ball roll on green

[mark at national]

Playing on sunday my ball came to rest on a slope on the green so i marked cleaned and replaced it took a dozen attempts to ensure the ball cam to rest on the marked spot eventually it did... just... i removed marker walked away to line up about 4 mts from the ball stood up to walk toward the ball and as i always do subconsciously with my right hand and from about a hand span above the green and about 2 meters from the ball dropped the putter on the green then regripped and moved in to line up the put at the exact moment the club hit the ground the ball rolled towards the hole. have i been deemed to have moved the ball with my actions in my opinion i think the ball was always going to roll from the spot is the onus on me or my marker to make the determinaion or have i benifited by co incidence

 

[bladeplayer]

Tough one to call without being there this , matter of fact its a tough one even if you were there ha

If the ball was at rest and only moved after you dropped the putter it could be assumed your actions caused it to move , Pen stroke & Replace the ball

However ..

2 meters away ? what's that roughly 6 feet ? IMO it would be hard to see how you could cause it from that distance to be honest ..

if you can be sure you didn't cause it to move , no pen & play from new position ..

 

[IanG]

As described, because of the timing of hitting the ground and the ball moving you cannot be confident you didn't cause the ball to move so it's a 1 stroke penalty and replace the ball. Bad luck.

 

[mark at national]

Tend to agree but dont think ive seen anything hitting the green mova a ball.. nth berwick great course

 

[IanG]

Tend to agree but dont think ive seen anything hitting the green mova a ball.. nth berwick great course

Maybe you just did .

If you're 50ft away and hit the ground, you'd be confident it was just a coincidence if the ball moved, if you were 6 inches away you'd equally be confident it was likely you that moved the ball. The tough call is where is the dividing line. 3ft, 6ft, 10 ft ????

Tough call as you're essentially on your own in deciding that one.

 

[mark at national]

I dont see how it could be resolved as there are cleary 2 arguments and both could be deemed to be right

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Had an occasion playing Formby in the summer - greens lightening fast. Mates ball came to rest just at the top of a steep step up in the green but close to the pin - great shot he played in. Maybe a couple of minutes after it had come to rest I threw a high pitch onto the green that landed not too far from his ball (maybe 6ft) - which almost immediately rolled down the slope tpo maybe 20ft from the pin (it's 20yrs ago and he still reminds me of it)

 

[Fyldewhite]

Playing on sunday my ball came to rest on a slope on the green so i marked cleaned and replaced it took a dozen attempts to ensure the ball cam to rest on the marked spot eventually it did... just... i removed marker walked away to line up about 4 mts from the ball stood up to walk toward the ball and as i always do subconsciously with my right hand and from about a hand span above the green and about 2 meters from the ball dropped the putter on the green then regripped and moved in to line up the put at the exact moment the club hit the ground the ball rolled towards the hole. have i been deemed to have moved the ball with my actions in my opinion i think the ball was always going to roll from the spot is the onus on me or my marker to make the determinaion or have i benifited by co incidence

How many times do you need to repeat the process before deciding it won't stay there and placing at the nearest point it will not nearer the hole? A dozen seems a bit excessive.....I do hope you weren't pressing the ball down to get it to stay?

 

[bladeplayer]

I dont see how it could be resolved as there are cleary 2 arguments and both could be deemed to be right

Some rules can be like that Mark .. if you get to a stage you & ur playing partner / opponent cant agree , you could always play 2 balls , one under each ruling . then go to the committee & let them resolve it

 

[duncan mackie]

I dont see how it could be resolved as there are cleary 2 arguments and both could be deemed to be right

Indeed.

However the rules also appreciate that this can be the situation and make it clear that any doubt that the committee may have after evaluating everything is resolved against the player in such a situation.

18-2b/4 and 18-2a/30&30.5 are references.

As already mentioned I struggle with how replacing a ball in the same place that many times can influence whether it stays in place without having affected the surface of the green - but that's a seperate issue!