Extinction rebellion

[IanM]

Does the Central Line reach Newport?

Joking apart. So much of the Green narrative comes from folk who rarely venture outside cities.

Needs some major change before alternatives are viable for where I live

 

[bobmac]

Rather than simply change motive power greater efforts should be put into encouraging folk out of their own individual 'boxes'... Invest in mass public transport systems, for urban areas, then make it impossible for people not to use them...

I think the old farts will still want their own car, especially in rural areas but in the city, I think the next generation might just hire one as and when they need one.
I'm not sure how true it is but some say that 90% of cars aren't used 90% of the time.

 

[Blue in Munich]

I think the old farts will still want their own car, especially in rural areas but in the city, I think the next generation might just hire one as and when they need one.
I'm not sure how true it is but some say that 90% of cars aren't used 90% of the time.

Very true I'd say; probably more likely 95% of cars 95% of the time. Mine certainly hits that assessment.

Not sure how much the Zip car idea will take off; my two main concerns would be could I get one when I need it, & what state did the previous hirer leave it in...?

 

[clubchamp98]

About 85 mile round trip, anything bigger than that and I use my diesel car.
My van is one of the early electric vehicles, so range isn't great but it's more than enough for my day to day use.
It's all about planning and being sensible.

That would do me I only go the club and back ,shopping etc.
Only concern is I have family in Scotland and go see them quite often.
I might hire one or 48 hr test drive as I would like one.

 

[clubchamp98]

Rather than simply change motive power greater efforts should be put into encouraging folk out of their own individual 'boxes'... Invest in mass public transport systems, for urban areas, then make it impossible for people not to use them...

You would have a climate ER glued to your train though.
But yes I agree.
Got my bus pass two years ago it’s fantastic I just leave my car at home.
But no government will finance it.

 

[bobmac]

That would do me I only go the club and back ,shopping etc.
Only concern is I have family in Scotland and go see them quite often.
I might hire one or 48 hr test drive as I would like one.

You may be surprised to know that Scotland has had electricity for ages

 

[clubchamp98]

You may be surprised to know that Scotland has had electricity for ages

Yes but the golf has a range of 144 miles and I am sure Scotland is further from Liverpool than that.
When it can do it in one charge maybe I will pull the trigger.

Saw a price on Telly by Angela Rippon about EV .
Most of the power outlets would not fit the Jaguar I pace they had .
So Jaguar gave the guy his money back because the app for the car said all power outlets were compatible but there not.
Why would you make different plugs for the cars ?
Surely a standard fitting plug is a must.
Have heard lots of things like this, cars parked in the charging bays but not using them.
It’s all a bit hap hazard.

 

[USER1999]

An interesting thing we are seeing at work with plug in EVs using a standard 13A plug, is that the sockets are burning out in just a few months. They really do need a dedicated charging station.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

An interesting thing we are seeing at work with plug in EVs using a standard 13A plug, is that the sockets are burning out in just a few months. They really do need a dedicated charging station.

That is quite interesting and also disturbing. Is it the charging cable connection that is burning out or the socket it is plugged in to?

My lease car is due for renewal next year. The govt have worked the BIK system to make diesels hugely unattractive so a plug in hybrid is looking attractive, depending on the lease cost. I do semi regular long journeys to visit family and ideally I would plug in at the other end to load up my 30-40 mile electric range. It would be disappointing if that was not possible, I am not going to burn out my mums plug sockets! It will not stop me from getting one but it would be a negative that I would need to consider.

 

[bobmac]

Yes but the golf has a range of 144 miles and I am sure Scotland is further from Liverpool than that.
When it can do it in one charge maybe I will pull the trigger.

Saw a price on Telly by Angela Rippon about EV .
Most of the power outlets would not fit the Jaguar I pace they had .
So Jaguar gave the guy his money back because the app for the car said all power outlets were compatible but there not.
Why would you make different plugs for the cars ?
Surely a standard fitting plug is a must.
Have heard lots of things like this, cars parked in the charging bays but not using them.
It’s all a bit hap hazard.

You're right, because it's all still quite new.
The other problem is different charging companies needing different accounts and apps to pay for your electricity.
It's a bit like VHS and BETA MAX video recorders when they first came out.
I do believe these are all teething problems just like when the petrol/diesel cars first came out.

The main problems I hear a lot are
Too expensive
Not enough range
Not enough chargers
Batteries only last 2-3 years

Electric vehicle (EV) manufacturers are well aware of these and are working hard to solve these problems.
It just needs a bit of patience

 

[Hobbit]

That is quite interesting and also disturbing. Is it the charging cable connection that is burning out or the socket it is plugged in to?

My lease car is due for renewal next year. The govt have worked the BIK system to make diesels hugely unattractive so a plug in hybrid is looking attractive, depending on the lease cost. I do semi regular long journeys to visit family and ideally I would plug in at the other end to load up my 30-40 mile electric range. It would be disappointing if that was not possible, I am not going to burn out my mums plug sockets! It will not stop me from getting one but it would be a negative that I would need to consider.

Might be worth looking at a petrol hybrid Neil. I'm more than happy with our Kia Niro. The MPG is better than I expected and no need to find charging points. Bearing in mind you might need to do the odd run through to Bath, and potentially last minute, I'm not sure I'd go for the current plug-in hybrids because of the range.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

You're right, because it's all still quite new.
The other problem is different charging companies needing different accounts and apps to pay for your electricity.
It's a bit like VHS and BETA MAX video recorders when they first came out.
I do believe these are all teething problems just like when the petrol/diesel cars first came out.

The main problems I hear a lot are
Too expensive
Not enough range
Not enough chargers
Batteries only last 2-3 years

Electric vehicle (EV) manufacturers are well aware of these and are working hard to solve these problems.
It just needs a bit of patience

Bob, did you read this yesterday? https://metro.co.uk/2019/10/21/ex-navy-engineer-built-car-battery-1500-mile-range-10956749/

I know we are all looking for the miracle product but let's hope it has some legs.

Incidentally, I am definitely in the bracket of worrying about the first 3 points. I do not worry about the 4th now, I thought that had been resolved? Step by step..........

 

[bobmac]

Bob, did you read this yesterday? https://metro.co.uk/2019/10/21/ex-navy-engineer-built-car-battery-1500-mile-range-10956749/

I know we are all looking for the miracle product but let's hope it has some legs.

Incidentally, I am definitely in the bracket of worrying about the first 3 points. I do not worry about the 4th now, I thought that had been resolved? Step by step..........

I did read it and it looks very promising.
So does this though.......
https://observer.com/2019/09/tesla-elon-musk-million-mile-electric-car-battery/

Whoever comes up with a safe, long lasting multiple charging battery cell first will make a fortune cause they're ging to need a lot of them.

And you're right about battery life, they will now probably outlast the car.

https://www.zap-map.com/statistics/

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Might be worth looking at a petrol hybrid Neil. I'm more than happy with our Kia Niro. The MPG is better than I expected and no need to find charging points. Bearing in mind you might need to do the odd run through to Bath, and potentially last minute, I'm not sure I'd go for the current plug-in hybrids because of the range.

I have a sad mans spreadsheet on the go already, covering plug ins and non plug in hybrids. I am not ready for pure electric yet, I do too many journeys of 200 + miles in one hit, fully loaded and I don't want 'range anxiety' or have to plan charging stop offs. This is particularly key as the journey for me often involves trips through the Lakes, Cumbria etc where charging points will be even more rare and being stuck more scary.

The cars I am looking at that are plug in are still hybrids but should have a pure electric range of 35-40 miles. This could get me to work and back without the engine kicking in, if the range is accurate. It would also get me to the cinema, airport, Newcastle, golf club, Metro Centre etc and back without the engine firing up. I would lose on the long journeys when a little engine is moving a big car but hopefully the balance would be in my favour and it is obviously kinder. The two I am looking at in this area are the Passat GTE and the Skoda Superb E I think they are calling it. I would prefer the Superb, I have one now and love it, the dealer is a good one and is handily located for me. It all comes down to the lease cost.

If the plug ins are too pricey then I will be looking at the standard hybrids as you suggest (they are also on my spreadsheet ). Whatever happens, it will not be a diesel (30%-32% BIK )

 

[bobmac]

Are you factoring in the maintenance costs/servicing of EVs?

 

[Lazkir]

An interesting thing we are seeing at work with plug in EVs using a standard 13A plug, is that the sockets are burning out in just a few months. They really do need a dedicated charging station.

I have a dedicated 3.5Kw wall charger, but I quite often use my 13a plug in cable as I can set it on a timer to use the cheap electricity.
One thing I did do before I started using this was to swap the socket out for a good quality MK socket and make sure it was correctly installed (tight connections).
Having said that, if the sockets are burning out then it's almost definitely down to a poorly fitted or cheap socket as all the switching is done by the adaptor that's part of the cable. All sockets should be able to handle a steady 13a supply without any trouble, if they can't then they're either crap or faulty.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Are you factoring in the maintenance costs/servicing of EVs?

I will look at that nearer the time when I actually start getting the quotes in. It is a good point you make and part of the reason I have a spreadsheet on the go. I can just add columns to it showing additional costs and then have an end column showing the total 3yr cost. It is easy to cheat yourself and show a lower monthly cost but there are hidden costs that you can conveniently 'not see'. You need to see the whole package.

I get on well with the person in charge of leasing at my Skoda dealer, he is very straight, no lies and so I will be having a good chat with him nearer the time covering all aspects.

 

[bobmac]

Cost of installing a dedicated home charger
A home charging point, fully installed, costs from £279 with the government OLEV grant.

• Electric car drivers get a £500 grant for purchasing and installing a home charger with the OLEV grant.
• Once installed, you only pay for the electricity you use to charge.
• The typical electricity rate in the UK is about 14p per kWh, while on Economy 7 tariffs the typical overnight electricity rate in the UK is 8p per kWh.

https://pod-point.com/guides/driver/charging-electric-car-at-home

 

[bobmac]

I will look at that nearer the time when I actually start getting the quotes in.

I can save you the trouble.
I bottle of screenwash every 6 months/6000 miles

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I can save you the trouble.
I bottle of screenwash every 6 months/6000 miles

I did a quick check, the Passat needs a service every 20k miles or 2 yrs. As it happens my Superb is every 18k. I do 21k a year so it will not be much different in my case. I am aware though that there are far fewer parts, wear and tear is less, so costs should be lower.