Hard greens

[Mandofred]

Stating that his ability to hold the green has been diminished by the injection of “more and more” sand in recent years.

We’re doing the same. Tonnes of the stuff. Just when they’re running great, another load gets dumped on. I think it’s to try and reduce fusarium long term. Some playing partners complain bitterly but the work is in the online diary and explanatory emails are sent out. If it works, great. We shall see.

Is it exacerbating the issue stated in the OP? Don’t think so. That’s all down to the weather as stated by others I think.

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That was my point, as mentioned originally. Even during the winter the balls aren't creating the holes that they used to. I'm not saying it's good or bad..........it's something I've noticed over the last couple of years....that's all....people just keep jumping to negative conclusions.

 

[garyinderry]

What I take from days like this is how good the top players strike it and control spin, there are not many pga greens where you see big pitch marks, but they all hold the green.

They also hit off fairways that are absolutely perfect.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

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That was my point, as mentioned originally. Even during the winter the balls aren't creating the holes that they used to. I'm not saying it's good or bad..........it's something I've noticed over the last couple of years....that's all....people just keep jumping to negative conclusions.

Maybe it’s eyesight because each green I go onto there are tens of pitchmarks on each green at each course whether that’s parkland , links , Heath - and the key will be the level of rain we have had - winter was generally dry with a very wet late spring . GK aren’t sanding them more but more courses are using rollers to give a smoother role which in turn compacts the turf. But pitchmarks will still be there

 

[Bdill93]

Similar situation at my place.

In the summer I always play to the front of the green and let it roll on towards the middle.

In the winter I can attack the flags a lot more as the ground is a lot softer.

I just put that down to summer and winter golf though! Dry ground means the ball will bounce and roll!

Im not good enough to purposely spin a ball, but sometimes I hit peaches that anyone would be proud of!

 

[jim8flog]

What I take from days like this is how good the top players strike it and control spin, there are not many pga greens where you see big pitch marks, but they all hold the green.

You do not see any greens on the PGA where they have been covered in sand that has not had the time to wash in.

This has been the trouble where I play heavily sanded greens and then no rain. Sprinkler systems just do not cut it.

We still have 'dents' in the greens form the March hollow tining.

 

[Mandofred]

Maybe it’s eyesight because each green I go onto there are tens of pitchmarks on each green at each course whether that’s parkland , links , Heath - and the key will be the level of rain we have had - winter was generally dry with a very wet late spring . GK aren’t sanding them more but more courses are using rollers to give a smoother role which in turn compacts the turf. But pitchmarks will still be there

That again feeds into my point.....we aren't getting much of any pitchmarks. There are a few, but most of the time if I hit the green from outside 100yds.....I can't find a mark, if I do find a dent it's very minor/shallow. If I hit a high wedge in from around 50yds I can almost guarantee I won't find anything. This is a view from everybody I play with, not just me. When I'm waiting for other people to putt I quite often wander around fixing pitchmarks......I'm not finding much of anything this year.

Sand is also being used in different ways. Where they used to poke holes and then layer some sand on and brush it in......now they use injection methods. The last few years they have been using a slit injection method....which tears the greens up more than the hole method, but I think they are able to put more sand into the green. Must be benefits to it since both courses I play have gone to just that method. It leaves long slits/lines in the greens for at least a few weeks which causes putts to get offline more....it is what it is.

 

[TreeSeeker]

I caddied for a guy in a club match where the greens were rocks he straight up was refusing to play it short and roll on so missed all but one or two greens despite carrying them on, definitely got adapt!

I'm yet to play somewhere that i dont leave a pitchmark approaching with an 8 iron or less, it would sure stump me if i did!!

Do you think they've done this to the greens to increase protect against alot of use? Must be some benefit.

 

[sunshine]

We still have 'dents' in the greens form the March hollow tining.

Why is this? I played at a course this week where the greens had not recovered from hollow tining before the end of lockdown. Greens at my course took longer than normal to recover, but they've been fine for ages now.

 

[sunshine]

Over the last couple of years....a big push to put more and more sand into the greens. Helps with standing up to heavy use, and drainage.....but crap.....I've hit some lovely high shots into greens lately, and they just roll right off the green. The days of landing on the green and making a big dent in the green are over where I play. I might as well just put my repair tool in the bag and forget about it.

Maybe stop using top-flites?

 

[jim8flog]

Why is this? I played at a course this week where the greens had not recovered from hollow tining before the end of lockdown. Greens at my course took longer than normal to recover, but they've been fine for ages now.

The weather.

They were hollow tined and sanded the week before we came out of lockdown and there was no rain for over 5 weeks.

They have been sanded twice in the past few weeks but still no rain has meant the sand is not properly washed in. Plus we have a lot of very fine grasses in the mix which do not start to grow properly until temps reach about 18 degree so have really only started to come of of dormancy a couple of weeks ago.

I am not talking about all the greens just some.

 

[hovis]

Our greens are watered alot. Hit the green with the first bounce and it will check up as normal. Hit it short then it will jump over the green. I can't stand playing the type of golf where you have to land it 10 yards short of the green to account for roll out. It's too unpredictable

 

[Mandofred]

Maybe stop using top-flites?

Hey!....nothing wrong with Top Flites. I've shot a lot of good rounds in the past with those balls. It's still the operator....not the ball.

 

[Foxholer]

..I think it’s to try and reduce fusarium long term...

I don't believe this is the case - certainly not the primary reason - though healthier greens (grass) is more resistent to this fungus! Have a read of this article https://golf.com/lifestyle/why-golf-courses-put-sand-greens/

 

[timd77]

Same every year isn’t it, takes a few rounds to adjust from soft greens to hard greens, and then back again in a few months.

Most of our greens are raised and so you can’t really hit short and let it run on. On our 10th last night i had something like 130 front, 150 back, pin in the middle, so I hit my 135 club, it landed 5 to 10 yards on and I watched it disappear off the back… got up there expected to be just over, nope, it was a good 15-20 yards over! Can’t bloody legislate for it!

 

[SocketRocket]

We've installed a completely new irrigation system at our club recently at great cost, it's made a significant difference towards keeping the greens more responsive.

 

[Tashyboy]

Played our 3 rd today 170 yds to the back. I thought a nice steady 8 iron to tickle it to the front if am lucky and it will run on. 10 secs later am wondering how the hell it is 10 yds through the back ?

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Played our 3 rd today 170 yds to the back. I thought a nice steady 8 iron to tickle it to the front if am lucky and it will run on. 10 secs later am wondering how the hell it is 10 yds through the back ?

Did you land it short of the green?

landing on solid fairway should produce more bounce than landing it on a green.

 

[Tashyboy]

Did you land it short of the green?

landing on solid fairway should produce more bounce than landing it on a green.

landed it short probably 10 yds short. There was no way my 8 iron would reach the green. It slopes uphill, not that it mattered

I played our longest and hole creamed a fairway wood down the rhs towards the green. It hit the fairway and literally kicked 90 degrees left it was 5 yds short of dropping in the pond. Some real weird and wonderful bounces.

 

[sunshine]

The weather.

They were hollow tined and sanded the week before we came out of lockdown and there was no rain for over 5 weeks.

They have been sanded twice in the past few weeks but still no rain has meant the sand is not properly washed in. Plus we have a lot of very fine grasses in the mix which do not start to grow properly until temps reach about 18 degree so have really only started to come of of dormancy a couple of weeks ago.

I am not talking about all the greens just some.

I think it must have been really tough for greenkeepers this spring.

The type of grass could explain why the greens at my club have fully recovered from tining, but those at my mate's club are still pockmarked. The work was done the same week in March.

 

[MadAdey]

Play for short of the green then and run up to the pin. Imagine you’re at a nice links course because that is what is required there.

But there is a problem with that theory. A lot of inland courses are not designed to do, where a links course is.