Boomy
Well-known member
Ha ha, are you talking to yourself? I do hope so ? good luck ?
Intensive golf lessons
- Thread starter Jaco
- Start date
Ha ha, are you talking to yourself? I do hope so ? good luck ?
D
Deleted member 29109
Guest
Because none of us have Tigers body.
There is a slight difference between grooving a swing to compete against the best in the world, and one that will get you a round in under 80. But then I rather suspect you know that and are just being a ?
garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
Its really hard to make massive swing changes. Its certainly not going to happen in a week.
I have videos of my own swing going back over 10 years. In that time I've started as a serious slicer of the ball. Arrived at the duck hooks. Moved back forth between the two a couple of times and now where I'm at today.
One thing that stands out is that my natural swing DNA hasnt really changed. The backswing looks somewhat similar. The grip has moved about over the years producing differnt face angles at the ball producing differnt flights.
While the overall swings look similar, it definitely looking a lot more in control that it did all those years ago when I first filmed myself.
Now, I've always been one to seek out instruction online. I enjoyed the buzz of experimenting with differnt ideas. Many worked and many got put back on the shelf. I can imagine that my swing COULD look so much differnt had I gone down the monthly lesson route. I'd likely be a better player if I had but it takes a lot of money and dedication which I was prepared to put into it.
I dont think there is too many short cuts in this game. To get good you need to hit a fair amount of balls. Taking direction while you do this, be it lessons, online tips or tips from better players or even your mate can help speed up the progress.
We all get it for while, lose it at some stage, find it again and that is the beauty of it all. We can never truly master it and it has us hook line and sinker. Love it or hate it. Golf, it's a helluva drug.
I have videos of my own swing going back over 10 years. In that time I've started as a serious slicer of the ball. Arrived at the duck hooks. Moved back forth between the two a couple of times and now where I'm at today.
One thing that stands out is that my natural swing DNA hasnt really changed. The backswing looks somewhat similar. The grip has moved about over the years producing differnt face angles at the ball producing differnt flights.
While the overall swings look similar, it definitely looking a lot more in control that it did all those years ago when I first filmed myself.
Now, I've always been one to seek out instruction online. I enjoyed the buzz of experimenting with differnt ideas. Many worked and many got put back on the shelf. I can imagine that my swing COULD look so much differnt had I gone down the monthly lesson route. I'd likely be a better player if I had but it takes a lot of money and dedication which I was prepared to put into it.
I dont think there is too many short cuts in this game. To get good you need to hit a fair amount of balls. Taking direction while you do this, be it lessons, online tips or tips from better players or even your mate can help speed up the progress.
We all get it for while, lose it at some stage, find it again and that is the beauty of it all. We can never truly master it and it has us hook line and sinker. Love it or hate it. Golf, it's a helluva drug.
Boomy
Well-known member
It is really hard for some people to make big or small swing changes, for other people it comes easier. As I’ve said, and seen through lots of experience, everybody adapts at different rates - a fair amount of balls to one player could be hundreds, to another it could be thousands - however it’s not about volume of balls, it’s about repeating the correct form. For you it might not happen in a week, but somebody else could make a significant change in days, and a small change in minutes or hours as I previously said.
Nobody said there were any short cuts, but again, the time needed to reach a goal will be different for everyone - it would be utter bobbins to say hit 3,000 balls and you’ll have made a swing change. It is about repeating the correct form/technique 1 ball at a time with quality rehearsals/drills in between - which is exactly what the pros do.
I’m not sure combining all of those inputs for learning would do anybody, any good at all and would certainly explain why it could take longer for someone to settle in changes - likely because they’re changing things every time they hit a ball by watching a online coach, then someone at the range, then a better player pointing something out, then a friend telling you something.. chaos and not indicative of speeding progress up at all. If you want to play more like a pro, you need to train more like a pro - consistent correct input and structured practice. Naturally they can hit more balls than someone who works full time, because hitting balls is their full time job!
There’ll always be players out there who’ve never had a lesson, never been fitted, never watched coaching videos, never hit thousands of balls etc and have likely got a good game because they adapt easily - one of my PP’s is a 4 handicapper, he fully fits the above description, his minds eye and coordination just seem to link everything together easily for him - very frustrating ?
Sign of a defeated argument when it resorts to insults. Shame. Thought you were better
HomecountiesJohn
Well-known member
The most common issue with any type of "intensive" training course is the inability of the student to listen,focus and repeat correctly what they've been shown with their skillset. Its too much.
I have 2 old school pals whom i've known for over 30+ yrs, they are both highly regarded teaching PGA pro's with a client base of extremely good amateur and European Tour professional golfers.
We've often discussed the standard of amateur club golfers and the common faults of a club golfer.
They both don't tolerate ignorant students, those who blatantly waste their time by not listening.
These boys charge very good money and expect to see results and improvements from their students.
I have 2 old school pals whom i've known for over 30+ yrs, they are both highly regarded teaching PGA pro's with a client base of extremely good amateur and European Tour professional golfers.
We've often discussed the standard of amateur club golfers and the common faults of a club golfer.
They both don't tolerate ignorant students, those who blatantly waste their time by not listening.
These boys charge very good money and expect to see results and improvements from their students.
The teaching pro I use is very good and is also an exam and course assessor for the PGA. His biggest bugbear is those students that come for a lesson and then never put the work in by hitting balls and ingraining the changes and then come back for a lesson for a few weeks later with the same fault and complaining nothing has changed on the course. Of course it won't if you don't practice what you were shown
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
My thoughts on this will always be the same
Your body and natural ability will always be the key limiter to how good you can become
You can practise and practise and have lesson after lesson and then hit a limit and you won’t get any better - because you will have reached your natural ability. You can’t coach or teach that - some may not even reach that limit - some just won’t get better at golf regardless of how much practise they do or what lessons they have
Some can take up the game and be very low handicap or indeed scratch within a couple of years without any lessons or much practice - some take up the game and then stay teen handicap and even in their 20’s handicap
I think a lot would enjoy the game more if they hit that level and then just enjoy where they at - some may enjoy the practise and the lessons
I haven’t bothered with lessons and had the odd hit at the range but don’t bother with practise - just enjoy where I am and improve by playing the game on the course
Your body and natural ability will always be the key limiter to how good you can become
You can practise and practise and have lesson after lesson and then hit a limit and you won’t get any better - because you will have reached your natural ability. You can’t coach or teach that - some may not even reach that limit - some just won’t get better at golf regardless of how much practise they do or what lessons they have
Some can take up the game and be very low handicap or indeed scratch within a couple of years without any lessons or much practice - some take up the game and then stay teen handicap and even in their 20’s handicap
I think a lot would enjoy the game more if they hit that level and then just enjoy where they at - some may enjoy the practise and the lessons
I haven’t bothered with lessons and had the odd hit at the range but don’t bother with practise - just enjoy where I am and improve by playing the game on the course
RichA
Well-known member
No amount of practice gets a Ford Mondeo around the Nurburgring in 7 minutes.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
Did you???
D
Deleted member 31467
Guest
I agree with DaveR. You can't expect to make a change and have it become repeatable without hitting a big number of balls on the range.
Boomy
Well-known member
That is an absolutely dreadful analogy! It is so wrong on so many levels, so dismissive and negative. My goodness, anybody that comes on here for structured and sensible advice stands no chance with posts like yours!
Boomy
Well-known member
Incorrect, on so many levels. Whilst natural ability plays a part and ‘some’ people might reach a limit due to physical capabilities/restrictions we always have the capacity to learn, and ultimately to adapt. It’s a simple as that. Then it comes down to the effort you are prepared to put in to achieve it.
That works for you, “if you always do, what you’ve always done, you’ll always get, what you’ve always got” You’re happy where you are, with the way you have chosen to do it. If everyone thought like that there would be very little progression in life.
D
Deleted member 29109
Guest
It does if you coupled improving your improved skill with suitable modifications to the Mondeo.
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
There are thousands of golfers up and down the country that have regular lessons , practice religiously, we have them in every club - but they just don’t get better
We are just talking sport here - not life , just good old sport and it will always come down to a players natural ability to be the best they can , can’t teach ability
D
Deleted member 31467
Guest
Fixed that for you mate.
SwingsitlikeHogan
Major Champion
On the range I'm doing a small numbers of balls (20-30) a session but doing it - for me - often - so maybe 3-4 times a week. I am really focussing on my pre-shot process and then taking on board feedback on strike (I use athletes foot spray on the clubhead to show me where I'm striking the ball).
There is no point in me hitting more than 20 balls in a session if the feedback I am getting tells me I'm am regularly hitting it heel side of centre...all I risk end up doing exacerbating the fault by trying to fix what is for me completely new and is difficult. I prefer to walk up completely fresh a day or two later and start again.
And if I am having too many difficult sessions in a row I touch base with my coach. He knows my swing, he knows what I do wrong, he knows what I need to do, and he reminds me. Often that is all I need to put me back on track - reminding. And if he has a bit of time spare we'll go down the range or into the studio for 15-30mins for him to check things.
There is no point in me hitting more than 20 balls in a session if the feedback I am getting tells me I'm am regularly hitting it heel side of centre...all I risk end up doing exacerbating the fault by trying to fix what is for me completely new and is difficult. I prefer to walk up completely fresh a day or two later and start again.
And if I am having too many difficult sessions in a row I touch base with my coach. He knows my swing, he knows what I do wrong, he knows what I need to do, and he reminds me. Often that is all I need to put me back on track - reminding. And if he has a bit of time spare we'll go down the range or into the studio for 15-30mins for him to check things.
sweaty sock
Hacker
Some of its genetics, but I can 100% assure you nobody on this forum has got to the stage where its genetics holding them back. Not even close...
I think thats maybe the greatest understatement Ive ever made...
I think thats maybe the greatest understatement Ive ever made...
garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
I agree that people can make a big change in a matter of minutes.
Just last week I had my mate at the range who's just starting out. Within 10 minutes I'd stopped his big overswing. Literally 10 minutes and he stopped it.
Not having a pop at Homer here. Just using him as an example. He had a top 100 instructor nearly pulling his hair out trying to get him to shorten his swing.
The problem with golf and I see it over and over again is things rarely stick. It takes time for these things to happen.
I could bet all the money in the world my mate will be over swinging when I get him back on the range this week.
Just last week I had my mate at the range who's just starting out. Within 10 minutes I'd stopped his big overswing. Literally 10 minutes and he stopped it.
Not having a pop at Homer here. Just using him as an example. He had a top 100 instructor nearly pulling his hair out trying to get him to shorten his swing.
The problem with golf and I see it over and over again is things rarely stick. It takes time for these things to happen.
I could bet all the money in the world my mate will be over swinging when I get him back on the range this week.
D
Deleted member 31467
Guest
And herein lies the problem. Unless you groove in the change(s) with hours on the range you end up reverting back to what you always did.
HomecountiesJohn
Well-known member
With respect, isn't that what you do?
It's all well and good practising but if you're not practising correctly you wont see an improvement.
If you were practising exactly what you've been shown, you wouldnt have to keep going back to the same pro for thpe same swing fault etc.
You may spend many hours practising which is needed but when you dont have the standard skillset to be able to adapt to changes it becomes a pointless exercise.
