Coronavirus - political views - supporting or otherwise...

[AmandaJR]

Wouldn't it be great if we could rely on teachers to be professional and not "over optimistic"...

 

[Deleted member 16999]

So depressing to see so many kids getting screwed over by a patently unfair system for awarding grades. Some really upsetting stories of students being awarded lower grades than they ever achieved in exams and having uni places withdrawn as a result. The way they are being treated ,postcodes affecting grades, is shameful.

Interesting stats here, just remember there’s no political influence.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1293835511266713601

 

[Deleted member 27823]

Who do you believe these people are wanting to screw kids over and why would they want to?

Not my point and not what I said.

Using data and algorithms for something like this is fundamentally flawed as it will embed the bias or misconceptions of those who develop it.

My twitter feed is full of tales of straight A students who have been downgraded from their mocks and teacher estimates and had uni places withdrawn.

I feel heart sick for them.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Wouldn't it be great if we could rely on teachers to be professional and not "over optimistic"...

Any proof or just a feeling?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

You guys are so predictable and so lacking in empathy. Not a care for kids who’ve had their futures blighted by this patently unfair process.

Kaz this years pupils will be blighted whatever the outcome.
Be sympathetic and employers etc will always query 2020 results.
No win situation.
Any political party/politician trying to make political advantage over this really needs to take a good look at themselves.

 

[SocketRocket]

Kaz this years pupils will be blighted whatever the outcome.
Be sympathetic and employers etc will always query 2020 results.
No win situation.
Any political party/politician trying to make political advantage over this really needs to take a good look at themselves.

What political advantage can be made from it. Maybe the Government should have made kids carry on schooling, is that what you would have preferred.

Not heard of anyone who had upgraded results complaining.

 

[Deleted member 27823]

Kaz this years pupils will be blighted whatever the outcome.
Be sympathetic and employers etc will always query 2020 results.
No win situation.
Any political party/politician trying to make political advantage over this really needs to take a good look at themselves.

I think that’s true but it’s the uni admissions that are most immediately and drastically impacted.

A more sympathetic approach is required, I think. Or at least one that doesn’t exacerbate the inequalities that already exist in our education system.

I see one college has said they’ll honour all conditional offers they made regardless of the grades awarded. It’d be good if others were able to follow.

 

[rulefan]

Wouldn't it be great if we could rely on teachers to be professional and not "over optimistic"...

My grandaughter was predicted to get A*AA by her teachers. She told her mother she only expected to get ABA. She said she had no chance of an A*.
Edinburgh required AAA and gave a provisional offer. She was awarded AAB and the uni gave her a place straight away.

 

[AmandaJR]

My grandaughter was predicted to get A*AA by her teachers. She told her mother she only expected to get ABA. She said she had no chance of an A*.
Edinburgh required AAA and gave a provisional offer. She was awarded AAB and the uni gave her a place straight away.

So why do the teachers predict an A*. That to me is where the flaw is in this whole system. Why on earth can't we rely on teachers to be honest in their assessment rather than bump everything up so they look good?!

 

[Deleted member 16999]

So why do the teachers predict an A*. That to me is where the flaw is in this whole system. Why on earth can't we rely on teachers to be honest in their assessment rather than bump everything up so they look good?!

Again! What are you basing the teacher’s dishonesty on?

They will of spent 2 years with the kid, seen how they apply themselves and results in mocks etc.

I would trust the teacher assessing the kid far more than an algorithm.

Are you asking for those kids in private schools and who studied less popular subjects, who you must obviously believe have been over graded, to be reassessed as they weren’t part of the algorithm.

 

[AmandaJR]

Again! What are you basing the teacher’s dishonesty on?

They will of spent 2 years with the kid, seen how they apply themselves and results in mocks etc.

I would trust the teacher assessing the kid far more than an algorithm.

Are you asking for those kids in private schools and who studied less popular subjects, who you must obviously believe have been over graded, to be reassessed as they weren’t part of the algorithm.

Basing it on the post above and the fact that every single article I've read states they are being over optimistic! Over optimistic being the term used but to me if they're over egging the grades then they've being dishonest and it's unfair to those who have gone before and sat exams, and will come after and sit exams.

I'm asking that EVERY student is giving a fair grade based upon their previous work and results. Simple. Being over optimistic and giving grades above that level doesn't work and isn't fair. There would be no need for an adjustment if the predicted grades were accurate.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Again! What are you basing the teacher’s dishonesty on?

They will of spent 2 years with the kid, seen how they apply themselves and results in mocks etc.

I would trust the teacher assessing the kid far more than an algorithm.

Are you asking for those kids in private schools and who studied less popular subjects, who you must obviously believe have been over graded, to be reassessed as they weren’t part of the algorithm.

In some of the more deprived areas of Scotland the teachers assessments on the lower performing pupils would have meant a +20% pass increase on 2019 figures. Pretty unrealistic IMO. Teachers not doing the kids any favours.
Overall results in Scotland were similar to England about 1% increases on 2019

Still to hear of any protests from the kids who were awarded higher than expected results.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Basing it on the post above and the fact that every single article I've read states they are being over optimistic! Over optimistic being the term used but to me if they're over egging the grades then they've being dishonest and it's unfair to those who have gone before and sat exams, and will come after and sit exams.

I'm asking that EVERY student is giving a fair grade based upon their previous work and results. Simple. Being over optimistic and giving grades above that level doesn't work and isn't fair. There would be no need for an adjustment if the predicted grades were accurate.

In some of the more deprived areas of Scotland the teachers assessments on the lower performing pupils would have meant a +20% pass increase on 2019 figures. Pretty unrealistic IMO. Teachers not doing the kids any favours.
Overall results in Scotland were similar to England about 1% increases on 2019

Still to hear of any protests from the kids who were awarded higher than expected results.

But as already mentioned, the algorithm has also awarded some kids higher grades!

Were’s the call to have those grades changed?

No teacher, imo, will of given a kid a grade (higher or lower) which could possibly disadvantage them in the future.

 

[SocketRocket]

A problem with Teachers being the only decision makers is there can tend to be a degree of favouritism, well unless things have changed dramatically from my and my childrens time at school. Teachers can easily let a like or dislike for a pupil cloud their view, IMO there also needs to be an independant method of marking or examining.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

I understood that the teacher's assessment was used as part of the grading process in addition to the school's historic results and performance in mocks.

Certainly I can understand the concerns of the authorities when based solely upon teacher assessments, some establishments would have achieved results far in excess of anything previously achieved.

 

[harpo_72]

A problem with Teachers being the only decision makers is there can tend to be a degree of favouritism, well unless things have changed dramatically from my and my childrens time at school. Teachers can easily let a like or dislike for a pupil cloud their view, IMO there also needs to be an independant method of marking or examining.

Your right, and they should use the mock exams and those papers should be sent to show that the mock was made up of past papers.
Of course non objective A levels are too open to interpretation and are just based on factual knowledge plus an ability to argument or make a point. So will all ways be open to variance in marking.

Then you have the kids who just step up when it comes to exams .. and they have not had a chance.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Mock exams are not always spot on, they are not independently moderated. Some teachers go hard in order to scare kids, others feed the kids the likely papers. At my daughter's school this year the maths mock was made up of 3 papers. The first paper was a 2018 one. The kids realised this and practised papers 2 and 3 from the same year. They did come up, they all did well. Should the govt go purely off their mock results when they are clearly tainted?

It's complicated and some have clearly got it wrong. You can't devalue the whole year by reverting to teachers predictions though, imo. There always needed to be a balance in that sense.

 

[Ethan]

Because just about anything must be a conspiracy.

Despite the fact that the method or algorithm has been developed by people with no political slant the personalisation of stuff polical means Gavin Williamson must be shot.

Getting a process to award grades across the whole of the education system is extremely challenging and will always generate winners and losers. Hopefully the Appeals process can address any grave mistakes.

If the algorithm had been developed by a chimp, it would probably not have a political slant, because as far as I am aware chimps do not have particular party affiliations. However, if that chimp reported to Gavin Williamson, then Gav ultimately carries the can. That is how political accountability works.

No paranoid conspiracy theories are needed. Shooting him is a bit extreme, making him NI Secretary should be sufficient.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

If the algorithm had been developed by a chimp, it would probably not have a political slant, because as far as I am aware chimps do not have particular party affiliations. However, if that chimp reported to Gavin Williamson, then Gav ultimately carries the can. That is how political accountability works.

No paranoid conspiracy theories are needed. Shooting him is a bit extreme, making him NI Secretary should be sufficient.

If there was a political slant to the whole exercise then surely the teachers' gradings would stand thereby enabling the Government to claim a success in their education policies.

I'm afraid that this is a situation from which no one is going to emerge unscathed.

Teachers will be accused of misleading pupils by inflating grades.

Pupils may find their future plans thrown into disarray.

Government will be slammed whichever method had been used in the absence of exams.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

With people losing uni places surely the unis and jobs can be like hmm it's a national scandle so no loss of place

Seems like even though the gov failed everyone is willing to accept it and just blame the gov rather than step up and say right your predicted grades were AAA so we will offer you a place for exceptional circumstances which also is affecting everyone