Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Foxholer]

...
My hope now is for May to go (and hopefully take a lot of other of the current crop on both sides with her) and the EU then giving us more time to try and negotiate with new faces in charge. We come to a compromise that will absolutely please no one but is the best we will get, some kind of deal is arranged and we then spend the next few decades still arguing about it.

It was a poisoned chalice - that she was prepared to sup from. Probably didn't envisage that EU negotiators would take such a 'hard' line! Or maybe she was happy to arrive at this point and force a 2nd referendum, with a different result!

And the alternatives to May as PM aren't particularly great imo!

 

[chrisd]

I'm not sure that logic flows. The Deal to leave was worse than our current position because it had to be. For the very same reason they can't arrange a better deal for us to Stay.

They could give us a better deal to stay than the one to leave, they could give other member state better terms they could, if they really wanted to, to run the show properly 🤔

 

[Hobbit]

If we do go for another vote I'd like to see all leavers protest by abstaining, I know it wont happen but let's face it, democracy
will be dead at that point anyway.

One of my very best friends, an ardent Remainer who even handed out leaflets on the Saturdays in the run up to the referendum, has said she will, very reluctantly, vote Leave if there’s a second vote. In her view, democracy comes first.

 

[chrisd]

One of my very best friends, an ardent Remainer who even handed out leaflets on the Saturdays in the run up to the referendum, has said she will, very reluctantly, vote Leave if there’s a second vote. In her view, democracy comes first.

I only wish that all voters would see the point Brian. Where would politics go from there?

 

[Hacker Khan]

One of my very best friends, an ardent Remainer who even handed out leaflets on the Saturdays in the run up to the referendum, has said she will, very reluctantly, vote Leave if there’s a second vote. In her view, democracy comes first.

Any my mum who voted to leave the first time said she would vote to remain now as she felt she was lied to about the supposed benefits, the supposed ease of leaving and getting trade deals and the state of country after a hard Brexit for her grandchildren. Both are right in their minds and mind the minds of many others. Including me.

 

[SocketRocket]

A refresher on what was promised to the public by the Prime Minister. It was very clear how the referendum result would be honoured. If Brexit is not carried out then how could there be any faith in our democracy or politicians. Play it and consider what was said.

 

[BubbaP]

"No Deal or No Brexit."
As in Hard Brexit or No Brexit?

Funny how people are different. I can understand what is meant by "no deal"

Whereas "Hard Brexit" just seems like a made up media phrase which each person can interpret differently.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Dinnae worry Hen, Brussels w'ha tha off ye wi'in 5 years!

If you had read the second line you would [perhaps] have understood that there would be no chance of getting it in the first place.

 

[Hobbit]

Funny how people are different. I can understand what is meant by "no deal"

Wheares "Hard Brexit" just seems like a made up media phrase which each person can interpret differently.

Ah, but hard Brexit has negative connotations. Don't forget, "crash out," and "cliff edge."

 

[Doon frae Troon]

UKIP no longer a threat to Tories since the new head seems matey with some unsavouries! (No, not David Lammy!)

Refererendum was only called as they were told there was no way of "losing!"

Scottish UKIP leader resigns because UKIP is becoming anti Muslim and pro English Nationalist.
Becoming ?

He must have blanked his own anti Muslim comments last year.

 

[ColchesterFC]

Ah, but hard Brexit has negative connotations. Don't forget, "crash out," and "cliff edge."

And "not knowing if the tide is in or out" and "rocks at the bottom of the cliff".

 

[bluewolf]

Well, I think we can all agree that my first week as Pritti Patel's PR Person went well? 😉

 

[SocketRocket]

Funny how people are different. I can understand what is meant by "no deal"

Whereas "Hard Brexit" just seems like a made up media phrase which each person can interpret differently.

Its similar to 'crashing into the EU' or 'A hard remain'

 

[Hacker Khan]

Funny how people are different. I can understand what is meant by "no deal"

Whereas "Hard Brexit" just seems like a made up media phrase which each person can interpret differently.

I asked as I was not sure if the OP meant a hard brexit in the sense that most people understand a hard brexit to be, or a no deal and go back to renegotiate.

In a world of 'Taxpayers alliances' and 'European Research Groups', getting upset that someone has said Hard Brexit, a term that the vast majority of people understand what it means, is a bit rich. And of course it is a made up media phrase, that's what the media does. Another example that is used as a shorthand as everyone understands what it means include Brexit. As I imagine 'leaving the EU' just didn't scan.

Also it could have been worse, such as 'Shooting ourselves in the foot' brexit, or 'Doing what every forecast has indicated will make us economically worse off, especially the vulnerable' Brexit or 'An opportunity for the disaster capitalists who are pushing for this to make money' brexit.

 

[bluewolf]

Funny how people are different. I can understand what is meant by "no deal"

Whereas "Hard Brexit" just seems like a made up media phrase which each person can interpret differently.

To be fair, I think the term "Hard Brexit" was coined merely to differentiate the different types of Brexit and not as a comparison with Remain....

 

[Sweep]

David Lammy speaking with passion, realism and clarity about the EU and leaving it.

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/to...h-to-the-house-of-commons-on-brexit-1-5806571

Ah, the man who thought WW1 ended at 11 minutes past 11 on the 11th month.
I have had a belly full of the anti democratic plonker on Twitter, so I will give your link a miss thanks.

 

[Sweep]

They were the posters that May authorised when she was Home Secretary
The separatist ones were from UKIP.
Remember when they used a picture of Syrian refugees [not immigrants] and inferred they were queuing up to come to the UK. Not forgetting the 51 million Turkish residents who would also be joining the queue. That really shook up the OAPs.

Whilst the posters about illegal immigrants (that’s illegal, not refugees or people here legally) saying the authorities were coming to get you could be considered distasteful, I was surprised no-one was too bothered when the TV licence people used the same tactic.
As for the Turks, it’s the EU that won’t let them in. It has nothing to do with British OAP’s

 

[Sweep]

I asked as I was not sure if the OP meant a hard brexit in the sense that most people understand a hard brexit to be, or a no deal and go back to renegotiate.

In a world of 'Taxpayers alliances' and 'European Research Groups', getting upset that someone has said Hard Brexit, a term that the vast majority of people understand what it means, is a bit rich. And of course it is a made up media phrase, that's what the media does. Another example that is used as a shorthand as everyone understands what it means include Brexit. As I imagine 'leaving the EU' just didn't scan.

Also it could have been worse, such as 'Shooting ourselves in the foot' brexit, or 'Doing what every forecast has indicated will make us economically worse off, especially the vulnerable' Brexit or 'An opportunity for the disaster capitalists who are pushing for this to make money' brexit.

Or they could have used “Crashing out without a deal” or “Cliff edge Brexit”. That would have been dreadful media manipulation.... oh, hang on.

 

[Sweep]

Funny how we never hear “let our country be run by others remain” or “have people who never appeared on a ballot in charge of our union remain” or “pay more in and get less out remain” or “no idea what the population of our country will be next week remain” or “guess where parliament is this week remain” or “no need to prove MEP expenses remain” or “allow our laws to be made by others remain” or “a Hotel California remain”....

 

[Slime]

One of my very best friends, an ardent Remainer who even handed out leaflets on the Saturdays in the run up to the referendum, has said she will, very reluctantly, vote Leave if there’s a second vote. In her view, democracy comes first.

I don't know who she is, but I like her.