have had our course rated twice before.
 
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