Worlds gone mad

[SocketRocket]

I have read that most Women have a lower spatial awareness then men, this was substantiated by evolution whereby Men have needed a better awareness of the 3D space around them due to having to hunt game in groups throughout the protracted millennia of the evolutionary process. Women tended to remain in the home and didn't develop the same level of spatial awareness.

Just saying.

 

[bluewolf]

I have read that most Women have a lower spatial awareness then men, this was substantiated by evolution whereby Men have needed a better awareness of the 3D space around them due to having to hunt game in groups throughout the protracted millennia of the evolutionary process. Women tended to remain in the home and didn't develop the same level of spatial awareness.

Just saying.

Damn... If only evolution hadn't stopped dead in its tracks in the 1700's... Or is that attitudes? I always get those mixed up...

 

[SocketRocket]

Damn... If only evolution hadn't stopped dead in its tracks in the 1700's... Or is that attitudes? I always get those mixed up...

Evolution is crystal clear unless you want to apply sociological filters to it, then it can be distorted any way you want.

 

[bluewolf]

Evolution is crystal clear unless you want to apply sociological filters to it, then it can be distorted any way you want.

You're probably right. Equality is a sociological distortion rather than a societal direction....

 

[FairwayDodger]

Hi everyone just catching up on this thread, am a bit drunk tonight.. just wondering if the forum still has rules about sexism ‘cos this thread seems to be a wee bit off the reservation...?

 

[Pin-seeker]

Hi everyone just catching up on this thread, am a bit drunk tonight.. just wondering if the forum still has rules about sexism ‘cos this thread seems to be a wee bit off the reservation...?

Shock horror FD claims sexism 😱😁

2 smiley’s

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Hi everyone just catching up on this thread, am a bit drunk tonight.. just wondering if the forum still has rules about sexism ‘cos this thread seems to be a wee bit off the reservation...?

The thread is a debate that touches on sexism, some posts , in your opinion, may well be sexist. Surely better to keep the thread running and get your point across?

Complaining about the thread surely fuels the idea that the world is becoming a censored and beige place.

 

[User20205]

The thread is a debate that touches on sexism, some posts , in your opinion, may well be sexist. Surely better to keep the thread running and get your point across?

Complaining about the thread surely fuels the idea that the world is becoming a censored and beige place.

To claim women can’t drive because of some evolutionary difference based on some unsubstantiated/unreferenced book is a nonsense. Substitute ‘women’ for an ethnic group to illustrate the full nonsense of it. I’m sure that argument has been used for a justification before & that didn’t end too well.
I think we’re all still waiting with interest from slimes critique on Wolfies daughters driving style?
You can have a discussion without slipping into lazy cliches.

 

[SatchFan]

Now we have the return of Girl Power. The Spice Girls are coming back. Feeling vulnerable.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

To claim women can’t drive because of some evolutionary difference based on some unsubstantiated/unreferenced book is a nonsense. Substitute ‘women’ for an ethnic group to illustrate the full nonsense of it. I’m sure that argument has been used for a justification before & that didn’t end too well.
I think we’re all still waiting with interest from slimes critique on Wolfies daughters driving style?
You can have a discussion without slipping into lazy cliches.

I didn't make that comment or defend it. I agree it's a daft suggestion so the way to deal with it is expose it as such.

 

[Sweep]

I recall seeing a program about the things that men are better at than women and vice-versa. They illustrated it by putting men and women through tests. The spatial awareness was one aspect (though the evolutionary explanation is new to me) often used to humourlessly explain why women can’t parallel park. The result of the program was a draw ( probably predictable).
We should probably accept that men and women are different and that generally women are better at some things than men and vice versa. This is of course a massive generalisation. It has to be. We are dealing in billions here. But it’s hard to deny that men are usually stronger than women and women have men beat on child birth.
Personally I say vive la difference.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Some on here complain about the stuffiness of golf clubs. They particularly object to dress codes and the fact that some clubs dictate to members what they can and can’t wear.
Interestingly many of those same people are those most willing to tell women how they can and can’t earn a living.
Just saying...

Through a mixture of narcissism and paranoia I wil assume that is aimed at me.

On the surface I agree that it does seem contradictory, and as I posted earlier, people are full on contradictions on both sides. People advocating that people are free to do what they want will defend the strict rules of a golf club, people who would like to see pit girls phased out want to relax such codes and behaviours in golf clubs. However that only kind of rings completely true if the argument about personal freedom to do what you want is the main driver of the argument.

From my perspective, whilst I am all in favour people having a huge amount of freedom and there being free speech etc etc, as I imagine most people are, that is not the driver for me about things like dress codes or the use of language on this board. I do not feel dress codes are infringing on any human rights. It is more about societal norms and the the image that the event or organisation portrays through it's actions and rules. To me walk on girls are a thing of the past and whilst it does not keep me awake at night, I am not sad to see them consigned to history as certain people think they are no longer appropriate. Which is the exact same argument I would make about some of the more outdated dress codes at golf clubs. To me (parts of) society and what people expect have moved on.

I do not see it as a straight argument between people being free to do what they want on one side so anything goes, or people being told what to do all the time on the other. This debate I think is a but more nuanced than that.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I recall seeing a program about the things that men are better at than women and vice-versa. They illustrated it by putting men and women through tests. The spatial awareness was one aspect (though the evolutionary explanation is new to me) often used to humourlessly explain why women can’t parallel park. The result of the program was a draw ( probably predictable).
We should probably accept that men and women are different and that generally women are better at some things than men and vice versa. This is of course a massive generalisation. It has to be. We are dealing in billions here. But it’s hard to deny that men are usually stronger than women and women have men beat on child birth.
Personally I say vive la difference.

I think people are accepting that men and women are different. But what people are trying to do is ensure that in the future there are equal opportunities open to women and men in the vast majority of situations where women can do the job/role/function to just as good a standard as men.

If it is a clear situation where brute strength is needed then of course, on average, a man will be better for the role. However, whilst you probably did not do it on purpose, and it may have been slightly ironic in which case I applogise, but highlighting child birth as the one and area where women are better kind of does not portray women in the best light. I am pretty sure they have more to offer rather than a purely biological function.

 

[FairwayDodger]

If it is a clear situation where brute strength is needed then of course, on average, a man will be better for the role. However, whilst you probably did not do it on purpose, and it may have been slightly ironic in which case I applogise, but highlighting child birth as the one and area where women are better kind of does not portray women in the best light. I am pretty sure they have more to offer rather than a purely biological function.

Indeed, we can also be nice to look at, I believe.

 

[Pin-seeker]

Indeed, we can also be nice to look at, I believe.

So can men,I believe 😁

 

[Slime]

Do you mind me asking why?

Not at all.
Physiologically, males and females are different.
Men, as a rule, are the stronger sex, they can run faster, jump higher, throw further because they are the stronger sex.
F1 drivers are elite athletes and have to be very strong, physically. They are subject to sustained G forces of up to 5g, they need very strong neck and chest muscles for this alone. They require very high arm strength to corner at very high speed and they also require a very strong core. They contend with enormous heat in their cockpits and can sweat up to half a stone of weight loss in a race whilst having to maintain 100% concentration throughout the races.
Women, as a sex, are not as strong as men which, I firmly believe, is why women are unable to succeed as F1 drivers.

I'd like Slime to explain his post..

I just need to prepare my 10yr old daughter for the sad truth that she'll never be as vital a member of society as Good'ol Slime.. I need to get my Daddy/Daughter speech primed...

Come on Slime.. Tell me why my daughter can't be a F1 driver...:thup:

I can think of no reason why your 10 year old daughter can't grow up to be a vital member of society, please show me where you got that from.
'Good'ol Slime' ............... not sure that was warranted.

 

[Sweep]

Through a mixture of narcissism and paranoia I wil assume that is aimed at me.

On the surface I agree that it does seem contradictory, and as I posted earlier, people are full on contradictions on both sides. People advocating that people are free to do what they want will defend the strict rules of a golf club, people who would like to see pit girls phased out want to relax such codes and behaviours in golf clubs. However that only kind of rings completely true if the argument about personal freedom to do what you want is the main driver of the argument.

From my perspective, whilst I am all in favour people having a huge amount of freedom and there being free speech etc etc, as I imagine most people are, that is not the driver for me about things like dress codes or the use of language on this board. I do not feel dress codes are infringing on any human rights. It is more about societal norms and the the image that the event or organisation portrays through it's actions and rules. To me walk on girls are a thing of the past and whilst it does not keep me awake at night, I am not sad to see them consigned to history as certain people think they are no longer appropriate. Which is the exact same argument I would make about some of the more outdated dress codes at golf clubs. To me (parts of) society and what people expect have moved on.

I do not see it as a straight argument between people being free to do what they want on one side so anything goes, or people being told what to do all the time on the other. This debate I think is a but more nuanced than that.

I don’t think you are paranoid 😀
In some ways I agree. If the darts and F1 girls have had their day then so be it. Personally I don’t watch darts and I watch F1 for the racing. I really don’t think anyone watches for the girls.
However, this is in my view very much about personal freedoms. There is an agenda now that is quite sinister in the way some people think they can tell everyone how to live their lives and make their living, often by looking down on people who work or act in certain ways and pretending that they have their best interests at heart. Much of this is spurred on by the Hollywood scandals and a lot of those who wish to restrict the freedom of others have jumped on the bandwagon. This is a prime example.
We all know there has to be sensible laws and order, but you can’t shout for freedom of the individual from the rooftops and then restrict the freedoms of others just because you find something a bit tacky.
I should warn you, we have been down this road before. Where does it end? What happens if those restrictions on freedoms go further than you would like? You can imagine it all then starts to become uncomfortable and that is where some people are now. Some have already lost their jobs.
So, if we continue down this road how long before you become uncomfortable?
What if we get to the point where we can’t show programmes about the history of rock and roll because Elvis swings his hips in a provocative manner? Would that be good? We were there once and not very long ago.
Believe me, if we have to put up with a bit of tackiness on tv in order to protect personal freedoms then it’s well worth it. If it’s had it’s day it will die naturally just like page 3 did.

 

[Sweep]

I think people are accepting that men and women are different. But what people are trying to do is ensure that in the future there are equal opportunities open to women and men in the vast majority of situations where women can do the job/role/function to just as good a standard as men.

If it is a clear situation where brute strength is needed then of course, on average, a man will be better for the role. However, whilst you probably did not do it on purpose, and it may have been slightly ironic in which case I applogise, but highlighting child birth as the one and area where women are better kind of does not portray women in the best light. I am pretty sure they have more to offer rather than a purely biological function.

My point about child birth was meant to be humorous. I think it would be disparaging to men to simplify their best roles as those where brute strength is required too.
My central point was that we cannot pretend that men and women are the same. They are not and we should celebrate that fact. Imagine a world populated by only men. Or one with only women. Everyone surely wants equal opportunities for both genders but there are obviously some roles women do better than men and vice versa (walk on girls are an obvious example 😀 - smiley to indicate a joke btw). If we choose to pretend otherwise we will never get to equality.

 

[Sweep]

Indeed, we can also be nice to look at, I believe.

True, but in these PC times we are not allowed to admit that and should be ashamed of finding them attractive it seems.

 

[bluewolf]

Not at all.
Physiologically, males and females are different.
Men, as a rule, are the stronger sex, they can run faster, jump higher, throw further because they are the stronger sex.
F1 drivers are elite athletes and have to be very strong, physically. They are subject to sustained G forces of up to 5g, they need very strong neck and chest muscles for this alone. They require very high arm strength to corner at very high speed and they also require a very strong core. They contend with enormous heat in their cockpits and can sweat up to half a stone of weight loss in a race whilst having to maintain 100% concentration throughout the races.
Women, as a sex, are not as strong as men which, I firmly believe, is why women are unable to succeed as F1 drivers.




I can think of no reason why your 10 year old daughter can't grow up to be a vital member of society, please show me where you got that from.
'Good'ol Slime' ............... not sure that was warranted.

So, much like a Fighter Pilot then. If only there were some female fighter pilots to disprove your opinion (which you stated as a matter of fact).

Oh, and not only was it warranted, I think it was quite mild.....