Snail ruling…

[3 jabber]

I have no idea if this is relevant to the OP. If a ball is hit off an animal (snail) does this rule apply?

Here's why a bug on the green almost cost Paul Casey a penalty

During Paul Casey's second round at the Porsche European Open, one of Casey's putts rolled over a bug on the green — and it could have cost him.

golf.com

 

[Colin L]

I have no idea if this is relevant to the OP. If a ball is hit off an animal (snail) does this rule apply?

Here's why a bug on the green almost cost Paul Casey a penalty

During Paul Casey's second round at the Porsche European Open, one of Casey's putts rolled over a bug on the green — and it could have cost him.

golf.com

Not any longer. In the current Rules, Paul Casey's bug is a loose impediment as is the snail (see the Definition of a Loose Impediment)and if a ball played from the putting green is deflected by a loose impediment, it is played as at lies (see Rule 11.1b(2)).

 

[jim8flog]

Wasn't there a ruling involving Paul Casey in a PGAT event where his putt rolled over an ant or something. Because he didn't see it happen there was no penalty but if he had seen it there would have been as you are not allowed to hit an animal?? Is this just a rule applicable to pro events? Poor snails in amateur competitions!!

That rule has now been removed from the rules book.

When it was in force it was - the shot must be replayed without penalty and it was a penalty if you failed to do so.

 

[Springveldt]

It is in the definitions of loose impediment

A snail is a loose impediment.

The ball is on the green so can be lifted after marking its place.

If it were elsewhere on the course one would have to watch out for the ball moving if lifting the snail.

Wait, so if I'm on a slight incline on a fairway and a snail is basically stopping the ball from rolling I just have to whack away and kill the snail or else I get a penalty?

What kind of psycho thinks this rule is ok? You would think a bit of common sense would prevail here.

 

[Colin L]

Wait, so if I'm on a slight incline on a fairway and a snail is basically stopping the ball from rolling I just have to whack away and kill the snail or else I get a penalty?

What kind of psycho thinks this rule is ok? You would think a bit of common sense would prevail here.

You could, out of the kindness of your heart, take penalty relief. Attitudes to snails vary. Some people eat them which is not much of kind-hearted thing to do but if you are trying to grow hostas you would want to encourage the habit. To me they are pretty tasteless and it’s the sauce matters.

 

[Swango1980]

Wait, so if I'm on a slight incline on a fairway and a snail is basically stopping the ball from rolling I just have to whack away and kill the snail or else I get a penalty?

What kind of psycho thinks this rule is ok? You would think a bit of common sense would prevail here.

I suspect if that scenario ever occurred on the PGA World Tour, or any professional golf tour, they would find some way to avoid killing the snail without penalty. The public backlash isn't worth it. Until then, us amateurs can simply kill the snail. Or, as I'm sure will happen, everyone in the group would allow relief without punishment. I certainly wouldn't be demanding a player either kill the snail, or take a penalty.

 

[KenL]

You could, out of the kindness of your heart, take penalty relief. Attitudes to snails vary. Some people eat them which is not much of kind-hearted thing to do but if you are trying to grow hostas you would want to encourage the habit. To me they are pretty tasteless and it’s the sauce matters.

For goodness sake!

 

[D-S]

It does seem bizarre that golf has divined that some creatures are worth more or less than others.

I wouldn't want to smash a snail with my club nor would I feel that was fair that I should take penalty relief (but I would).

Is there any sort of logic behind this, as I am sure it can't be purely arbitrary can it?

 

[TerryA]

Mark your ball, pick it up to identify it ie to make sure it’s yours, move the snail then replace your ball - job done!

 

[Steven Rules]

Mark your ball, pick it up to identify it ie to make sure it’s yours, move the snail then replace your ball - job done!

Nice try, but that would have you falling foul of Exception 1 to Rule 15.1a.

Before replacing a ball that was lifted or moved from anywhere except the putting green a player must not deliberately remove a loose impediment that, if moved before the ball was lifted or moved, would have been likely to have caused the ball to move. If the player does so, they get one penalty stroke, but the removed loose impediment does not need to be replaced.

 

[rulie]

Mark your ball, pick it up to identify it ie to make sure it’s yours, move the snail then replace your ball - job done!

Not so fast... that could be a breach of Rule 15.1a, "a player must not deliberately remove a loose impediment that, if moved before the ball was lifted or moved, would have been likely to have caused the ball to move." If done, it's a one stroke penalty, but the removed loose impediment does not need to be replaced.

Edited: Sorry for the duplication!

 

[Neilds]

I think people are worrying far too much about a situation that they are (almost) never likely to see whilst playing golf

 

[Troymcclure]

Or, as I'm sure will happen, everyone in the group would allow relief without punishment. I certainly wouldn't be demanding a player either kill the snail, or take a penalty.

In a comp?

 

[Swango1980]

In a comp?

Yes, in a comp.

I've always said rules are rules, and I would certainly never look to break the rules willingly, just because I think they are harsh.

But, in this instance, this is possibly the first ruling I've ever seen that I would be happy to ignore. As important as the rules are, my personally opinion is that they are not important enough to purposely kill a living creature to avoid a penalty.

In all probability, it'll be the difference between shooting a nett 76 or a nett 77 in a monthly medal. But, even if it was the difference between becoming Club Champion, or losing out on a play-off, I genuinely don't believe that there would be too much controversy in the Clubhouse that the player was able to remove the snail, instead of making the decision to either kill it, or take a penalty (which, in all fairness, most would agree is a ridiculous penalty to have to take, no fault from the player at all)

 

[Troymcclure]

Yes, in a comp.

I've always said rules are rules, and I would certainly never look to break the rules willingly, just because I think they are harsh.

But, in this instance, this is possibly the first ruling I've ever seen that I would be happy to ignore. As important as the rules are, my personally opinion is that they are not important enough to purposely kill a living creature to avoid a penalty.

In all probability, it'll be the difference between shooting a nett 76 or a nett 77 in a monthly medal. But, even if it was the difference between becoming Club Champion, or losing out on a play-off, I genuinely don't believe that there would be too much controversy in the Clubhouse that the player was able to remove the snail, instead of making the decision to either kill it, or take a penalty (which, in all fairness, most would agree is a ridiculous penalty to have to take, no fault from the player at all)

Before this thread I’d have marked my ball, re-located Sammy somewhere safe and played on.

Now i know the Rule I’d take the penalty drop and feel very hard done by.

If a FC had the same situation and hit their ball I’d judge them morally.

But if they said to me it’s a bit unfair having to take a penalty I’d agree with them in principle, but to grant them a free drop is, as we know unfair to the rest of the field because we all draw the ‘unfair’ line somewhere differently.

Academic debate as Neilds states. I’ve never had a close encounter with a snail on the course but “rules is rules” is always worth discussing

 

[KenL]

I am terrified of snails, it is therefore a dangerous animal. Free relief is available.

 

[clubchamp98]

What’s the difference between a Snake and a snail.

Would anyone play a ball from the coils of a Rattlesnake?

 

[clubchamp98]

I am terrified of snails, it is therefore a dangerous animal. Free relief is available.

you could be allergic to snail fragments therefore putting you in mortal danger !

Seems a very silly rule given the things you do get a drop for.
Why kill a perfectly innocent animal in its natural environment.

 

[Swango1980]

Before this thread I’d have marked my ball, re-located Sammy somewhere safe and played on.

Now i know the Rule I’d take the penalty drop and feel very hard done by.

If a FC had the same situation and hit their ball I’d judge them morally.

But if they said to me it’s a bit unfair having to take a penalty I’d agree with them in principle, but to grant them a free drop is, as we know unfair to the rest of the field because we all draw the ‘unfair’ line somewhere differently.

Academic debate as Neilds states. I’ve never had a close encounter with a snail on the course but “rules is rules” is always worth discussing

Indeed. Will never be a problem as it is so rare, until the day it does suddenly become a problem, when the stars align.

In amateur golf at club level, perhaps it has occurred a good number of times over many many years. But, at that level, I'm sure virtually every single golfer it has happened to has just moved the snail, automatically assuming that is what is allowed. I'd be surprised if 99% of golfers, outside those on this thread, would be aware that it is either kill the snail, or take a penalty. Thus, the issue has never been a problem, as it hasn't caused any controversy.

I can only ever see it becoming a problem if it suddenly happened to a professional golfer on a televised event (and to one of the golfers they are actually showing, so either one of the world's best golfers, or one who is near the top of the leaderboard). That is when it could get controversial.

But, it is pretty much hypothetical, as I can't see it happening to me. So, I can say that if it hypothetically happens to me, I'd allow free relief (or just allow them to move the snail, replace ball). I'd be morally happy with that, and I'd be happy that the player is not gaining an advantage on the rest of the field, as it is unlikely the rest of the field are all getting penalised because they are taking penalty relief due to snails.

 

[salfordlad]

I think people are worrying far too much about a situation that they are (almost) never likely to see whilst playing golf

Some personal stats (admittedly, just one person's experience):
Years on golf courses: 50++
Snails confronted on golf courses: Nil. Perhaps I've just been lucky?
But just supposing ...
What may the probability be of a snail trapping my ball into such a precarious position that I cannot gently move the snail out of the way?
I, too, think folk are worrying for little reason.