And, we’re off.......2018/2019

[Bunkermagnet]

He should get nowhere near a shirt Thursday after that.
He’s not fit.

But I was glad he played Saturday....

 

[Orikoru]

Disappointing that the game was totally ruined by a decision in the first minute. At the time I thought it was a joke, on reflection I can see how the current laws point to it being a handball - and if they do then the laws are just wrong. I think for that to be deemed a penalty is grossly unfair. He blocked the cross with his chest, and then it just catches his arm inconsequentially, it's so unlucky. But the handball rule in football is a total mess, and we've had incidents like that all season.

As I say, game was completely ruined after that, not just for us but for any neutrals watching the game. Liverpool obviously had a gameplan to sit back if they got an early goal, and we might as well have been playing against Brighton then. Just recycling possession around midfield for the entire first half. You never see Liverpool sit back like that, and they certainly wouldn't have done that at nil nil I'm sure. Eventually we realised we were never going to break them down and had a few potshots from distance in the second half, not many looked likely to go in (except Dele's lob which we all got excited over because of the camera angle and then Alisson just caught it comfortably ).

I said we shouldn't have started Kane, and I think it proved to be the wrong call. Poch just loves him too much. It was bangright out of order to drop Lucas in the form he was in, I'd have started him and Son as a front two, bring Kane on around 55 mins. Imagine if we'd have taken it to extra time, and you have to leave Kane on who's already done 90 mins, in case it goes to pens. It just felt like totally the wrong decision. I think they said he had 11 touches on the ball first half. With Liverpool sitting so deep you need a lot of movement up front and he just wasn't sharp enough. We didn't see enough fro Eriksen or Son to break them down either. Felt we defended well, albeit with Liverpool not threatening much.

Just a piss poor final really but hey ho.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Managed to catch this on Saturday afternoon. Sure others will have seen it but if not, a really interesting piece https://sport.bt.com/football/two-t...ew-hope-during-troubled-times-S11364349206560

One thing BT sport have done well are their sport documentaries from things like Corinthian Casuals (the non-league one going to Brazil to play Corinthians), the Crazy Game (about Winbledon in their heyday) and Too Good To Go Down about Man Utd's relegation to the old division 2 under Tommy Docherty

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I was standing with six people who came down from Halifax just to see the City and watch the parade so lots of body’s from outside the city .
It’s only a guess anyway?

Whatever the real figures they will be made insignificant compared to the 1.5m that come to cheer Donald Trump on his state visit.................according to a White House Spokesperson

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Disappointing that the game was totally ruined by a decision in the first minute. At the time I thought it was a joke, on reflection I can see how the current laws point to it being a handball - and if they do then the laws are just wrong. I think for that to be deemed a penalty is grossly unfair. He blocked the cross with his chest, and then it just catches his arm inconsequentially, it's so unlucky. But the handball rule in football is a total mess, and we've had incidents like that all season.

As I say, game was completely ruined after that, not just for us but for any neutrals watching the game. Liverpool obviously had a gameplan to sit back if they got an early goal, and we might as well have been playing against Brighton then. Just recycling possession around midfield for the entire first half. You never see Liverpool sit back like that, and they certainly wouldn't have done that at nil nil I'm sure. Eventually we realised we were never going to break them down and had a few potshots from distance in the second half, not many looked likely to go in (except Dele's lob which we all got excited over because of the camera angle and then Alisson just caught it comfortably ).

I said we shouldn't have started Kane, and I think it proved to be the wrong call. Poch just loves him too much. It was bangright out of order to drop Lucas in the form he was in, I'd have started him and Son as a front two, bring Kane on around 55 mins. Imagine if we'd have taken it to extra time, and you have to leave Kane on who's already done 90 mins, in case it goes to pens. It just felt like totally the wrong decision. I think they said he had 11 touches on the ball first half. With Liverpool sitting so deep you need a lot of movement up front and he just wasn't sharp enough. We didn't see enough fro Eriksen or Son to break them down either. Felt we defended well, albeit with Liverpool not threatening much.

Just a piss poor final really but hey ho.

I totally agree with your comments on Kane, it was like playing Beckham, Rooney etc for England all those years ago when they weren't fit. It was all too familiar.

I disagree on the handball. It was handball and players know this. I come from a background of hockey. If the ball hits your foot it is the equivalent of a free kick against you. Intent is irrelevant, ball + foot = free kick. Footballers need to grow some brain cells about hand ball as it is effectively the same, Lineker has used the same comparison previously. Ball + hand = free kick. Learn it, it is very simple. If Sissoko had his arm by his side I could have more sympathy but he was giving it the full scarecrow. Absolute madness and I would not expect a pub player to have his arm out like that on a Sunday morning.

It has still been a cracking season for you but you have to build. The teams around you will not stand still so Spurs can not afford to this season. You can't get away with that 2 years on the trot.

 

[Jensen]

That would be greater than the population of the whole city. I'm sure the numbers are big but 500k is surely stretching it.

Personally I think that's well underestimated, given the blue half would have been there to welcome them 😄

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I totally agree with your comments on Kane, it was like playing Beckham, Rooney etc for England all those years ago when they weren't fit. It was all too familiar.

I disagree on the handball. It was handball and players know this. I come from a background of hockey. If the ball hits your foot it is the equivalent of a free kick against you. Intent is irrelevant, ball + foot = free kick. Footballers need to grow some brain cells about hand ball as it is effectively the same, Lineker has used the same comparison previously. Ball + hand = free kick. Learn it, it is very simple. If Sissoko had his arm by his side I could have more sympathy but he was giving it the full scarecrow. Absolute madness and I would not expect a pub player to have his arm out like that on a Sunday morning.

It has still been a cracking season for you but you have to build. The teams around you will not stand still so Spurs can not afford to this season. You can't get away with that 2 years on the trot.

If you saw it though, Sissoko was pointing to fellow team mates to watch the back post, it wasn’t in an unnatural position.
Didn’t Spurs goal against City stand for the same thing? Ball hit Llorente’s hip then arm and called as accidental?
Certainly one of them, definite penalty for you, no way against you.
My fear is that players will now deliberately aim at other players in the hope of it hitting an arm, which is crap.
As for Kane, that’s hindsight, Moura hasn’t had the greatest season in the PL and Poch will have chosen what he believed was his best 11 against LPool setting them up and preparing for a couple of weeks, had the opposition been different, Poch may of thought differently and set up in a different way.

 

[Orikoru]

I totally agree with your comments on Kane, it was like playing Beckham, Rooney etc for England all those years ago when they weren't fit. It was all too familiar.

I disagree on the handball. It was handball and players know this. I come from a background of hockey. If the ball hits your foot it is the equivalent of a free kick against you. Intent is irrelevant, ball + foot = free kick. Footballers need to grow some brain cells about hand ball as it is effectively the same, Lineker has used the same comparison previously. Ball + hand = free kick. Learn it, it is very simple. If Sissoko had his arm by his side I could have more sympathy but he was giving it the full scarecrow. Absolute madness and I would not expect a pub player to have his arm out like that on a Sunday morning.

It has still been a cracking season for you but you have to build. The teams around you will not stand still so Spurs can not afford to this season. You can't get away with that 2 years on the trot.

He was pointing to give instructions to another player. That is not "absolute madness" it is simply a team trying to organise themselves defensively. It was just enormously unlucky and I still to punish that with a penalty kick is grossly unfair and disproportionate to the 'crime'. It's the handball law which is "absolute madness".

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Sissoko should be watching the ball, not sticking his arm out in the penalty area. If you walk down the street you don't walk with your arm out like that, it is by your side. It was entirely unnatural. Next year they are talking about your silhouette. That arm is not part of your silhouette.

I didn't see the semi, didn't watch any of the CL until the final, but as you have described it I would have blown against Llorente. That's me though. As I have said, if it hits your arm that's it, intent should be irrelevant.

I don't agree on the Kane shout. Each time he has been injured the last season or two he has taken 3-4 games to come back. This was game one. Moura had a great semi, play him and Son. Bring on Kane after 60mins if needed. He was blatantly lacking sharpness on Saturday

 

[Lord Tyrion]

He was pointing to give instructions to another player. That is not "absolute madness" it is simply a team trying to organise themselves defensively. It was just enormously unlucky and I still to punish that with a penalty kick is grossly unfair and disproportionate to the 'crime'. It's the handball law which is "absolute madness".

He is in the penalty area, the ball is coming towards him and you don't think it is madness to point with his arm outstretched . It was absolutely gormless. He can be shouting at his team mates to organise, someone else can be pointing but he should only have eyes for that ball and his arms should be beside him, not doing an aeroplane. Unlucky is a penalthy given when a ball is blasted against your arm down by your side from 5yds

You need to take off your Spurs goggles.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Sissoko should be watching the ball, not sticking his arm out in the penalty area. If you walk down the street you don't walk with your arm out like that, it is by your side. It was entirely unnatural. Next year they are talking about your silhouette. That arm is not part of your silhouette.

I didn't see the semi, didn't watch any of the CL until the final, but as you have described it I would have blown against Llorente. That's me though. As I have said, if it hits your arm that's it, intent should be irrelevant.

I don't agree on the Kane shout. Each time he has been injured the last season or two he has taken 3-4 games to come back. This was game one. Moura had a great semi, play him and Son. Bring on Kane after 60mins if needed. He was blatantly lacking sharpness on Saturday

So you’ve never walked down the street and pointed something out to someone you’re with? His fist was clenched and one finger is pointing, ie, totally natural.
The Kane shout is hindsight, both teams would of prepared to the best of their ability, formation, set pieces etc, Kane wouldn’t of been a last minute whim.
Firmino was missing, Salah did very little, no talk of them because LPool won.
You play your best 11, Kane is one of them for Spurs, but LPool’s midfield and defence played him out the game, ie Klopp got his tactics right.

 

[Orikoru]

He is in the penalty area, the ball is coming towards him and you don't think it is madness to point with his arm outstretched . It was absolutely gormless. He can be shouting at his team mates to organise, someone else can be pointing but he should only have eyes for that ball and his arms should be beside him, not doing an aeroplane. Unlucky is a penalthy given when a ball is blasted against your arm down by your side from 5yds

You need to take off your Spurs goggles.

I disagree with you in the strongest terms. The law states your arm should be in an 'unnatural' position, it's far from unnatural to be helping your teammates organise by pointing at where they need to be. It's not Spurs goggles because I've said it's a penalty in the letter of the law, it's just the law that is stupid and slightly unfair.

With VAR coming in to the Premier League next season, defenders are going to have to around with their arms pinned to their sides at all times. Now THAT is unnatural. Alderweireld already does this, you saw it on the Origi goal - if he'd have thrown himself across he could have blocked it, but he doesn't do that because you can't possibly do it without your arms being outstretched, so he shuffled over with his arms behind his back and got nowhere near it. That's how the game will be now because of the stupid handball law, and it's rubbish.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

So you’ve never walked down the street and pointed something out to someone you’re with? His fist was clenched and one finger is pointing, ie, totally natural.

I have but it is not a natural postion. By your side is natural, horizontal is not. I also would not be stupid enough to do it in the penalty area of a football game just as the ball is about to come to me. Mmmmmmmm what could possible go wrong?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

He is in the penalty area, the ball is coming towards him and you don't think it is madness to point with his arm outstretched . It was absolutely gormless. He can be shouting at his team mates to organise, someone else can be pointing but he should only have eyes for that ball and his arms should be beside him, not doing an aeroplane. Unlucky is a penalthy given when a ball is blasted against your arm down by your side from 5yds

You need to take off your Spurs goggles.

No, he’s running back to defend and is looking at the danger, you’re suggesting no player makes any arm gestures, that’s not natural.
I wanted Lpool to win, I’m not wearing any goggles.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I have but it is not a natural postion. By your side is natural, horizontal is not. I also would not be stupid enough to do it in the penalty area of a football game just as the ball is about to come to me. Mmmmmmmm what could possible go wrong?

It is not natural for your arms to stay by your side when you run, have a look at any person running at any any age, nobody runs with arms tucked in by their side.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I disagree with you in the strongest terms. The law states your arm should be in an 'unnatural' position, it's far from unnatural to be helping your teammates organise by pointing at where they need to be. It's not Spurs goggles because I've said it's a penalty in the letter of the law, it's just the law that is stupid and slightly unfair.

With VAR coming in to the Premier League next season, defenders are going to have to around with their arms pinned to their sides at all times. Now THAT is unnatural. Alderweireld already does this, you saw it on the Origi goal - if he'd have thrown himself across he could have blocked it, but he doesn't do that because you can't possibly do it without your arms being outstretched, so he shuffled over with his arms behind his back and got nowhere near it. That's how the game will be now because of the stupid handball law, and it's rubbish.

The law next year will allow your arms to be in the silhouette of your body. If it hits your arm by your side it will not be handball. Not arms behind your back, by your side. That is a key change.

It is stretching unnatural to claim to be organising your team mates in that moment. Why not wave both arms and be trying to distract pigeons? He should not have been doing it. They asked a ref a half time and he practically laughed that it could be anything but a penalty. It is as clear as you like.

 

[clubchamp98]

I think the tactics went out the window after the pen.
I can understand the frustration from spurs fans as the handball rule is a joke .
But you can’t put your arms out like that and LT is right poor from sissoko.
It looks like he is pointing but there was only Mane facing him with plenty of cover behind him.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

It is not natural for your arms to stay by your side when you run, have a look at any person running at any any age, nobody runs with arms tucked in by their side.

You have to judge what is natural in that moment. When you are running your arms move in a certain way, when you are stood still they hang down. Both are natural, there are different situations and refs can judge that. Sissoko having his arm stuck out like that was not natural in terms of defending that ball. It is natural for pointing something out but he should not be doing that then.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

The law next year will allow your arms to be in the silhouette of your body. If it hits your arm by your side it will not be handball. Not arms behind your back, by your side. That is a key change.

It is stretching unnatural to claim to be organising your team mates in that moment. Why not wave both arms and be trying to distract pigeons? He should not have been doing it. They asked a ref a half time and he practically laughed that it could be anything but a penalty. It is as clear as you like.

The Ref at half time? Peter Walton who has been ridiculed all season?

You’re looking at Sissoko in an absolute moment in time, watch the build up, Lpool broke and he’s chasing back, sees the danger at the far post and signals team mates as he goes to close Mane down, he’s just inside the box when it hits him, Football is played at speed, expecting players to now run around with their arms against the side of the body is ridiculous.

 

[Orikoru]

The law next year will allow your arms to be in the silhouette of your body. If it hits your arm by your side it will not be handball. Not arms behind your back, by your side. That is a key change.

It is stretching unnatural to claim to be organising your team mates in that moment. Why not wave both arms and be trying to distract pigeons? He should not have been doing it. They asked a ref a half time and he practically laughed that it could be anything but a penalty. It is as clear as you like.

Watch Origi's goal again and look at what Toby is doing. That's what he feels he has to do to not fall foul of the law, and it is the very definition of unnatural! Ironic really. Also that isn't a change, it's already not deemed handball if your arm is by your side.

Organising your teammates akin to waving at pigeons. I guess we won't bother continuing the discussion then if you're not going to take it seriously.