Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[SocketRocket]

View attachment 26079

Thought you were more grown up than this.

 

[bluewolf]

The fact that it's brewed in Burton is not the issue, Burton was still in the UK last time I went there. Does this mean the workers had a 90% pay cut then.
A British Steak from Lidl was still made in the UK, did the producer get a 90% pay cut.
My Barbour Jacket is 10 years old and still holding together, it's not really a luxury brand but more of a good quality British brand and great value for money seeing it keeps a British worker employed and spreading the cost works out very reasonable. Did Barbour employees get a 90% wage cut.
I accept I was wrong with the Clarke's shoes but it's good to hear they are returning some production to Street. Will these employees get a 90% wage cut.

It's not a British Company. The process is automated. the Hops are most likely eastern European. They haven't had a 90% pay cut. There are just less people working on it. Which equates to exactly the same thing....

Sorry, your Sp on the original post looked more like Burberry than Barbour. And it's not an affordable brand for many. For instance, I have a Barbour flat cap. It cost £45. I have a Barbour shirt. It cost £70. I have a Barbour jacket. It cost over £200. If you think that this is affordable for most then you really don't understand the state of British finances.

Your British steak was farmed using automated methods and then the butchery process was automated. This requires much less land, cheaper feed and less people working on it.

You appear to have taken issue with the direction that Capitalism is taking. Look around you, analyse the deficit/debt. Take notice that we have one of the worst State Pension schemes in the developed World (It might also be worthwhile noting that the EU is very unhappy with our paltry State Pension and would like it to fall in line with the rest of Europe - I wonder why this isn't being publicised?). Look at where the money has actually gone over the last 10 years.

 

[Foxholer]

...I purchased a very nice pint of Doombar at £2.50 in a local hostilary today....

Ok.Doombar is not British. It's brewed in Burton on Trent and owned by Molsen Coors.

A minor point to perhaps correct an otherwise fine post...If the Doombar was draft, as I expect it was, then it was brewed in Rock. Bottled Doombar is brewed in Burton.

 

[Beezerk]

Thought you were more grown up than this.

I can’t believe he managed to post it, I tried the other week but the file was too big 😂😂😂

 

[SocketRocket]

It's not a British Company. The process is automated. the Hops are most likely eastern European. They haven't had a 90% pay cut. There are just less people working on it. Which equates to exactly the same thing....

Sorry, your Sp on the original post looked more like Burberry than Barbour. And it's not an affordable brand for many. For instance, I have a Barbour flat cap. It cost £45. I have a Barbour shirt. It cost £70. I have a Barbour jacket. It cost over £200. If you think that this is affordable for most then you really don't understand the state of British finances.

Your British steak was farmed using automated methods and then the butchery process was automated. This requires much less land, cheaper feed and less people working on it.

You appear to have taken issue with the direction that Capitalism is taking. Look around you, analyse the deficit/debt. Take notice that we have one of the worst State Pension schemes in the developed World (It might also be worthwhile noting that the EU is very unhappy with our paltry State Pension and would like it to fall in line with the rest of Europe - I wonder why this isn't being publicised?). Look at where the money has actually gone over the last 10 years.

My Barbour Jacket works out at £14 a year, IMO that's very good value for money and more affordable than buying a £50 Matalan one that lasts 18 months. I think.you will find the hops in Doombar are grown in Herefordshire and the Lidl steak traceable to the farm the animal was breed.

 

[bluewolf]

A minor point to perhaps correct an otherwise fine post...If the Doombar was draft, as I expect it was, then it was brewed in Rock. Bottled Doombar is brewed in Burton.

An excellent point
Still about as British as Jaguar land Rover.....

 

[bluewolf]

My Barbour Jacket works out at £14 a year, IMO that's very good value for money and more affordable than buying a £50 Matalan one that lasts 18 months. I think.you will find the hops in Doombar ate grown in Herefordshire and the Lidl steak traceable to the farm the animal was breed.

I think you'll find that the hops are sourced from wherever is cheaper at the time, and Eastern Europe actually produces far better hops that the British versions on which they base themselves on due to the better weather (for hops anyway). Pretty much all hops are bought from Brokers. There has been a significant hop shortage over the last 5 years due to the appropriation of hop growing land for more profitable crops. That is changing at the moment as the price of hops has rocketed recently. Just try getting hold of certain American or New Zealand hops. They have been bought in bulk before they've even been grown..

And I didn't question where the meat came from, just how it was raised and butchered.. Nice try though..

Also, the yearly cost of your jacket is irrelevant unless Banks are now giving out loans for clothes. I have a Napapijri jacket that I've had for about 15 years. It's great and works out at about £25 per year. Of course, if the unemployed were to be seen wearing Barbour and Napapjri then this forum would be up in arms about a life on benefits being too cushy.. They just can't win can they?

 

[Mudball]

The fact that it's brewed in Burton is not the issue, Burton was still in the UK last time I went there. Does this mean the workers had a 90% pay cut then.
A British Steak from Lidl was still made in the UK, did the producer get a 90% pay cut.
My Barbour Jacket is 10 years old and still holding together, it's not really a luxury brand but more of a good quality British brand and great value for money seeing it keeps a British worker employed and spreading the cost works out very reasonable. Did Barbour employees get a 90% wage cut.
I accept I was wrong with the Clarke's shoes but it's good to hear they are returning some production to Street. Will these employees get a 90% wage cut.

irrespective of if Burton is in the UK or not or Barbour/Burburry is made in the UK, the truth is that supply chains are now global. Even Scottish Salmon comes to your plate via China (https://www.heraldscotland.com/news...ack-again-cods-10000-mile-trip-to-your-table/ ).. I guess the point is that if we think we can simply pull up the drawbridge as a way to exclude 'foreigners'/immigrants and continue to function the way we are then we are mistaken. Tarriffs will go up, yes trade will continue, there will be winners and losers. The key question will we have more winners than losers? the real answer is no one really knows. Its is a leap into the unknow of a cliff whose height no one can guage.

Will it bring Scottish Salmon processing back to the UK? Sure it can? However, can you afford to eat salmon processed in Scotland - i cant answer that.
In comparison - The great Orange Head Fearless Leader of the free World wants automakers to move manufacturing to the US and create thousands of jobs. The car manufacturers can do that because the Orange one is throwing a lot of tariff incentives. The small detail is that new factories employee very few people directly. So they will create a hundred job rather than thousands.

 

[MegaSteve]

Back in the 60's Dad took us to where he 'holidayed ' as a kid... It was a hop farm in Kent.. The farmer allowed us on site to check out the accommodation, which was still in place, more or less oversized dog kennels... Certainly no centre parks... Believe most hops grown in Kent nowadays is for decorative purposes...

For lunch I am having some German style soup made in the Netherlands purchased from a German shop... Aldis! Wonder if they feel the same, as I do, eating British chocolate made on the continent...

 

[doublebogey7]

The layer of bureaucracy that absolutely burns my ass! The police and crime commissioners. An example, Vera Bird, the ex-Labour MP who lost her seat several years back. A failed politician gets the ‘safe seat’ as an elected commissioner in a Labour area. Don’t spend money on this, spend it directly on the Police service. They bring in these positions and the service continues to go backwards due to lack of funding.

And what has this got to do with the EU

 

[SocketRocket]

I think you'll find that the hops are sourced from wherever is cheaper at the time, and Eastern Europe actually produces far better hops that the British versions on which they base themselves on due to the better weather (for hops anyway). Pretty much all hops are bought from Brokers. There has been a significant hop shortage over the last 5 years due to the appropriation of hop growing land for more profitable crops. That is changing at the moment as the price of hops has rocketed recently. Just try getting hold of certain American or New Zealand hops. They have been bought in bulk before they've even been grown..

And I didn't question where the meat came from, just how it was raised and butchered.. Nice try though..

Also, the yearly cost of your jacket is irrelevant unless Banks are now giving out loans for clothes. I have a Napapijri jacket that I've had for about 15 years. It's great and works out at about £25 per year. Of course, if the unemployed were to be seen wearing Barbour and Napapjri then this forum would be up in arms about a life on benefits being too cushy.. They just can't win can they?

why not take a look at Lidls site and see how they only use meat from sustainable sources who have high animal welfare standards and conform to the repairs and red tractor standards, just take a look. Then have a look at Sharps site and see how they brew their beer and source ingredients. If you think the average person can't afford a Barbour Jacket then just open your eyes and see what cars they drive and clothes they wear.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

why not take a look at Lidls site and see how they only use meat from sustainable sources who have high animal welfare standards and conform to the repairs and red tractor standards, just take a look. Then have a look at Sharps site and see how they brew their beer and source ingredients. If you think the average person can't afford a Barbour Jacket then just open your eyes and see what cars they drive and clothes they wear.

What is your idea of the “average person” because you don’t see the “average person” spending over £150 on a coat !

I can’t wait to live your land of milk and honey and all the opportunities that are going just appear

 

[bluewolf]

why not take a look at Lidls site and see how they only use meat from sustainable sources who have high animal welfare standards and conform to the repairs and red tractor standards, just take a look. Then have a look at Sharps site and see how they brew their beer and source ingredients. If you think the average person can't afford a Barbour Jacket then just open your eyes and see what cars they drive and clothes they wear.

Ok. I'll humour you on the first one. You're arguing the wrong point though.

I don't need to look at the 2nd one. I've been to both breweries and I know exactly what hops they use. The Northdown is local but the northern grower and perle are predominantly German with some from Eastern Europe when stocks are low. I've actually brewed a clone version myself but have to up the malt bill as I can't get past 90% efficiency.

For your 3rd point, you're being disingenuous. It's not about average, it's about the poorest in society. Your comments smack of "Let them eat cake".

Oh, and I class myself as pretty average and I drive a 10 year old Honda and shop predominantly at Debenhams. I can't afford more than one holiday a year as we have school age kids. I shop at Lidl as it's cheaper and I don't really treat myself to anything other than good golf clubs and wine/beer..

The people you are looking at are in quite a bit of debt (I don't have any other than a small mortgage) and are only 2 payslips away from the breadline. They aint average, they're the modern consumer.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Labour promising Scotland the biggest transfer of power and funding in 70 years if they support them in the next election, says McDonald.

[Sub plot…..We really mean it this time, honest, trust us we are different from the other Labour guys who continually broke their promises]

 

[bluewolf]

Ok. I'll humour you on the first one. You're arguing the wrong point though.

I don't need to look at the 2nd one. I've been to both breweries and I know exactly what hops they use. The Northdown is local but the northern grower and perle are predominantly German with some from Eastern Europe when stocks are low. I've actually brewed a clone version myself but have to up the malt bill as I can't get past 90% efficiency.

For your 3rd point, you're being disingenuous. It's not about average, it's about the poorest in society. Your comments smack of "Let them eat cake".

Oh, and I class myself as pretty average and I drive a 10 year old Honda and shop predominantly at Debenhams. I can't afford more than one holiday a year as we have school age kids. I shop at Lidl as it's cheaper and I don't really treat myself to anything other than good golf clubs and wine/beer..

The people you are looking at are in quite a bit of debt (I don't have any other than a small mortgage) and are only 2 payslips away from the breadline. They aint average, they're the modern consumer.

As an aside to this SR, we do appear to be agreeing on quite a lot. We may disagree on the answer (or at least the scale of the answer) but at least we all can see that there are big problems ahead. So on that note, i'm tipping my Barbour chapeau to you and bowing out for the time being. I have quite a bit of work to do, then I have to take my daughter to her athletics club (in my 10 year old Honda), then I have a rather nice Shiraz in the cupboard and a Cloudwater Bourbon Barrel aged Stout that is like drinking whiskey flavoured dark matter.. Simply gorgeous (but at £15 a bottle, an occasional treat)..

 

[IanM]

Labour promising Scotland the biggest transfer of power and funding in 70 years if they support them in the next election, says McDonald.

Dinnae worry Hen, Brussels w'ha tha off ye wi'in 5 years!

 

[Foxholer]

...
I don't need to look at the 2nd one. I've been to both breweries and I know exactly what hops they use. The Northdown is local but the northern grower and perle are predominantly German with some from Eastern Europe when stocks are low. I've actually brewed a clone version myself but have to up the malt bill as I can't get past 90% efficiency.

I trust you meant Northern Brewer
Don't you just love 'autocorrect/autofill'!

I too have been to (Rock) Brewery - before Molson Coors took it over - and I think before any was brewed in Burton. Not all that far from fabulous St Enedoc! St Auistell Brewery is worth a visit too.

 

[bluewolf]

I trust you meant Northern Brewer
Don't you just love 'autocorrect/autofill'!

I too have been to Brewery - before Molson Coors took it over. Not all that far from fabulous St Enedoc!

😂 I did. Not sure what I put to see it corrected to that! At least it didn't use one of my many "added" words. That could've seen me off the forum 😳

 

[bluewolf]

Anyway. I've been thinking about what is the most likely turn of events (no conspiracy theories).

For me, we're about to see the Deal fall short by approximately 100 votes. This will then lead on to a second referendum with a binary choice. No Deal or No Brexit.

Not sure what the outcome of that will be though. Still too close to call 🤷‍♂️

 

[Hobbit]

And what has this got to do with the EU

Absolutely nothing! The discussion at that point was about not blaming the EU for all our ills. But thanks for clearing that up