The Virus anybody else done the maths

[User62651]

In terms of space, the entire world’s population could live comfortably in the state of Texas. Overpopulation isn’t an issue if wealth is distributed more evenly.

Anorak time, I reckon if you can get 4 people in a 1 m2 area or 0.25m2 each then you'll fit world's 8 billion people in Texas 3.5 times over.
My Isle of Man seems way way too small though, not sure where I heard that. must've been really squashed in.

Sorry, long days.

 

[IanM]

In terms of space, the entire world’s population could live comfortably in the state of Texas. Overpopulation isn’t an issue if wealth is distributed more evenly.

if you ignore the requirement to provide jobs, housing, food and services, yeah they'd fit! (physically)

You can't just talk about one side of the equation and ignore the other completely, but that applies all political perspectives.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Anorak time, I reckon if you can get 4 people in a 1 m2 area or 0.25m2 each then you'll fit world's 8 billion people in Texas 3.5 times over.
My Isle of Man seems way way too small though, not sure where I heard that. must've been really squashed in.

Sorry, long days.

Think it was the Isle of Wight? Least, that's the version I heard

 

[ColchesterFC]

Anorak time, I reckon if you can get 4 people in a 1 m2 area or 0.25m2 each then you'll fit world's 8 billion people in Texas 3.5 times over.
My Isle of Man seems way way too small though, not sure where I heard that. must've been really squashed in.

Sorry, long days.

Social distancing might prove difficult. ?

 

[Imurg]

Anorak time, I reckon if you can get 4 people in a 1 m2 area or 0.25m2 each then you'll fit world's 8 billion people in Texas 3.5 times over.
My Isle of Man seems way way too small though, not sure where I heard that. must've been really squashed in.

Sorry, long days.

So......allowing people just shy of 1m2 would still fit everyone in.
I thought the phrase used the words "living comfortably "
Going to the loo wouldn't be a job for the faint hearted

 

[Kellfire]

if you ignore the requirement to provide jobs, housing, food and services, yeah they'd fit! (physically)

You can't just talk about one side of the equation and ignore the other completely, but that applies all political perspectives.

My point was that space is not the issue - it’s the distribution of wealth and thus resources.

 

[rulefan]

One of the problems with the stats relating to death is that Drs can enter 1) the primary cause, 2) secondary causes and 3) other conditions on the death cert. All three are included in the (covid 19 related) figures we get on TV etc. Care Home and Hospice figures could well be biased to 2) & 3)

PHE publish the figures after they get the certs and have coded them. That could be days.

 

[IanM]

My point was that space is not the issue - it’s the distribution of wealth and thus resources.

ah, if it was only that simple.... But I do know what you mean, although the distribution of wealth is a function of many many things, not just the inherent lack of fairness.

 

[GB72]

A question for those who are following the numbers in more detail than me. When we look at the figures for the number who have sadly died, are we looking at the same thing across different countries. I cannot remember where I saw it but I am sure that I read that, for example, if a person passes away in the UK and has show symptoms of Covid 19 then this is noted on the death certificate irrespective of underlying health issues whereas in Germany, if there are underlying health issues then those are marked as the probable cause of death irrespective of any Covid symptoms.

Just trying to work out whether the graphs we are looking at are containing the same date recorded in the same way or whether the method of recording is impacting on how bleak or positive the position appears.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

A question for those who are following the numbers in more detail than me. When we look at the figures for the number who have sadly died, are we looking at the same thing across different countries. I cannot remember where I saw it but I am sure that I read that, for example, if a person passes away in the UK and has show symptoms of Covid 19 then this is noted on the death certificate irrespective of underlying health issues whereas in Germany, if there are underlying health issues then those are marked as the probable cause of death irrespective of any Covid symptoms.

Just trying to work out whether the graphs we are looking at are containing the same date recorded in the same way or whether the method of recording is impacting on how bleak or positive the position appears.

Yes I remember something along those lines. It is a wonder why the different methods are used, though it could be that the German method, if used, may lead to accusations of "cover up" . Painting a falsely optimistic scenario.
Now I wonder who would suggest such a thing, journos??

I think there must be a number of hospital deaths that would have been deaths even if there had been no covid infection of the deceased.

 

[SocketRocket]

A question for those who are following the numbers in more detail than me. When we look at the figures for the number who have sadly died, are we looking at the same thing across different countries. I cannot remember where I saw it but I am sure that I read that, for example, if a person passes away in the UK and has show symptoms of Covid 19 then this is noted on the death certificate irrespective of underlying health issues whereas in Germany, if there are underlying health issues then those are marked as the probable cause of death irrespective of any Covid symptoms.

Just trying to work out whether the graphs we are looking at are containing the same date recorded in the same way or whether the method of recording is impacting on how bleak or positive the position appears.

I doubt if they are exactly the same.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I doubt if they are the exactly the same.

I agree, this makes the comparisons a nonsense yet they happen constantly. How on earth can we compare our details to Germany when they test more than us, so their 'with virus' figures will be much higher than ours, and their death figures are only if it is the actual cause of death so will be much lower. It is surprising that an agreed method is not used across the board.

I'm making no judgement on which method is correct incidentally.

 

[GB72]

Yes I remember something along those lines. It is a wonder why the different methods are used, though it could be that the German method, if used, may lead to accusations of "cover up" . Painting a falsely optimistic scenario.
Now I wonder who would suggest such a thing, journos??

I think there must be a number of hospital deaths that would have been deaths even if there had been no covid infection of the deceased.

It is one of my constant bugbears that the media do seem to want to ramp up the figures as to people dying from covid as high as possible as that makes great headlines whilst comparing, maybe unfairly, to other countries when the figures may not actually be comparable and using that as a stick to bash various experts and politicians with.

 

[SocketRocket]

I agree, this makes the comparisons a nonsense yet they happen constantly. How on earth can we compare our details to Germany when they test more than us, so their 'with virus' figures will be much higher than ours, and their death figures are only if it is the actual cause of death so will be much lower. It is surprising that an agreed method is not used across the board.

I'm making no judgement on which method is correct incidentally.

When you look at Germany they seem to have a high infection rate but a low death rate, is that anything to do with the way they apportion deaths to people who also have other serious conditions?

 

[MegaSteve]

It is one of my constant bugbears that the media do seem to want to ramp up the figures as to people dying from covid as high as possible as that makes great headlines whilst comparing, maybe unfairly, to other countries when the figures may not actually be comparable and using that as a stick to bash various experts and politicians with.

France, by all accounts, is including deaths in care homes in its figures... Is there a reason why the UK isn't doing the same?

 

[GB72]

When you look at Germany they seem to have a high infection rate but a low death rate, is that anything to do with the way they apportion deaths to people who also have other serious conditions?

It could be. Again, I cannot provide quotes on this as I forgot where I read it but if the UK are proceeding on the presumption that Covid was the cause of death unless proved otherwise whereas Germany are presuming it is the underlying health issues unless proved otherwise then there will obviously be higher figures in the UK.

 

[GB72]

France, by all accounts, is including deaths in care homes in its figures... Is there a reason why the UK isn't doing the same?

We are now which is why there are 2 UK curves on the nightly briefing but the figures for those are days behind the deaths reported from hospital. Again though, it would an unfair comparison between france and the Uk if the reporting methods are different.

 

[MegaSteve]

We are now which is why there are 2 UK curves on the nightly briefing but the figures for those are days behind the deaths reported from hospital. Again though, it would an unfair comparison between france and the Uk if the reporting methods are different.

As I noted earlier... I'd read there is a world standard in how deaths are reported in these circumstances... Seems the reality is that no two governments have adapted a same comparable standard...

 

[User20204]

When you look at Germany they seem to have a high infection rate but a low death rate, is that anything to do with the way they apportion deaths to people who also have other serious conditions?

My understanding of Germany's count is based on those who have died from Covid19 not those who have died with catching Covid19.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

When you look at Germany they seem to have a high infection rate but a low death rate, is that anything to do with the way they apportion deaths to people who also have other serious conditions?

Quite possibly, that makes sense. I suspect we won't really know until this is all over and the figures from each country are analysed in more depth in the cold light of day. We may see a few adjustments, caveats etc at that point.