sawtooth
Tour Winner
I think it may depend on what type of golfer your are, a swinger or a hitter. The latter probably requires more strength whereas the arm swinger relies more on perfect timing i would say.
clubhead speed
- Thread starter macca64
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duncan mackie
Money List Winner
starting to make sense put like this but, and it's a huge but in the context of this thread, "golf technique does improve club head speed obviously, as does simply trying to swing the club harder"
'swinging the club harder' does not increase club head speed for the majority of club level players. anyone who has had time with launch monitors and fitting services will know that 'slashing at the ball - technical term for trying to hit it harder - is not the way to increase the club head speed. this may well be what the original quote you provided was trying to get at - until you are hitting it 250 with a smooth normal swing and little effort there is no point in trying to 'hit it' further by, for example, speeding up the hands or shoulders because you won't have the underlying timing in place to benefit from any small increase in hand speed you can achieve.
timchump
Q-School Graduate
yep i think you undertsand what i m getting at, im probably not coming across well,
i do question trying to swing the club harder doesn't create more club head speed though, i think it does to an extent but has an upper limit, for example with an average technique i think it would be nearly impossible to swing a driver at 120 mph but would thought it possible to increase club head speed say from 90 100 mph by just being more aggresive.
For me it would anyway, I hit long drives in my first year of golf, as proabaly as long as a good un goes for me now,
but i would like to think my technique has improved over the 10+ years and hundreds of lessons
i think everbody has had a freak long driver where they've swung hard, and through pure luck the club was applied to the ball correctly, resulting in 260+ yards
though most amateurs their swing isn't sound enough to hold togehter repeatedley when turning on the power.
hence saying until you can drive at least 250 yards without turning on the power, dont turn on the power
again i think hitting harder does mean more distance - correctly applied, im sure a lot of women on the LPGA have superior techniques to their counter parts
in relation OP yes 75 mph is a little slow, and yep he's right he should have quite an arc on it given his stature, it's more than likely down to poor technique, than turning on the power, until i see his swing i don't know for sure, i would guess he has something that is slowing the club head down approaching impact, casting, hips not getting out the way etc, which could be happening for a number of reasons.
i do question trying to swing the club harder doesn't create more club head speed though, i think it does to an extent but has an upper limit, for example with an average technique i think it would be nearly impossible to swing a driver at 120 mph but would thought it possible to increase club head speed say from 90 100 mph by just being more aggresive.
For me it would anyway, I hit long drives in my first year of golf, as proabaly as long as a good un goes for me now,
but i would like to think my technique has improved over the 10+ years and hundreds of lessons
i think everbody has had a freak long driver where they've swung hard, and through pure luck the club was applied to the ball correctly, resulting in 260+ yards
though most amateurs their swing isn't sound enough to hold togehter repeatedley when turning on the power.
hence saying until you can drive at least 250 yards without turning on the power, dont turn on the power
again i think hitting harder does mean more distance - correctly applied, im sure a lot of women on the LPGA have superior techniques to their counter parts
in relation OP yes 75 mph is a little slow, and yep he's right he should have quite an arc on it given his stature, it's more than likely down to poor technique, than turning on the power, until i see his swing i don't know for sure, i would guess he has something that is slowing the club head down approaching impact, casting, hips not getting out the way etc, which could be happening for a number of reasons.
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Region3
Ryder Cup Winner
In a lot of cases, trying to hit it harder results in a slower swing speed due to tense muscles not moving as fast.
If I have to go after one I think about turning faster and really whipping the club through.
I read an article once about trying to hit the ball harder. It came to the conclusion that a reasonably strong man purposely trying to push the club through faster using brute strength could only add between 1 and 2mph to club head speed by doing so. Hardly seems worth the effort or risk.
If I have to go after one I think about turning faster and really whipping the club through.
I read an article once about trying to hit the ball harder. It came to the conclusion that a reasonably strong man purposely trying to push the club through faster using brute strength could only add between 1 and 2mph to club head speed by doing so. Hardly seems worth the effort or risk.
RGDave
Money List Winner
No. You're not wrong.
(?) too much beer.
Interesting to see people in action on a LM. "I'll really go all out for this one", and often...no real difference at all.
It's all very well mashing the hell out of it, but 9/10 your ratio of clubhead speed to ball speed is going to suffer.
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not to mention side spin!
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
Forcing clubhead speen with brute force will create tension in the arms and wrists, this will reduce clubhead speed.
Try this: Hold a ballpoint pen between your thumb and forefinger.
Flicking your wrists back and forwards a number of times with a very relaxed hold and arm see how fast you can move the pen.
Now grip the pen tightly with tensed muscles in your wrist and arm and flick the pen back and forwards again.
Distance is created by a number of conditions measured as 'The Smash Factor" Clubhead speed is an important part of creating ball distance but if good impact is not created then it will not be fully effective.
Try this: Hold a ballpoint pen between your thumb and forefinger.
Flicking your wrists back and forwards a number of times with a very relaxed hold and arm see how fast you can move the pen.
Now grip the pen tightly with tensed muscles in your wrist and arm and flick the pen back and forwards again.
Distance is created by a number of conditions measured as 'The Smash Factor" Clubhead speed is an important part of creating ball distance but if good impact is not created then it will not be fully effective.
Foxholer
Blackballed
Smash Factor is simply Ball Speed divided by Clubhead Speed - nothing more/less. It's a measure of 'efficiency' (quality) of strike - with 1.5 being the max possible (from a legal Driver).
Someone hcreating a 160mph ball speed, but a Smash Factor of 1.35(or any other value) will hit the ball the same as someone else with a 160mph ball speed and smash factor of 1.5 - all other factors being identical. By better technique, the lower SF player could almost certainly improve easier than the one with a higher SF.
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timchump
Q-School Graduate
hmm not sure i agree with a generic hitting it harder doesn't necessary create more club head speed, if somebody told me to hit it harder i would try and spin my hips as fast/hard as possible......
though agree pushing the club through as hard as possible wouldn't create more club head speed , but i think thats a different discussion/point
though agree pushing the club through as hard as possible wouldn't create more club head speed , but i think thats a different discussion/point
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Foxholer
Blackballed
I can certainly confirm from experience (on a Launch Monitor as well as course) that my 'flowing' swing was/is faster than my 'Welly it' one - by about 5mph!
timchump
Q-School Graduate
i better get on a launch monitor!
from my experiece hitting it harder i get more carry (possibly in the wrong direction) which i take as a measure of club head speed.
im not condoning hitting it hard in anyway i'm just suroprised by these responses.
if i could convince myself a nice flowing swinging equaled more club head speed it would really change my approach
one of my favourite parts of the game for me is lauching a drive, especially in the summer
from my experiece hitting it harder i get more carry (possibly in the wrong direction) which i take as a measure of club head speed.
im not condoning hitting it hard in anyway i'm just suroprised by these responses.
if i could convince myself a nice flowing swinging equaled more club head speed it would really change my approach
one of my favourite parts of the game for me is lauching a drive, especially in the summer
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Assuming centeredness of strike and smash factor are consistent then more clubhead speed will equal more distance. To go back to the OP is it strength? No. It's as much flowing rythm as it is pure muscle but it IS a combination of both (strength being an alround measure of contributing parts and flexibility, not just what your bicep can achieve).
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Swinger
Journeyman Pro
I find 65% the best number to swing at to keep good club head speed and everything in control.
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
interesting observation from the man with probably the highest clubhead speed of those posting here....
Foxholer
Blackballed
This seems waaay too low to me.
No chance of the 3/4 (75%) swing.
To go into WRX/BSG mode...Leaving yards on the table!
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
Yes thats correct although the factor is an output, there are a number of inputs that affect the SF like centeredness of hit, effective loft and clubhead speed.
Foxholer
Blackballed
It's Ball Speed that is affected by the other factors!
Smash Factor merely quantifies a particular swing/strike agains an 'ideal' one.
Read the paragraph below the quoted one in this article. http://www.andrewricegolf.com/2011/06/how-to-hit-it-longer-than-ever/
or here: [URL]http://www.planetruthgolf.com/PlayerResources/Forums/tabid/77/aft/28424/Default.aspx
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SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
Is'nt it saying the same thing? Get the best set of launch conditions you can to max distance.
Foxholer
Blackballed
I'm not simply after max distance. It's Optimum distance/Straightness I'm after.
I can squeak a few extra mph out of my swing - with the same SF - but other measurable attributes (sidespin, face angle at impact etc) will affect where the ball ends up - and I certainly don't want to hit an 'ideal strike' and end up in the trees!
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
"Best set of launch conditions you can to max distance" Not maximum distance possible but your own maximised effective distance. Well! thats what I meant anyhow.
Swinger
Journeyman Pro
I just like feeling in control and putting a smooth movement on the ball!
It may not look that way though!
