Best way to lose a beer belly...

[One Planer]

Okay fair point on muscle v fat weight thing, it's like sayinf which is heavier a tonne of feathers or a tonne of lead, obviously they weigh the same. What I failed to get across is that muscle is denser than fat and for, shall we say for the sake of argument one cubic foot of fat is going to weight less than the same measure of muscle.

Can we also, or the sake of argument differentiate between fat and weight, you can have two people, same height, same weight, just one is primarily built up of fat, the other is lean muscle, the terminology while some may think is just semantics, the difference are a t polar opposites.

I disagree and agree, in the first instance, in a resting state, a person to maintain their current state requires 2000 calories, to gain weight put on fat, they eat 2500 calories, to lose weight or reduce fat they eat 1500 calories, that is a person with a sedantory lifestyle, your basic couch potato

If said person now decides to start exercising and they maintain the same 2000 calorie intake, they will start to burn fat and as a result become lighter, if said person eats 2500 calories, then they will gain or maintain the same weight, but at the same time burn fat, if said person exercies but reduces their calory intake to 1500, they will lose fat, muscle and potentially do themselves more harm than good.

Like I said in my previos post. Without hydrostatic weighing and clinical testing at every stage you will never, for 100% sure, know what the body has reduced, be it fat/muscle/water/all of the above. It's best guess.

Even the most hardcore bodybuilder working on fat reduction leading up to competition will not know 100% for sure what he's losing. Difference is these tend to use dehydration and duiretic medication which i swhy some many faint and suffer debilitating cramp.

I disagree, okay this example may be a bit extreme, but someone eating 2000 calories derived from poultry, fish, legumes, vegetables etc... healthy stuff, if they decrease the calories based on this diet then calory counting in this instance would work, but many people when calory counting cheat and sneak a bag of crisps, ice cream, confectionary then all of a sudden their daily intake is shot, if they stick to the 2000 rule, they go hungry and are doing themselves more harm than good, they are effectively starving themselves, if thy then eat to fill the hunger, they exceed their daily calory count and put on fat.

There was a program on TV last week which was about people in hospital waiting for gastric surgery so they could lose fat, these people were obese, massive. One guy was in for 2 weeks, he was on a low calory diet, fresh veg chicken etc...he weighed in at 304lbs, after two weeks of being in hospital and eating well, he was still 304lbs, why because he wasn't moving and when the tuck shop trolley came round he was buying fizzy pop and crisps. It wasn't until the surgen put through endscopic hell that the penny dropped and he stopped the snacking, and did some walking and lost some fat.

The point I'm trying to make is that counting calories is all good if you are eating the right stuff, but if those calories are made up of mainly sugars and saturated fats, calory counting is pointless.

For someone to lose weight, it has to be a lifestyle choice, they have to want to make the changes that will make a difference to them. To make those changes they have to want to eat differently and exercise more. The people that want to lose weight get bogged down with the huge number of diet plans and the huge number of exercise regimes, to that end it's personal choice and you have to go with what works for the individual.

If my body has a requirement of say 2500 calories per day to maintain my weight. If i eat 2500kcal of clean food (Your examples) or 2500kcal of junk food, will I gain weight?

Of course changing to a healthy(er) lifestyle is the first step, and a good one, but for uneductated folk, they take the wrong end of the stick.

As I said in my last post. When I was a persoanl trainer I lost count of the number of people who came to me and listed their previous to current diets. They went from eating, in some case double their requirement, to bearly half their requirement and wondering why they have headaches, are snappy and have little energy or motivation to exercise. People thing that dieting means you should be hungry, this is part of the problem. It's all about how fast the weight comes off, not how sustainable they redcution is.

Knowing what you eat currently, calorie wise, as compared to what you need is a major step in understanding. Like I said, people have a tendancy to go to the extreme, like I listed above, when it is not required.

I'll pose a question.

Male, 30 yeras old, 6ft, 250lb sedentary life style, no fitness history decides he wants to change his lifestyle and lose weight. He has a target weight of 190lb.

How do you explain to him a safe, sustainable way to lose weight, that will not yo-yo, without counting calories?

Does he know how much to reduce from his current diet?

Does he even know what his current calorific intake is?

It's easy to say eat less and do more, but as you rightly say, it often does more harm than good and end up right back where they started, if not heavier.

 

[SocketRocket]

IMO its not so much how much you eat (within reason) but what you eat. You need to understand the way the body deals with sugar and fats. The intention should not be about how much weight you lose but how much body fat you can get rid of, things like BMI are a nonsense in this respect.

Eat less carbs and sugar (bread, potatoes, rice, pasta, root vegetables, sugary fruits like bananas, fruit juices, pastries). Eat more Protein, fish, meat, eggs. Eat non root vegetables and salads, drink plenty of water. Fat does not make fat, most of your cholesterol is produced by your liver and is influenced by the insulin produced to manage high sugar levels in the blood. It's no wonder so many people are Diabetics with what they eat and drink.

If you consider the way our bodies have evolved over time it has ben used to a diet for hunter gatherers. What is the leanest and fittest animal on the planet? probably a Cheetah, this Animal has never eaten carbs or cereals. Think primal with your diet.

 

[bobmac]

Eat less carbs and sugar (bread, potatoes, rice, pasta, root vegetables, sugary fruits like bananas, fruit juices, pastries). Eat more Protein, fish, meat, eggs. Eat non root vegetables and salads, drink plenty of water.

In a word...........Atkins

 

[Phil2511]

In a word...........Atkins

Which is unhealthy lol

 

[Khamelion]

If my body has a requirement of say 2500 calories per day to maintain my weight. If i eat 2500kcal of clean food (Your examples) or 2500kcal of junk food, will I gain weight?

Yes, if your calory intake is made up of junk food, which is mainly simple sugars, saturated fats, because if they are not used immediatley the body turns the sugars and fats straight into stored fat around the body. If you 2500 of calories is made up of healthy food, complex carbs, good sources of protein the body has more chance of using them to replenish what it's lost rather than store immediatley as fat.

I'll pose a question.

Male, 30 yeras old, 6ft, 250lb sedentary life style, no fitness history decides he wants to change his lifestyle and lose weight. He has a target weight of 190lb.

How do you explain to him a safe, sustainable way to lose weight, that will not yo-yo, without counting calories?

Does he know how much to reduce from his current diet?

Does he even know what his current calorific intake is?

It's easy to say eat less and do more, but as you rightly say, it often does more harm than good and end up right back where they started, if not heavier.

If he's not going to train then calory counting is a good viable option as long as he eats good foods and cuts out the junk, if he's going to start training, he needs to work out his basic protein, good fat and carb intake to reach the goals he is reaching for, no need to count calories in this instance.

 

[Khamelion]

In a word...........Atkins

All protein with no carb or fat intake is dangerously unhealthy.

I think the crux of all this is, in a word, balance.

Eat at a healthy balanced diet, you can still eat junk food as treats occasionally so you don't become bored with the heathly stuff.

Plan a balanced exercise regime, a little bit of variation to keep things fresh. If you goal is just to lose some fat and reduce you overall weight than a balance cardio and weight regime is ideal. The sam principals apply to weight training to gain size and muscle mass or cardio work if you're training to get fitter or preparing for a marathon or fun run.

 

[One Planer]

Yes, if your calory intake is made up of junk food, which is mainly simple sugars, saturated fats, because if they are not used immediatley the body turns the sugars and fats straight into stored fat around the body. If you 2500 of calories is made up of healthy food, complex carbs, good sources of protein the body has more chance of using them to replenish what it's lost rather than store immediatley as fat.

The thing is though, your body doesn't understand "clean" food and "junk" food. They are terms coined by dieting folk to determine a difference between heathy and unhealthy.

Your body understands what it is given. Carbohydrate, protein, fats (good and bad), minerals and vitamins...... In other words calories

1g fat = 9kcal
1g Protein =3kcal
1g carbs = 1kcal

If, as the example says, my body requires 2500kcal/day to maintain my weight, it makes little difference what makes up those 2500kcal, I will remain the same weight.

It's when you consume excess calories for a prolonged period of time that you gain weight. Keeping yourself in a calorie excess is what gains weight, not eating specific foods. As Brian, quite rightly says above, eating fat doesn't make you fat.

As an aside. The above is only an extreme example. Eating that much junk food, while still inside your maintenence calorie figure would, most likely, have a detrimental effect on your blood cholesterol and insulin sensitivity.

 

[Akie]

I found calorie counting to be the best way, you realise that so many foods that are not fatty but are highly calorific could be contributing to your weight.

 

[SocketRocket]

In a word...........Atkins

No Bob! In two words, 'Not Atkins'. Read what I have posted previously in this thread. If you want to understand more then read up on people like: Dr John Briffa and Dr Charles Clarke. The latter a Professor at the University of Glasgow, consultant surgeon and expert on diabetes.

 

[SocketRocket]

All protein with no carb or fat intake is dangerously unhealthy.

It's almost impossible to have a No Carb or all protein diet, the best way is to keep Carbs down to around 50 grams a day. As I have said previously you can eat a wide range of foods and be healthy while losing weight. Sugars are the things to keep to a minimum and carbs are just unrefined sugar. If you eat a high sugar content diet and exercise you will find it impossible to control your weight.

 

[bobmac]

No Bob! In two words, 'Not Atkins'. Read what I have posted previously in this thread. If you want to understand more then read up on people like: Dr John Briffa and Dr Charles Clarke. The latter a Professor at the University of Glasgow, consultant surgeon and expert on diabetes.

I understood the Atkins diet was based on low carb and high protein. Wrong again obviously

 

[JustOne]

Muscle is not heavier than fat. Take 1lb of muscle and 1lb of fat, which weighs more?

I can't agree with that. Muscle does weight more than fat... by volume. A bag of muscle and the same size bag of fat - the muscle with weight more.

However the rest of your posts are very interesting.

So how would someone diet, or lose weight, or reduce their fatty bits?

Is there a way for someone who takes 2000 caleries per day to reduce that to 1900 without making themselves poorly?

What would YOU recommend to a 14 stone woman who wants to get down to 10?

Cheers for your answers mate,,, all very interesting :thup:

 

[Foxholer]

Have knocked the alcohol on the head, and want to make a conscience effort to rid the extra weight.

currently 5 '10 and 15 1/2stone

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Sit ups?

biking?

Jogging?

More golf - brisk walking is an excellent 'fat burner' - the core exercise helps marginally too - without adding muscle.

I believe a little stronger exercise, like cycling, would help but no need to go OTT.

Cut down the size of your food portions. No real need to change the content, unless it's 'unhealthy'.

Basically, a little less food, a little more exercise.

If you try anything more dramatic, you should get a check-up with your Doctor first!

Jogging can be seriously bad for you - specially on roads/pavement - as it can damage joints. Swimming is the best exercise I know, but pools can be few and far between!