Coronavirus - political views - supporting or otherwise...

[Deleted member 18588]

Well said.

By saying steps behind, I was inferring that when England moved into lockdown they were 2/3 days behind Ireland\NI\Wales and Scotland.
I felt that Scotland should have taken the initial steps at least 3/4 days before they did....Cheltenham being an example.
Johnson was reluctantly pressurised into moving even then, which in IMVHO made him at least a week behind where a more switched on leader would have been.

As the UK (inc. Scotland) went into lockdown on 23 March in what way were Scotland, NI,or Wales ahead of England?

 

[Old Skier]

As the UK (inc. Scotland) went into lockdown on 23 March in what way were Scotland, NI,or Wales ahead of England?

Shhhs it's a game, he will claim your on ignore and never respond

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Exceed expectations, and everyone is happy. Fail to meet them and its a busted flush.

...and today - tests processed yesterday 69,000...

Don't know what's going on here, especially as the PM earlier today in the HoC set a target of 200,000 tests a day by the end of the month, for #10 to later row back on that saying that he was meaning to say 'capacity' not processed. For goodness sake...

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/pol...s-per-day-target-by-end-of-june-a4433691.html

And of course Farage is ranting that the media reps on the briefing are not asking the searching questions in respect of the government's failure on the testing front...where is LK (of the BBC) when you need her

Well he should understand the media better than most.

And in answer to his question - as it was Jenrick doing the briefing and some of the media present on the briefing were regional-based - they asked questions of importance to their region and in the remit of the Jenrick to answer - so focussed on Housing, Communities and Local Government - which in truth is what we'd want asked as we would have a chance of getting a proper and informed answer.

 

[Old Skier]

...and today - tests processed yesterday 69,000...

Don't know what's going on here, especially as the PM earlier today in the HoC set a target of 200,000 tests a day by the end of the month, for #10 to later row back on that saying that he was meaning to say 'capacity' not processed. For goodness sake...

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/pol...s-per-day-target-by-end-of-june-a4433691.html

And of course Farage is ranting that the media reps on the briefing are not asking the searching questions in respect of the government's failure on the testing front...where is LK (of the BBC) when you need her

Well he should understand the media better than most.

And in answer to his question - as it was Jenrick doing the briefing and some of the media present on the briefing were regional-based - they asked questions of importance to their region and in the remit of the Jenrick to answer - so focussed on Housing, Communities and Local Government - which in truth is what we'd want asked as we would have a chance of getting a proper and informed answer.

Job for the army, fix bayonets and march everyone down to a testing center.

With so many public sector workers claiming that they are having to self isolate due to having symptoms why do you @SwingsitlikeHogan think capacity has outgrown demand.

 

[Wolf]

Shhhs it's a game, he will claim your on ignore and never respond

You're of course right, he's never let something simple like the facts get in the way of a blind view....

 

[Lord Tyrion]

At the moment, I think, they are only testing people who believe they are showing symptoms. What if we don't have 100k people each day who believe they are showing symptoms?

The interesting question is how many want tests but can't get them. Is that not more relevant?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Or gullibility gap, depending on how you want to spin it.

Agree that 54% is pretty high for Westminster Gov,

 

[rudebhoy]

The number of people tested on Monday as per yesterday's figures was 69k. This figure has gone down every weekday since the high of 88k last Thursday. I know the figures are generally lower for weekends, but that's 2 weekdays in a row the figure has gone down which is concerning. Has any explanation been given for the drop?

Only 57,006 people tested yesterday. Meanwhile care homes are still saying they can't get tests booked.

What is going on?

And before some clever clogs comes along to blame lack of demand, if that really is the case, why not ramp up front line testing and test NHS staff daily?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Why does it bother people in England what she says, continually told she is an irrelevance but gets name called and constant criticism too from EngTories, why is that? Does she even make the news in England? She is there as FM to represent everything devolved to us in Scotland, including health. If she opts to do things a little differently we can judge her and her party on that at the 2021 Holyrood elections and give her the boot if needs be.
We may see a Starmer bounce for Labour in 2021 but I seriously doubt there will any Johnson benefit for ScotTories next year, man is toxic and inept.
The daily brief up here is a good 4 hours earlier than London, not surprising things get announced earlier therefore.

Actually looking at things from down here I think the Scottish FM is getting a pretty positive response.

In fact my (English) Mrs is quite a Nicola fan - says that she speaks with an authentic voice and fronts up the briefings well and seems on top of her difficult brief. That she then somewhat undermines her thoughtful stance on the FM by telling me that the white high heels are pretty darned smart, and that the FM presents herself extremely well...well...so be it.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

As the UK (inc. Scotland) went into lockdown on 23 March in what way were Scotland, NI,or Wales ahead of England?

Ireland annoiunced the closure of schools on 12 March followed by Scotland, NI and Wales...........obviously forcing Johnson's hand.

 

[Old Skier]

Ireland annoiunced the closure of schools on 12 March followed by Scotland, NI and Wales...........obviously forcing Johnson's hand.

Or - NI Scotland and Wales were in the same Cobra briefing where the decisions were made

 

[drdel]

At the moment, I think, they are only testing people who believe they are showing symptoms. What if we don't have 100k people each day who believe they are showing symptoms?

The interesting question is how many want tests but can't get them. Is that not more relevant?

Unfortunately it seems a simple fact that the media and some on here do not want to recognise is the interlocked feedback circular cycle of "production - capacity -demand". The Government has built up a testing capacity in just the same way as the Nigthingale hospitals have created additional treatment capacity: Covid19 cases are well below both the tests demanded (70k v 120k /day) as well as NHS's ITU hospital bed capacity

People are pleased we have not needed the extra beds in these new hospitals but then moan because we have not yet needed to use the full testing capacity - surely as long as those who need a test are getting the option of a test, the headway in capacity is a good thing. The plan is to add more testing capacity (200k/day in next 3 weeks) so that if the 'track-n-trace' flags up more potential infections then tests are available. Not doubt that will generate more complaints as the detected rate rises because we test and find more.

It is a classic dilemma of knowledge: the more we learn and the harder we look the more we will find yet the more we find the more the knowledge driven actions will be criticised.

At the moment the UK is being rubbished because of the high mortality. The UK is very, very careful to record all deaths related to the virus and is trying to establish the true 'Excess' deaths. Other nations record deaths differently and may not look so hard at verification of cause - especially those deaths occurring outside of hospital settings.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Unfortunately it seem a simple fact that the media and some on here do not want to recognise the interlocked feedback circular cycle of "production - capacity -demand". The Government has built up a testing capacity in just the same way as the Nigthingale hospitals have created additional treatment capacity and Covid19 cases are well below both the tests demanded (70k v 120k /day) as well as NHS's ITU hospital bed capacity

People are pleased we have not needed the extra beds in these new hospitals but then moan because we have not yet needed to use the full testing capacity - surely as long as those who need a test are getting the option of a test, the headway in capacity is a good thing. The plan is to add more testing capacity (200k/day in next 3 weeks) so that if the 'track-n-trace' flags up more potential infections tests are available. Not doubt that will generate more complaints at the detected rate rises because we test and find more.

It is a classic dilemma of knowledge the more we learn and the harder we look the more we will find yet the more we find the more the knowledge driven actions will be criticised.

At the moment the UK is being rubbished because of the high mortality. The UK is very, very careful to record all deaths related to the virus and is trying to establish the 'Excess' deaths. Other nations record deaths differently and may not look so hard at verification of cause - especially those deaths occurring outside of hospital settings.

Any evidence that we are the most thorough when looking at the verification of cause of death outside of hospital settings?

 

[drdel]

Any evidence that we are the most thorough when looking at the verification of cause of death outside of hospital settings?

Yes. The issues has been raised continuously by Prof Whitty, Prof Ferguson and Prof Van-Tam. and other academics.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Ireland annoiunced the closure of schools on 12 March followed by Scotland, NI and Wales...........obviously forcing Johnson's hand.

Scotland announced closure of schools on Friday 20th March, England made the same announcement on Monday 23rd March.

Hardly a significant difference.

 

[rudebhoy]

Yes. The issues has been raised continuously by Prof Whitty, Prof Ferguson and Prof Van-Tam. and other academics.

That sounds like opinion, not evidence.

I'm sure if you went to Spain, Italy or the US, their scientists would also say their method of counting is the most accurate.

The FT have estimated that the actual amount of deaths in the UK is more than double what is being reported, so obviously they don't think the method of counting here is exhaustive.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Yes. The issues has been raised continuously by Prof Whitty, Prof Ferguson and Prof Van-Tam. and other academics.

So are we a lot more thorough then say Germany?

 

[Deleted member 18588]

So are we a lot more thorough then say Germany?

No reason why we shouldn't be.

But who knows, at the moment there appears to be no "international" standard for collating this information.

 

[drdel]

So are we a lot more thorough then say Germany?

Some German academics suggest the official numbers may be as much as 10 times too low !! Highlights the real issue of data compatibility and integrity across nations.

 

[funkycoldmedina]

Some German academics suggest the official numbers may be as much as 10 times too low !! Highlights the real issue of data compatibility and integrity across nations.

That study was about number of infections I believe not deaths.