Here comes the rollback..maybe

[inc0gnito]

Was listening to a Golf Smarter podcast recently with the guy that made Bandon dunes (sp?). Was very interesting to listen to. He was critical of how modern courses are designed and said fell into the same trap for about a decade.

Basically he said it’s counterproductive to make courses that punish amateurs or higher handicap amateurs mainly as they already add strokes to their score cards without adding punishing bunkers etc. He has taken to designed courses that offer greater risk reward.

So the payoff is higher for longer hitters and more accurate golfers but there is also greater risk for taking on those shots. That’s the way courses should be designed imo. You can’t just make rough rougher and fairways tighter. It’s all about balancing risk reward.

 

[USER1999]

Was listening to a Golf Smarter podcast recently with the guy that made Bandon dunes (sp?). Was very interesting to listen to. He was critical of how modern courses are designed and said fell into the same trap for about a decade.

Basically he said it’s counterproductive to make courses that punish amateurs or higher handicap amateurs mainly as they already add strokes to their score cards without adding punishing bunkers etc. He has taken to designed courses that offer greater risk reward.

So the payoff is higher for longer hitters and more accurate golfers but there is also greater risk for taking on those shots. That’s the way courses should be designed imo. You can’t just make rough rougher and fairways tighter. It’s all about balancing risk reward.

Equally, you can't redesign 1000's of old courses.

Real in the ball, and the drivers, it brings classic courses back in to play.

Long hitters will still be long. Just length is relative.

The WGC in Mexico is a good example of what could be. The course cannot be over powered. It is the equivalent of a very short tight golf course. Say, Sunningdale.

 

[Tashyboy]

This is the BBCs Take on it. Interestingly they also mention about a premier league of the worlds top golfers. What’s that all about.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/51374200

 

[fundy]

This is the BBCs Take on it. Interestingly they also mention about a premier league of the worlds top golfers. What’s that all about.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/51374200

https://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/threads/premier-golf-league.104145/page-2#post-2112127

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Does anyone really care what the pros score ? I certainly don’t see the need to change anything for us mere mortals because i don’t believe our scores are changing much

And I reckon more of the distance gains from the players is down to the physical attributes of the players themselves and how over the years their training regimes have changed etc.

 

[Tashyboy]

https://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/threads/premier-golf-league.104145/page-2#post-2112127

with the two things being discussed, re Prem league and distance/ courses etc. Be interesting to see where pros go. Will decisions of the courses affect a golfers decision to play tougher courses or will they chase the prem money. Time will tell.

 

[USER1999]

Does anyone really care what the pros score ? I certainly don’t see the need to change anything for us mere mortals because i don’t believe our scores are changing much

And I reckon more of the distance gains from the players is down to the physical attributes of the players themselves and how over the years their training regimes have changed etc.

It's not about what they score, it's how they do it. Would Seve get a look in now? I doubt it. He was shocking off the tee.

The shots we remember are not the bomb and gouge ones, they are the shot making, phenomenal rescue ones. The impossible dream ones.
No one remembers who hit it the furthest, or straighest. Bombing it is boring. Once you get over the wow factor.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I want to see the very best golfers being tested fully, not just smashing it as hard as they can knowing they are virtually certain of finding it again and usually in some sort of playable lie and so easy to hit target with a short iron. I want them to have to stop and consider each shot and accept that there may be risks and missing a fairway will mean having to perhaps lay up or improve their short game.

One of the few times this still happens is at the Open where there are usually deep pot bunkers to consider (although the modern golfer can normally still take these on with abandon) which is why we see so many more long irons off the tee. It doesn't make the golf any less interesting. Lets get the game back to an all round game not a bash and target golf fest

 

[USER1999]

In fact, name me a famous drive. One that made the front pages. Are there not a myriad of famous rescue shots?
Narrow the fairways, grow the rough, make guys hit irons off the tee, value straightness. What does any of this achieve? Boring golf.one dimensional hit it straight boring junk.
Any excitement in pro golf is seeing recovery shots. Something amazing. Some brilliance. Don't we want to see more of this? Something I can't do? Some just wow, what the flipping heck did I just see?

Nope. Whack it long and straight. Boring as. Anti golf.

 

[robinthehood]

In fact, name me a famous drive. One that made the front pages. Are there not a myriad of famous rescue shots?
Narrow the fairways, grow the rough, make guys hit irons off the tee, value straightness. What does any of this achieve? Boring golf.one dimensional hit it straight boring junk.
Any excitement in pro golf is seeing recovery shots. Something amazing. Some brilliance. Don't we want to see more of this? Something I can't do? Some just wow, what the flipping heck did I just see?

Nope. Whack it long and straight. Boring as. Anti golf.

What like seve driving the 10th at the belfry ?

 

[USER1999]

What like seve driving the 10th at the belfry ?

Jeez, even I have done that.

The car park shot. Way more memorable. The 3w from the fairway bunker, that Jack Niclaus called the greatest shot he had ever seen. Come on, pick a proper golf shot.

Bubbas shot out of the trees at Augusta, Mikelsons too. Tigers chip.

Come on, one famous drive. Just one.

 

[robinthehood]

Jeez, even I have done that.

The car park shot. Way more memorable. The 3w from the fairway bunker, that Jack Niclaus called the greatest shot he had ever seen. Come on, pick a proper golf shot.

Bubbas shot out of the trees at Augusta, Mikelsons too. Tigers chip.

Come on, one famous drive. Just one.

I bet you didn't do it in the Ryder cup...
I've just given you one and your unwilling to accept it. So little point continuing

 

[USER1999]

I bet you didn't do it in the Ryder cup...
I've just given you one and your unwilling to accept it. So little point continuing

Whatever. My point remains, there are next to zero memorable drives, and pretty much every shot we remember is a rescue shot, which would be nigh on impossible if the universal answer was growing knee deep rough.

Sadly, you remain an unmentionable infringement generating tit. Happy Tuesday, and no, I haven't been given one, what ever that means.

 

[robinthehood]

Whatever. My point remains, there are next to zero memorable drives, and pretty much every shot we remember is a rescue shot, which would be nigh on impossible if the universal answer was growing knee deep rough.

Sadly, you remain an unmentionable infringement generating tit. Happy Tuesday, and no, I haven't been given one, what ever that means.

Given you one... as in an example of a very famous drive.....
So rather than accept you made a rash statement you just become abusive.
Oof.

 

[Crow]

What like seve driving the 10th at the belfry ?

Seve's shot was an achievement and it is still talked about.

Because, he did it with a persimmon block and a wound ball.
He had to be very accurate with his strike, not anywhere within an inch of the sweetspot.
And not only was the wound ball travelling a much shorter distance than today's solid core balls, any slice or hook spin he put on it would have been far greater.

With modern gear driving the 10th is a piece of piss for Pros and even for decent amateurs, and the hole is probably quite a bit longer than it was back when Seve did it.

 

[robinthehood]

Seve's shot was an achievement and it is still talked about.

Because, he did it with a persimmon block and a wound ball.
He had to be very accurate with his strike, not anywhere within an inch of the sweetspot.
And not only was the wound ball travelling a much shorter distance than today's solid core balls, any slice or hook spin he put on it would have been far greater.

With modern gear driving the 10th is a piece of piss for Pros and even for decent amateurs, and the hole is probably quite a bit longer than it was back when Seve did it.

Yes he carried it 280 over trees and on to the green.

Chip becks 400 ace comes to mind too. Possibly still the longest on record.
DJ knocking it stiff from 430 was pretty impressive.
But as driving is only really a functional shot to start a hole , it's less likely to produce as many memorable shots anyway, so the comparison was stupid.

 

[USER1999]

Given you one... as in an example of a very famous drive.....
So rather than accept you made a rash statement you just become abusive.
Oof.

Oof. Yep. That settles it. Oof. What does that even mean. Oof.

Name another famous drive, ( not sure that one even counts)
. As opposed to a recovery shot. An up and down, a miraculous get out of jail.

Speiths shot off the practice ground. Rocca's valley of sin, Hunter Mahans duff in the RC, Lyles bunker shot, Sarazens shot, heard around the world. There are so many famous shots that involve creativity, rather than power, rather than smashing a drive.
Golf should be, and is, about way more than this.

 

[USER1999]

Oh, and my point was next to zero, not zero.

 

[robinthehood]

Oh, and my point was next to zero, not zero.

Can't beat a little bit of revisioning. ???
Oof ?

 

[harpo_72]

The pro’s are still accurate with where they hit the ball on the face. Smaller drivers will have minor impact, look at their fairways and the distances they knock 3 woods out to.
The ball is the key, like a tennis ball which has it’s compression restricted. Yes the faster swingers are penalised .. so what ? Some of this thrashing about is not worth watching.
Plus career longevity, these younger players all have some pretty fragile bodies that are not going to see them to the seniors tour.