Jeremy Corbyn

[Deleted member 15344]

But the SNP cannot split up the UK today or tomorrow, next month or next year - or probably not for another 5-10 yrs. Meanwhile many aspects of what made the UK a great and compassionate place to live in are being ditched and destroyed by the Tories - and these things will difficult if not impossible to get back.

So if it is necessary for Labour to get into bed with the SNP to stop the Tories and their destruction of our society, then that is surely what Labour must do. And that does not suggest that Labour are one iota more supportive of the long term goals of the SNP - nor make the long term goals of the SNP more likely to come about. In fact it would make them more likely to recover their position against the SNP in Scotland, weakening the SNP, and also make Labour more likely to win a Westminster majority in the future.

There seems to an issue here with people not grasping reality

SNP want independence from the UK - yes

Regardless of when they have their next chance their main aim is still quite clear for people

No party will align themselves with a party whose sole aim is remove themselves from the UK - it would destroy the party and it doesn't align with their aims

The SNP will falter away at some point soon when they become the toothless party people expect them to be

I'll say it again- SNP want independence - no party will join with them

 

[SocketRocket]

let's see where we are in a few years time.

The Sun will probably still come up in the morning and the poor will still be with us. Oh! and the Nasty Tories who you can still blame for all the bad in the country.

 

[FairwayDodger]

The Sun will probably still come up in the morning and the poor will still be with us. Oh! and the Nasty Tories!

I live in hope that we might eradicate poverty one day but I fully agree with you that it'll never happen under a tory government.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

There seems to an issue here with people not grasping reality

SNP want independence from the UK - yes

Regardless of when they have their next chance their main aim is still quite clear for people

No party will align themselves with a party whose sole aim is remove themselves from the UK - it would destroy the party and it doesn't align with their aims

The SNP will falter away at some point soon when they become the toothless party people expect them to be

I'll say it again- SNP want independence - no party will join with them

Cameron is adamant that the referendum last Sept was a once in a generation - so as far as he is concerned there's not going to be another for 25yrs or while the Tories are in power. SNP may have independence as a goal but the Tories aren't going to sanction another referendum and the Labour party may not be in government until 2025 earliest with Corbyn boss in Labour HQ. Indeed I am not sure that a Labour government themselves would sanction another referendum in the next 10 yrs.

Another referendum is not something that the SNP can demand - they are powerless in that respect - only Westminster can grant Scotland another one. So what do Labour really have to fear about working with the SNP?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

The Sun will probably still come up in the morning and the poor will still be with us. Oh! and the Nasty Tories who you can still blame for all the bad in the country.

I sometimes wonder how many folk on this forum have actually been affected and are hurting as a result of government austerity policy since 2008. I can honestly say that I have not been affected. That's how it is - some - many - of us are in that fortunate position. And so I know that we are not all in it together - not by a long shot. But someone must be suffering and I am not blind or blinkered to that.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I think this forum should have a FPP (Frequently posted points) section. So if you want to post about Sky TV v the BBC, The SNP, Scottish/English Football or Dress Codes you first must go to it to check if you have not made the same point many times before.

Yes and I do know that is very hypocritical coming from me .

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Cameron is adamant that the referendum last Sept was a once in a generation - so as far as he is concerned there's not going to be another for 25yrs or while the Tories are in power. SNP may have independence as a goal but the Tories aren't going to sanction another referendum and the Labour party may not be in government until 2025 earliest with Corbyn boss in Labour HQ. Indeed I am not sure that a Labour government themselves would sanction another referendum in the next 10 yrs.

Another referendum is not something that the SNP can demand - they are powerless in that respect - only Westminster can grant Scotland another one. So what do Labour really have to fear about working with the SNP?

It's like a broken record

Please read it even more slowly

SNP want to break up the UK - simple

Labour will not want to work alongside a party that wants to break up the UK - simple

Can that be anymore simple for you

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It's like a broken record

Please read it even more slowly

SNP want to break up the UK - simple

Labour will not want to work alongside a party that wants to break up the UK - simple

Can that be anymore simple for you

The SNP do not want to break up the UK - they want Scotland to become independent. And that can never happen if Westminster do not grant the Scottish electorate another referendum. In enabling the Sept 2014 referendum to happen it was actually Cameron that put the UK at risk.

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

The SNP do not want to break up the UK - they want Scotland to become independent.

Please re read this a few times. How does it make sense?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

The SNP do not want to break up the UK - they want Scotland to become independent.

Maybe it's just me but isn't that the same thing ?!

 

[Hobbit]

The SNP do not want to break up the UK - they want Scotland to become independent. And that can never happen if Westminster do not grant the Scottish electorate another referendum. In enabling the Sept 2014 referendum to happen it was actually Cameron that put the UK at risk.

Please re read this a few times. How does it make sense?

lol and lol, and another lol....... and then it was Cameron's fault. Do you realise how mind numbingly stupid that sounds?

And do you really think the electorate would accept Labour working with the SNP? If Labour signed up for an alliance with the SNP how many current Labour voters would support them at the next election? The Cons would have a field day with that, and ensure yet another Con victory.

Are you really that naïve?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

lol and lol, and another lol....... and then it was Cameron's fault. Do you realise how mind numbingly stupid that sounds?

And do you really think the electorate would accept Labour working with the SNP? If Labour signed up for an alliance with the SNP how many current Labour voters would support them at the next election? The Cons would have a field day with that, and ensure yet another Con victory.

Are you really that naïve?

Under Corbyn the chances are that Labour are going to struggle to win the 2020 election. and as you say I don't think they'd form a pact/coalition with the SNP to get a working majority. But Labour working together with the SNP to defeat a post 2020 minority Tory government makes sense.

 

[Radbourne2010]

Head in the clouds politics. Totally un-costed & unaffordable social engineering. Labour are the new Liberals, sprouting policy on the hoof as only an unelectable Opposition are able to do. At least Corbyn as some guts unlike the other three contenders even if he is left of Karl Marx.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Head in the clouds politics. Totally un-costed & unaffordable social engineering. Labour are the new Liberals, sprouting policy on the hoof as only an unelectable Opposition are able to do. At least Corbyn as some guts unlike the other three contenders even if he is left of Karl Marx.

Like the country could 'afford' to bail out the banks for screwing things up. Though it has.

 

[Hobbit]

Under Corbyn the chances are that Labour are going to struggle to win the 2020 election. and as you say I don't think they'd form a pact/coalition with the SNP to get a working majority. But Labour working together with the SNP to defeat a post 2020 minority Tory government makes sense.

Might make sense to you but it ignores the fact that Labour would be signing their own death warrant by working with a party whose sole aim is independence that will lead to destabilising the UK's financial standing.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Might make sense to you but it ignores the fact that Labour would be signing their own death warrant by working with a party whose sole aim is independence that will lead to destabilising the UK's financial standing.

so you say - and as far as destabilising the UK's financial standing - sorry - I'm wetting myself with that one (it was supposed to be tongue in cheek I hope)

 

[Foxholer]

Might make sense to you but it ignores the fact that Labour would be signing their own death warrant by working with a party whose sole aim is independence that will lead to destabilising the UK's financial standing.

Without wishing to go back over the Referendum garbage again, I fail to see how Scotland becoming would destabilise the UK's financial standing!

That was never an argument/consideration in the referendum. The only real argument was whether Scotland contributed more or less than its 'share' to the UK economy (with and/or without oil revenues) and whether it could stand/prosper on it's own - better than as part of the Union. By stating that an independent Scotland would lead to destabilising of (R)UK's financial standing, you seem to be implying that Scotland was contributing more than its share - something that was vehemently denied - quite the reverse even - by the 'Better Together' campaign!

Btw. An independent Scotland is definitely not the sole purpose of the SNP!

 

[Hobbit]

so you say - and as far as destabilising the UK's financial standing - sorry - I'm wetting myself with that one (it was supposed to be tongue in cheek I hope)

mmm, understandable, you having a continence problem! But I'm sure you remember what the EU banks said would happen to the credit rating of the separate countries post-independence - or have you conveniently forgotten that too.

Notice you still won't acknowledge the damage it would do to Labour's standing with the electorate... but I guess that's the Scot in you believing in faeries...

 

[SocketRocket]

I sometimes wonder how many folk on this forum have actually been affected and are hurting as a result of government austerity policy since 2008. I can honestly say that I have not been affected. That's how it is - some - many - of us are in that fortunate position. And so I know that we are not all in it together - not by a long shot. But someone must be suffering and I am not blind or blinkered to that.

I have lived trough poverty and know exactly what it is like in it's true form. Have you? Do you understand what real poverty feels like; I somehow doubt if you do. Many people seem to think its not going abroad for a holiday or struggling to pay the mobile phone bill.

You keep saying how awful the nasty Tory Government are being and the way they are making all these people suffer. Please can you explain exactly who these people are that are 'suffering' from their policies and what you mean by that term? I am genuinely interested!

 

[c1973]

I live in hope that we might eradicate poverty one day but I fully agree with you that it'll never happen under a tory government.

Agreed. Sadly I don't see it happening under any party.......ever, if I'm being honest.