Penalty stroke or not ?

[twrmgoat]

Short answer is ... it depends.

If it was a hole made by the greenkeepers whilst they were looking after the course, then it counts as ground under repair and you get free relief under 16.1. But if it wasnt made under those circumstances, then you'd have to declare it unplayable and take relief under penalty - rule 19.

And I dont see how you'd know the difference? But either way, you get relief so I'd suggest taking relief with 1Cl (the lesser of the differing limits) then asking whether you need to add a penalty when you finish.

With respect to last para, then I don’t think you can do this. When you take a drop you must state whether you’re taking free relief or unplayable. If you want to hedge your bets then you have to play two balls.

 

[Ratness]

With respect to last para, then I don’t think you can do this. When you take a drop you must state whether you’re taking free relief or unplayable. If you want to hedge your bets then you have to play two balls.

Not quite correct. Salfordlad has explained how one ball can be played, under two rules, in post #17.

 

[twrmgoat]

Not quite correct. Salfordlad has explained how one ball can be played, under two rules, in post #17.

I don’t think salfordlad is saying you can play one ball, and decide later whether or not a penalty applies. Could be wrong though.

See this thread where I asked a question on this:

T

Thread 'Can wrong free relief turn into unplayable?'

Jul 1, 2025

Player mistakenly took free relief for ‘line of sight’ from an immovable object.

But dropped within two club lengths not nearer the hole, so legal drop if had been taking an unplayable.

Player submitted card to committee to rule on. DQ for playing from wrong place or can the drop be treated as a penalty shot?

I think the latter, although ChatGPT pointing me at 14.5b(3) which I’m not sure is exact scenario. Also says committee has discretion under procedures section 8 which I can’t really see.

• twrmgoat
• Replies: 36
• Forum: Rules of Golf & Handicapping

 

[salfordlad]

I don’t think salfordlad is saying you can play one ball, and decide later whether or not a penalty applies. Could be wrong though.

See this thread where I asked a question on this:

T

Thread 'Can wrong free relief turn into unplayable?'

Jul 1, 2025

Player mistakenly took free relief for ‘line of sight’ from an immovable object.

But dropped within two club lengths not nearer the hole, so legal drop if had been taking an unplayable.

Player submitted card to committee to rule on. DQ for playing from wrong place or can the drop be treated as a penalty shot?

I think the latter, although ChatGPT pointing me at 14.5b(3) which I’m not sure is exact scenario. Also says committee has discretion under procedures section 8 which I can’t really see.

• twrmgoat
• Replies: 36
• Forum: Rules of Golf & Handicapping

You can play one ball in the situation originally cited - and read the referenced clarification for the precise words the RBs have provided. These are about invoking 20.1c(3) in advance.

Your other situation is different - you can't put a ball in play under a wrong/incorrect rule and then retrospectively declare that process to be taking an unplayable. If you are doing unplayable, there must be intent to do it in advance.

 

[rulie]

You can play one ball in the situation originally cited - and read the referenced clarification for the precise words the RBs have provided. These are about invoking 20.1c(3) in advance.

Your other situation is different - you can't put a ball in play under a wrong/incorrect rule and then retrospectively declare that process to be taking an unplayable. If you are doing unplayable, there must be intent to do it in advance.

And further, when you ask the Committee to rule on your actions, the Committee cannot assign Rule 19 (unplayable) to your actions. And as salfordlad has said, there must be intent in advance, you can't do it retroactively.