The Footie Thread

[Billysboots]

That is possibly the most difficult 45 minutes I have watched this season. And there’s been some pretty stiff competition.

United are so far off competing with the top sides at the moment it defies belief. Bar one or two periods of brief possession it has been all Newcastle. How they are not ahead I really don’t know.

There is no composure anywhere on the pitch. Nobody can hold the ball up. And we seem utterly incapable of clearing our lines, conceding possession cheaply and just inviting pressure time and again.

Not sure I can stand another 45 minutes of this.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Yates generally gives a good as he gets. I just enjoyed seeing a good physical game of football without too much theatrics and the whistle being blown every 30 seconds.
They won. They deserved to win. The match doesn't deserve too much analysis - it was pretty straightforward.

In the same way we miss DCL you guys missed your main striker, forgot his name. He's a threat, whether scoring or just creating problems. Wood is pretty useless, he offers nothing (honestly, Toon fans are still shaking their heads that you took him off their hands ).

It makes it hard for everyone else if the focal point up front isn't holding the ball, isn't bringing in team mates, isn't occupying the 2 central defenders. Both teams need to sort that out quickly or the rush of games coming up could be a slog.

Agree about the lack of theatrics. Made a nice change.

 

[Swango1980]

Omg, Rashford was beaten so so so easily there, and then he just stopped running completely. Absolute horrible player

 

[Billysboots]

Omg, Rashford was beaten so so so easily there, and then he just stopped running completely. Absolute horrible player

Rarely have I been so angry at the performance of a single player, but he has been an absolute disgrace this evening. I simply cannot believe he is still out there.

 

[Deleted member 1740]

Newcastle have bossed this game comfortably and deservedly lead.

The ref must've forgotten his cards

 

[Tashyboy]

any chance of the squirrel coming out of Hibernation tonight

 

[Billysboots]

any chance of the squirrel coming out of Hibernation tonight

No. More chance of me adding Rashford to my Christmas card list.

 

[Swango1980]

As much as Rashford has been abysmal this year, I think tonight was his worst performance.

He has literally given up.

 

[Billysboots]

As much as Rashford has been abysmal this year, I think tonight was his worst performance.

He has literally given up.

But he has never been one for effort when things go against him.

Seeing him give the ball away and either go to ground and stay there, or simply stand with his arms outstretched, is absolutely nothing new.

I’ve just seen Antony get booked for making a poor challenge, and my immediate reaction was to think that at least he got within ten yards of his man, which Rashford would never have managed.

He presses half heartedly, doesn’t track back, concedes possession repeatedly and is not, and never will be, a consistent goal scorer. He is a streaky player, at best, who would not be anywhere near the starting lineup of any side in the top half dozen.

My patience ran out a long, long time ago. Get rid, and start afresh with someone willing to put a shift in.

 

[Deleted member 1740]

most shots faced in the PL this season:

Sheff Utd 266
Luton 241
Man Utd 214

Rashford isn't the problem.

 

[Billysboots]

Rashford isn't the problem.

He is if his cheap conceding of possession, failure to press, failure to track back and all round stinking attitude has contributed towards those stats.

If you watched the game, Stu, you cannot have failed to see the number of chances United gave up down their right flank, surely?

Rashford is a huge part of the problem, as anyone who has watched United this season with a critical eye will tell you.

 

[Aztecs27]

In the same way we miss DCL you guys missed your main striker, forgot his name. He's a threat, whether scoring or just creating problems. Wood is pretty useless, he offers nothing (honestly, Toon fans are still shaking their heads that you took him off their hands ).

It makes it hard for everyone else if the focal point up front isn't holding the ball, isn't bringing in team mates, isn't occupying the 2 central defenders. Both teams need to sort that out quickly or the rush of games coming up could be a slog.

Agree about the lack of theatrics. Made a nice change.

Big Taiwo Awoniyi :-(

The brand of football is just so much better when he’s playing. He does so much to help our passages of attacking play. We were awful tonight and (again) lacked any final ball to finish Everton off. Did we even have a shot on target?

Was nice to see Felipe back playing though. And Murillo continues to impress me at CB. An absolute generational talent. He’ll be gone to City or Madrid for £80m+ in a matter of time, unfortunately. A joy to watch.

 

[Deleted member 1740]

He is if his cheap conceding of possession, failure to press, failure to track back and all round stinking attitude has contributed towards those stats.

If you watched the game, Stu, you cannot have failed to see the number of chances United gave up down their right flank, surely?

Rashford is a huge part of the problem, as anyone who has watched United this season with a critical eye will tell you.

There's many more culpable for that than Rashford. Yes he's been poor but he isn't alone.

That stat i posted speaks volumes about the problems with that team.

 

[Hobbit]

He is if his cheap conceding of possession, failure to press, failure to track back and all round stinking attitude has contributed towards those stats.

If you watched the game, Stu, you cannot have failed to see the number of chances United gave up down their right flank, surely?

Rashford is a huge part of the problem, as anyone who has watched United this season with a critical eye will tell you.

He may concede possession far too easily far too often but he isn’t the defender that should be stopping the shots happening. A month or so back Maguire was the target. The keeper has come in for major criticism recently. McTwominey has been criticised as being off the pace. And Rashford hasn’t really performed for a long while.

Is the team as a whole dysfunctional? Are they playing a system that isn’t fit for purpose? Do the fans need to lower their expectations, not ambitions, but expectations of the current crop of players?

I don’t single out Rashford per se, I believe the current Utd squad and manager aren’t performing.

 

[ColchesterFC]

 

[rudebhoy]

most shots faced in the PL this season:

Sheff Utd 266
Luton 241
Man Utd 214

Rashford isn't the problem.

That's a telling stat. Man U were awful last night, but it's the lack of effort which must be the most worrying aspect. It looks to me that the players have given up on the manager. Only McGuire looked to be trying. I think a big clear out is needed.

 

[ColchesterFC]

God I feel old.

Dean Windass and Danny Cadamarteri's sons both scored for Sheff Wed yesterday.

 

[Swango1980]

Regarding Rashford, of course he isn't the single problem with Utd. But if you look at individual players, he is right up there as being one of the most guilty. He is an absolute flyweight when it comes to mentality, one dribble that fails and he falls into despair.

There are other players mentality I question hugely, but even if you have mostly good footballers I'm side, 1 or 2 like Rashford must be hugely demoralising. Martial doesn't give you much and McTomminay is a ghost.

Maguire, Shaw and even Onana were actually decent and Bruno Fernandes gets about and shows his quality at times. But the attack in general were pathetic, and defence battered every time Utd conceded possession. You don't control any part of a game of football with players like Rashford, Martial and McTomminay.

I'm not a TenHag out guy, still would prefer he gets more time. But I'd have surely thought playing Amrabat alongside Mainoo away at Newcaste would have been logical. And his insistence in continually picking Rashford is baffling. What on earth is going on with Varane? And then having the dodgy right back Dalot playing left-back so that you can play your main left back at centre back.and keep your cover left back on bench is also weird. I'm all for discipline, but disciplining players at a club like Ajax is different.

I don't think some Utd players have stopped playing for the manager. I think they've stopped playing for the fans. I'm sure Newcastle players like Howe, but I doubt they give that effort for him. They do it for the toon fans. So often last night a Newcastle player bust a gut and won a tackle, then immediately celebrated with their fans. The atmosphere at Utd has been so toxic for so long, that whatever manager Utd have, the players will never have that feeling, knowing that the fans are ultimately unhappy with club hierchy. Any moments of joy, like a goal scored, are only temporary moments of happiness amongst overall despair.

 

[Billysboots]

He may concede possession far too easily far too often but he isn’t the defender that should be stopping the shots happening. A month or so back Maguire was the target. The keeper has come in for major criticism recently. McTwominey has been criticised as being off the pace. And Rashford hasn’t really performed for a long while.

Is the team as a whole dysfunctional? Are they playing a system that isn’t fit for purpose? Do the fans need to lower their expectations, not ambitions, but expectations of the current crop of players?

I don’t single out Rashford per se, I believe the current Utd squad and manager aren’t performing.

There are problems everywhere, Bri.

Maguire has had a truly awful time of it, but appears to have turned a corner. But one thing I have never questioned has been his attitude - that has been exemplary throughout, as I have accepted more than once.

Scott McTominay is another whose application has always been first class. Nobody can fault his work ethic, and he has weighed in with some important goals this season. But is he up to it if United want to challenge for trophies? I’m not so sure.

But Rashford? There is a player with talent, of that there is no doubt, but his ethic is nowhere near at the level of the other two. Absolutely nowhere near. He was singled out by Alan Shearer on MOTD for all the points I raised in my earlier post. Whilst I accept he is not a defender, it is exceptionally naive for any football follower to suggest he is not part of the problem. A team defends as a team, and when the forwards are as lazy as Marcus Rashford then the pressure that places on more defensive players is always going to lead to goals being conceded.

His performances this season have been poor. Last night he was an absolute disgrace to the shirt.

 

[Billysboots]

Regarding Rashford, of course he isn't the single problem with Utd. But if you look at individual players, he is right up there as being one of the most guilty. He is an absolute flyweight when it comes to mentality, one dribble that fails and he falls into despair.

There are other players mentality I question hugely, but even if you have mostly good footballers I'm side, 1 or 2 like Rashford must be hugely demoralising. Martial doesn't give you much and McTomminay is a ghost.

Maguire, Shaw and even Onana were actually decent and Bruno Fernandes gets about and shows his quality at times. But the attack in general were pathetic, and defence battered every time Utd conceded possession. You don't control any part of a game of football with players like Rashford, Martial and McTomminay.

I'm not a TenHag out guy, still would prefer he gets more time. But I'd have surely thought playing Amrabat alongside Mainoo away at Newcaste would have been logical. And his insistence in continually picking Rashford is baffling. What on earth is going on with Varane? And then having the dodgy right back Dalot playing left-back so that you can play your main left back at centre back.and keep your cover left back on bench is also weird. I'm all for discipline, but disciplining players at a club like Ajax is different.

I don't think some Utd players have stopped playing for the manager. I think they've stopped playing for the fans. I'm sure Newcastle players like Howe, but I doubt they give that effort for him. They do it for the toon fans. So often last night a Newcastle player bust a gut and won a tackle, then immediately celebrated with their fans. The atmosphere at Utd has been so toxic for so long, that whatever manager Utd have, the players will never have that feeling, knowing that the fans are ultimately unhappy with club hierchy. Any moments of joy, like a goal scored, are only temporary moments of happiness amongst overall despair.

The last paragraph hits the nail squarely on the head. My most recent visit to OT was for the Newcastle battering in the Carabao Cup, and the huge disconnect between those in the stands and those out on the pitch was sadly very evident.

The fans no longer really have any player who acts as a focal point. The exceptions are perhaps Hojlund and, more recently, Mainoo. It is abundantly clear that, whilst the faithful have a connection with individuals, they are really struggling to connect with the team as a whole. The frustration with the likes of Rashford is palpable, as any match going fan will tell you.

The manager can’t change that on his own. It needs the players to do it collectively, and any player unwilling or incapable of applying themselves should be shown the door.