The Footie Thread

[Deleted member 15344]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1491161055619596288

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Utds problems will take time. If the next Utd manger is not the correct choice and not given time. Utds woes will continue for some time yet.

Its the same for Spurs as well. They need stability and perhaps an acceptance (whether the fans like it or not) that they aren't a top 4 side at the moment and even if they do get there aren't good enough to challenge in the CL. Both United and Spurs need to rebuild and that may prove harder at Spurs with Levy's reluctance to part with money. If both clubs simply hire and fire then both could find themselves scrabbling for Europa places at best for many seasons to come and that must have an impact on attracting the top players

 

[Swango1980]

It works if you have the manager, players and time to implement it. Even Pep struggled badly at first and he's the best in the business. To go from Ajax to the sharp end of the Premiership and the toughest job in football is a jump too much. He won't get the players and he won't get the time.

That is a depressing thought, even if it is correct.

That the Utd board, and many fans will expect almost immediate success. That some may not be prepared to appoint a manager they have confidence in, accept things are not likely to he pretty for quite a while, but have faith they will bring results in the long term.

Instead, look for a pretty quick fix. Maybe another Mourinho. If Utd are still miles off after 6 months, start looking for the next manager. We are miles away from City and Liverpool. Even if not miles away on paper player to player, miles away in terms of attitude, confidence and the fact working together as a team is second nature to each player at those 2 teams.

I'd love almost instant results when the new guy comes in. But, realistically, it's a long term project. I also am unsure about some of the back room staff. Ole and RR have refused to give a chance to certain players, DeBeek being one of them. It is bizarre, but is that purely down to both managers, or is it influenced by the staff they speak to behind the scenes? Also, the attitude of many players seems off, has done for ages. I don't know, but I think it is more than the manager that needs to be thought about.

 

[4LEX]

I remember when Pep first came to City and we started playing out from the back with Bravo as keeper. Sweet mother for the fans it was purgatory. I remember Missis Tash once shouted “ just boot it” . It took time but its now a thing of beauty.
If ETH went to Utd his first piece of business should be to bring back Van de Beek from Everton. Get players in that can play to A system, his system. Utds problems will take time. If the next Utd manger is not the correct choice and not given time. Utds woes will continue for some time yet.

Exactly. Pep had trophies in the bank from major leagues so you had confidence it would come good. I think it was 2 CL's and 6 titles in Spain and Germany. He was also in total charge of picking players and had absolute power.

 

[pokerjoke]

Utd need stability because it’s going to take a few seasons to catch City and Liverpool.
Whoever comes in needs backing and time.
Those calling for VDB to come back forget it,he’s had one average game at Everton.
Conte was being touted on here for Utd.
Questions were being asked why they never went for him,I think those questions have been answered.

 

[HomecountiesJohn]

Utd need stability because it’s going to take a few seasons to catch City and Liverpool.
Whoever comes in needs backing and time.
Those calling for VDB to come back forget it,he’s had one average game at Everton.
Conte was being touted on here for Utd.
Questions were being asked why they never went for him,I think those questions have been answered.

Do you believe Conte has been backed and given enough time?

 

[Tashyboy]

Utd need stability because it’s going to take a few seasons to catch City and Liverpool.
Whoever comes in needs backing and time.
Those calling for VDB to come back forget it,he’s had one average game at Everton.
Conte was being touted on here for Utd.
Questions were being asked why they never went for him,I think those questions have been answered.

His one average game is one more than most Utd players have had all season.

 

[4LEX]

That is a depressing thought, even if it is correct.

That the Utd board, and many fans will expect almost immediate success. That some may not be prepared to appoint a manager they have confidence in, accept things are not likely to he pretty for quite a while, but have faith they will bring results in the long term.

Instead, look for a pretty quick fix. Maybe another Mourinho. If Utd are still miles off after 6 months, start looking for the next manager. We are miles away from City and Liverpool. Even if not miles away on paper player to player, miles away in terms of attitude, confidence and the fact working together as a team is second nature to each player at those 2 teams.

I'd love almost instant results when the new guy comes in. But, realistically, it's a long term project. I also am unsure about some of the back room staff. Ole and RR have refused to give a chance to certain players, DeBeek being one of them. It is bizarre, but is that purely down to both managers, or is it influenced by the staff they speak to behind the scenes? Also, the attitude of many players seems off, has done for ages. I don't know, but I think it is more than the manager that needs to be thought about.

I really think Poch is the best at both - results right away and medium/long term. He likes to coach and develop players. Throw in a few good buys and things will turn around quickly. Utd will be so much better as a team without Pogba so whoever comes in will have an easier job as he won't be there (unless Utd give him a long term deal on 600k a week).

For all Utd's issues I still think the lack of a peak world class striker is key. Rooney was finished, RVP a one season wonder, Ibrahimovic came in, Lukaku was OK but very limited and then it's been Cavani and Ronaldo. That's 8 years plus without a world class striker. All of the old sides were built around firepower. Things in football can change fast if you get it right, it doesn't have to be a 4 year wait for someone to come good. The right manager and 2-3 good signings and it'll be totally different next season.

 

[pokerjoke]

Do you believe Conte has been backed and given enough time?

Probably not but without knowing what’s going on between him and Levy I’d be guessing.
I’d presume Levy has already realised he’s not the one,I’m so glad Utd never went for him,and to be honest I don’t believe they ever was.
I also believe they want Poch but does Poch want Utd.

 

[pokerjoke]

I really think Poch is the best at both - results right away and medium/long term. He likes to coach and develop players. Throw in a few good buys and things will turn around quickly. Utd will be so much better as a team without Pogba so whoever comes in will have an easier job as he won't be there (unless Utd give him a long term deal on 600k a week).

For all Utd's issues I still think the lack of a peak world class striker is key. Rooney was finished, RVP a one season wonder, Ibrahimovic came in, Lukaku was OK but very limited and then it's been Cavani and Ronaldo. That's 8 years plus without a world class striker. All of the old sides were built around firepower. Things in football can change fast if you get it right, it doesn't have to be a 4 year wait for someone to come good. The right manager and 2-3 good signings and it'll be totally different next season.

I agree about Poch
Looking at what’s out there he’s the best fit I believe.
Premiership experience is a must imo

 

[Swango1980]

I really think Poch is the best at both - results right away and medium/long term. He likes to coach and develop players. Throw in a few good buys and things will turn around quickly. Utd will be so much better as a team without Pogba so whoever comes in will have an easier job as he won't be there (unless Utd give him a long term deal on 600k a week).

For all Utd's issues I still think the lack of a peak world class striker is key. Rooney was finished, RVP a one season wonder, Ibrahimovic came in, Lukaku was OK but very limited and then it's been Cavani and Ronaldo. That's 8 years plus without a world class striker. All of the old sides were built around firepower. Things in football can change fast if you get it right, it doesn't have to be a 4 year wait for someone to come good. The right manager and 2-3 good signings and it'll be totally different next season.

I like Poch, so would not be upset to see him appointed.

We'll definitely need a long term striker, that is for sure. I just hope they go in hard this time to get the right guy, rather than end up with someone like Ighalo.

But we've been lacking big big time in midfield for years. The core of the side is so important, a couple of quality central midfielders can dictate the tempo of a game, in and out of possession, and provide a great foundation for the attacking players to launch from. Fred and McTomminay work hard, but there is no sustained quality. McTomminay does some good things, but shocked at how slow he is when he runs alongside other players. That pace is the difference between winning a ball, or getting nowhere near it.

So, a striker and a couple of midfielders is probably a minimum. See how that goes, and then may need to look at the right back and Maguire situation.

 

[HomecountiesJohn]

Probably not but without knowing what’s going on between him and Levy I’d be guessing.
I’d presume Levy has already realised he’s not the one,I’m so glad Utd never went for him,and to be honest I don’t believe they ever was.
I also believe they want Poch but does Poch want Utd.

I only asked as your post seemed contradictory.

You said the next Manchester United manager needed time and backing but was almost writing Conte at Tothenham off. The next manager appointment at Manchester United is important as they’ve failed with all of the ones since Sir Alex.

The PL needs a successful Manchester United team to battle with Manchester City and Liverpool.

 

[Billysboots]

I like Poch, so would not be upset to see him appointed.

We'll definitely need a long term striker, that is for sure. I just hope they go in hard this time to get the right guy, rather than end up with someone like Ighalo.

But we've been lacking big big time in midfield for years. The core of the side is so important, a couple of quality central midfielders can dictate the tempo of a game, in and out of possession, and provide a great foundation for the attacking players to launch from. Fred and McTomminay work hard, but there is no sustained quality. McTomminay does some good things, but shocked at how slow he is when he runs alongside other players. That pace is the difference between winning a ball, or getting nowhere near it.

So, a striker and a couple of midfielders is probably a minimum. See how that goes, and then may need to look at the right back and Maguire situation.

United need to rid themselves of the malcontents before they can ever hope to move forward. I’m not about to second guess who those players are, although there have been rumours circulating for a considerable time now that Lingard is a disruptive influence. And we’ll never know the truth about Pogba, although with his contract due to finish I think that’s a moot point anyway.

Once those whose attitudes stink have been moved on, then the new manager can start over. Whoever it is will have a huge job because the club, on the face of it, seems rotten to the core. United, as well as being a tough watch these days, are tough to like.

I agree regarding the midfield. It’s been poor since Scholes hung up his boots the first time. Bruno is as close as they have come to quality in the middle of the pitch, but one, possibly two central midfielders, are an absolute must. Also a top striker - Cavani and Ronaldo will be gone in the summer, and I would be surprised if Mason Greenwood ever plays again, certainly for United.

Finally, another centre half. Lindelöf is never a Premier League player, Bailly is too injury prone which is a great shame as he has real potential. And Maguire? Biggest waste of money I have ever had the misfortune to watch. He is, as big money moves go, by some distance the most overrated, overpriced footballer ever to wear the shirt. Time to cut our losses and get rid.

I’ve lost interest in this season, and my patience with the club I have supported for nearly fifty years has all but been exhausted. They used to entertain me, even during the barren years when an occasional FA Cup win was all we had to keep us happy. Now they are just a turgid watch - a grumpy combination of players who suck the mood out of Old Trafford every time they set foot on the pitch.

 

[Swango1980]

United need to rid themselves of the malcontents before they can ever hope to move forward. I’m not about to second guess who those players are, although there have been rumours circulating for a considerable time now that Lingard is a disruptive influence. And we’ll never know the truth about Pogba, although with his contract due to finish I think that’s a moot point anyway.

Once those whose attitudes stink have been moved on, then the new manager can start over. Whoever it is will have a huge job because the club, on the face of it, seems rotten to the core. United, as well as being a tough watch these days, are tough to like.

I agree regarding the midfield. It’s been poor since Scholes hung up his boots the first time. Bruno is as close as they have come to quality in the middle of the pitch, but one, possibly two central midfielders, are an absolute must. Also a top striker - Cavani and Ronaldo will be gone in the summer, and I would be surprised if Mason Greenwood ever plays again, certainly for United.

Finally, another centre half. Lindelöf is never a Premier League player, Bailly is too injury prone which is a great shame as he has real potential. And Maguire? Biggest waste of money I have ever had the misfortune to watch. He is, as big money moves go, by some distance the most overrated, overpriced footballer ever to wear the shirt. Time to cut our losses and get rid.

I’ve lost interest in this season, and my patience with the club I have supported for nearly fifty years has all but been exhausted. They used to entertain me, even during the barren years when an occasional FA Cup win was all we had to keep us happy. Now they are just a turgid watch - a grumpy combination of players who suck the mood out of Old Trafford every time they set foot on the pitch.

I was interested when RR announced he was getting a mind coach. I wonder if he realised, not long after arriving at the club, the mentality of many people at the club was rotten.

 

[4LEX]

I like Poch, so would not be upset to see him appointed.

We'll definitely need a long term striker, that is for sure. I just hope they go in hard this time to get the right guy, rather than end up with someone like Ighalo.

But we've been lacking big big time in midfield for years. The core of the side is so important, a couple of quality central midfielders can dictate the tempo of a game, in and out of possession, and provide a great foundation for the attacking players to launch from. Fred and McTomminay work hard, but there is no sustained quality. McTomminay does some good things, but shocked at how slow he is when he runs alongside other players. That pace is the difference between winning a ball, or getting nowhere near it.

So, a striker and a couple of midfielders is probably a minimum. See how that goes, and then may need to look at the right back and Maguire situation.

The midfield is key and but I don't think Utd had a top midfield since 2003. Keane was never replaced and Giggs to his credit morphed into a CM. Utd won 5 titles from 2007-2013 with a really patchy midfield. I know the game has changed since then though. A striker, decent DM and a RB are absolute must buys.

I really like Zapata at Atalanta - he's 30 but has pace, power and is a total beast. Similar to Saha back in the day. But Utd should go all out for Haaland, if they're serious. Rice is an obvious choice as he's a DM and can play a bit too. Very good influence in the dressing room and a natural leader. RB needs addressing, Matty Cash at Villa would be a good shout.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

His one average game is one more than most Utd players have had all season.

Two better than average games, much better than average. Average if he was at City but he isn't .

 

[HomerJSimpson]

United need to rid themselves of the malcontents before they can ever hope to move forward. I’m not about to second guess who those players are, although there have been rumours circulating for a considerable time now that Lingard is a disruptive influence. And we’ll never know the truth about Pogba, although with his contract due to finish I think that’s a moot point anyway.

Once those whose attitudes stink have been moved on, then the new manager can start over. Whoever it is will have a huge job because the club, on the face of it, seems rotten to the core. United, as well as being a tough watch these days, are tough to like.

I agree regarding the midfield. It’s been poor since Scholes hung up his boots the first time. Bruno is as close as they have come to quality in the middle of the pitch, but one, possibly two central midfielders, are an absolute must. Also a top striker - Cavani and Ronaldo will be gone in the summer, and I would be surprised if Mason Greenwood ever plays again, certainly for United.

Finally, another centre half. Lindelöf is never a Premier League player, Bailly is too injury prone which is a great shame as he has real potential. And Maguire? Biggest waste of money I have ever had the misfortune to watch. He is, as big money moves go, by some distance the most overrated, overpriced footballer ever to wear the shirt. Time to cut our losses and get rid.

I’ve lost interest in this season, and my patience with the club I have supported for nearly fifty years has all but been exhausted. They used to entertain me, even during the barren years when an occasional FA Cup win was all we had to keep us happy. Now they are just a turgid watch - a grumpy combination of players who suck the mood out of Old Trafford every time they set foot on the pitch.

You make some valid points but this is going to take money and time. Time is definitely something managers seems short off at Old Trafford and there is no guarantee any big money signings won't be Maguires or others come in with a big ego and upset the dressing room. Ronaldho now seems like a huge mistake and you can't say he's looked like being a key player week in, week out. I would prefer Cavani of the two

 

[Tashyboy]

I only asked as your post seemed contradictory.

You said the next Manchester United manager needed time and backing but was almost writing Conte at Tothenham off. The next manager appointment at Manchester United is important as they’ve failed with all of the ones since Sir Alex.

The PL needs a successful Manchester United team to battle with Manchester City and Liverpool.

This all day long. It seems who is going down and who is getting the fourth spot seems more interesting than who is going to win the league.

 

[Tashyboy]

You make some valid points but this is going to take money and time. Time is definitely something managers seems short off at Old Trafford and there is no guarantee any big money signings won't be Maguires or others come in with a big ego and upset the dressing room. Ronaldho now seems like a huge mistake and you can't say he's looked like being a key player week in, week out. I would prefer Cavani of the two

I read a piece in the Manc evening news when City allegedly missed out on Messi and Ronaldo. Basically it said how would they fit in with Citys style of play. There’s lots of talk about Citys football, but when they don’t have the ball it’s high energy Press from all the players once they don’t have it. Ronaldo and Messi don’t have that same chase the ball energy now. City have not missed having either of them. So look at Utd with Cavani and Ronaldo. Theres not a chance that’s going to happen, a high press.
most of the Prem league has young energetic players. There’s no doubting Ronaldo and esp Cavanis class. But they are yesterdays players unfortunately.
There’s talk of Haaland and where he will go, but Utd with a wage bill for Pogba, Ronaldo and Haaland. ?
Looking forward to the Haaland saga and how it pans out. Come what may for Utd to have a shout in Haaland future 4th place is critical.

 

[Bdill93]

This all day long. It seems who is going down and who is getting the fourth spot seems more interesting than who is going to win the league.

Certainly seems to be a 2 horse race these days.

I don't agree it needs United to be successful though. Happy for them to rot to be honest You had it too good for too many years!

Chelsea have been the big let down this season for me