Back pin = front tee / front pin = back tee: Handicapping requirement for consistent hole length?

[Voyager EMH]

On many of our holes, if the tee markers are level with the permanent markers and you step backwards 4 yards, you are likely to fall down a slope or into some nettles or both.

 

[rulefan]

Instructions to greenkeeper. (I can genuinely only hope that I have interpreted this correctly)

1.
Measure backwards 4 yards from the permanent marker and then 2 club lengths forwards.
You should not put the tee-markers any further back than this.
2.
Measure forwards 2 yards and 2 club lengths from the permanent marker.
You should not put the tee-markers any further forward than this.


I shall be playing a social game from our yellow tees today. I shall take note of non-compliance.
I doubt number 1 will be infringed, but a few cases of number 2 infringement might be noted.
Never really cared much about this before. We all play the same course no matter where the tee markers are placed on the day.

This information, which I guess came from my rather convoluted posts must be read with caution.
It is directed at professional course measuring companies as advice to be pointed out to the club. NB the use of the word 'should'.

The course rating team will work to their own rule which requires there to be 4 paces (yards or metres depending on country) of clear ground behind TA (based on the permanent marker). If there is insufficient ground they will record the hole length from where the PM should be.

The 10 yards forward or back from the PM together with the 100 yards is a WHS rule for handicap qualifying scores.

The ROG only specify the size of the Teeing Area not the positioning.

 

[D-S]

If a course is 105 yards more or less than the measured yardage of the course, can rounds be used for handicapping?

If this is a permanent or regular thing , not approved by the County then no. I know of a club that had 100s of scores deleted from players records due to playing on a non compliant course in winter.

 

[Swango1980]

If this is a permanent or regular thing , not approved by the County then no. I know of a club that had 100s of scores deleted from players records due to playing on a non compliant course in winter.

What if a course is 95 metres more or less than the measured course?

 

[D-S]

What if a course is 95 metres more or less than the measured course?

A course is rarely just one side of compliant or the other. If they are clearly non compliant in an unauthorised and regular manner then it should not be used for handicapping.

 

[Swango1980]

A course is rarely just one side of compliant or the other. If they are clearly non compliant in an unauthorised and regular manner then it should not be used for handicapping.

Cool

So if a course is 108 yards outside the measured distance, you can probably put that in the category of not being "clearly" non-compliant, and therefore scores are acceptable for handicap. Especially as it is still within 100 metres.

It just strikes me as odd that the authorities have defined a specific distance, but casually used metres and yards as if they are the same thing.

 

[D-S]

Cool

So if a course is 108 yards outside the measured distance, you can probably put that in the category of not being "clearly" non-compliant, and therefore scores are acceptable for handicap. Especially as it is still within 100 metres.

It just strikes me as odd that the authorities have defined a specific distance, but casually used metres and yards as if they are the same thing.

Again, the odds of a course being a metre or a yard one side of the line or other is incredibly rare and is probably a one off early morning greenkeeping error. Courses are normally compliant or have their tees switched off when using forward unrated tees or mats. However if a course has a number of tees considerably (usually) shorter than the 10 yards, normally entirely different platforms in regular use, then they better watch out as EG will advise Counties to delete scores. All it takes is one player advising the County.

 

[Swango1980]

Again, the odds of a course being a metre or a yard one side of the line or other is incredibly rare and is probably a one off early morning greenkeeping error. Courses are normally compliant or have their tees switched off when using forward unrated tees or mats. However if a course has a number of tees considerably (usually) shorter than the 10 yards, normally entirely different platforms in regular use, then they better watch out as EG will advise Counties to delete scores. All it takes is one player advising the County.

I get all that, yet still no clearer why they used two completely different units.

It is like saying a player can take an unplayable drop 2 club-lengths / metres from where the original ball lay

 

[Alan Clifford]

I get all that, yet still no clearer why they used two completely different units.

It is like saying a player can take an unplayable drop 2 club-lengths / metres from where the original ball lay

Perhaps if you are virtual certain a club is a yard / metre in length.

 

[DickInShorts]

I get all that, yet still no clearer why they used two completely different units.

It is like saying a player can take an unplayable drop 2 club-lengths / metres from where the original ball lay

I suspect that they are really saying :
If your country uses yards then 100 yards - if your country uses metres then 100 metres.

 

[Swango1980]

I suspect that they are really saying :
If your country uses yards then 100 yards - if your country uses metres then 100 metres.

European countries have a bit more wiggle room then to move their tees about

 

[D-S]

European countries have a bit more wiggle room then to move their tees about

Yup, they can move 10 tees a full 2.8 feet further forward or back than ours - and they call it a World handicap system!

 

[Neilds]

Yup, they can move 10 tees a full 2.8 feet further forward or back than ours - and they call it a World handicap system!

But their holes are always longer than ours

 

[Voyager EMH]

Winter rules:

Pick, clean and place within 152mm.

 

[Alan Clifford]

Winter rules:

Pick, clean and place within 152mm.

Since an inch has been defined in millimetres since July, 1959, make that 152.4 mm.

 

[Voyager EMH]

Since an inch has been defined in millimetres since July, 1959, make that 152.4 mm.

I think we are meant to round millimetres to the nearest whole number.
6 inches is bigger in the UK, naturally.
Those poor Europeans!

 

[Alan Clifford]

I think we are meant to round millimetres to the nearest whole number.
6 inches is bigger in the UK, naturally.
Those poor Europeans!

The Europeans have bigger holes than us - it's in the definitions, "The hole must be 4 ¼ inches (108 mm) in diameter". They get 0.05 of a millimetre more than us.

 

[rulie]

The Europeans have bigger holes than us - it's in the definitions, "The hole must be 4 ¼ inches (108 mm) in diameter". They get 0.05 of a millimetre more than us.

This will require machine precision and rounding is not permitted.

 

[jim8flog]

I think we are meant to round millimetres to the nearest whole number.
6 inches is bigger in the UK, naturally.
Those poor Europeans!

A comment by a lot of men, women I am not so sure.