stone drains - local rule

[garyinderry]

Just noticed this weekend that they are not specifically mentioned in our local rules and basically the whole club is taking free drops from them when they shouldn't.

Stone drains or French drains, most of which have grass grown over them which makes them not covered by our local rules.

The nearest thing mentioned is open gullies but they are far from this description.

Checked the card from Moyola (a local course I played recently) as I had it handy and stone drains are specifically mentioned..

2. Relief from stone drains

Relief may be taken from drains where stones are clearly visible. Drop no nearer the hole - nearest point of relief. N.B. there is no relief from drains which have grassed over.



We have lots of opens and many players from other clubs would not think they have relief if they read our local rules. crazy to think our whole club takes relief freely all the time.

The wording is wrong even if gullies implies the drains with stones.

It can be fixed with a simple amendment to our local rules but to think its been going on for so long is mad.


I am pretty certain these drains are common on courses. does your local rules make reference to them or not?

 

[duncan mackie]

If I understand you correctly these drains are basically cut trenches filled with fine pebbles ?

These then mature naturally until they become invisible?

If so then in the absence of any local rule a player would be entitled to relief under 25-1 or 24-2 subject to interference. It's interesting to note that neither relief option matches the local rule you quote (nothing new there then!).

The club can make a LR declaring them all integral to the course, or they could make a LR declaring them GUR even when grown over but still clearly identifiable.

As with the undefined edges of artificially surfaced paths the absence of a local rule (or even the one quoted which calls for a subjective judgement) will always cause issues in the long run.

 

[garyinderry]

My mate took this video as we have been discussing it after the round on Sunday. There are loads of them dotted around and people habitually take a free drop without question from all of these.


Most are completely grassed over. Some a little more sparse.


These don't fall into the category of open gully for me. I can see visitors thinking they are not entitled to a drop. We have a scratch cup and pro am again this year. I amazed it hasn't come up as an issue yet. One of our players could easily be pulled up by a fellow competitor and rightly so.

[video=youtube;uGxf4umg_m0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGxf4umg_m0[/video]

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I might cuss and swear but I wouldn't expect a drop if no LR. Seems that it could be difficult to define one of these drains i a way that doesn't then permit relief from thinly grassed stony ground - unless the drain and it's extent is marked.

 

[garyinderry]

I might cuss and swear but I wouldn't expect a drop if no LR. Seems that it could be difficult to define one of these drains i a way that doesn't then permit relief from thinly grassed stony ground - unless the drain and it's extent is marked.

Make no mistake. when you are playing you can clearly see that there is some sort of drain at all these points. that video is too top down to show a true perspective.

Even when fully covered there is no mistaking what these are.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Make no mistake. when you are playing you can clearly see that there is some sort of drain at all these points. that video is too top down to show a true perspective.

Even when fully covered there is no mistaking what these are.

OK...

 

[KenL]

As with paths is it not the case that you do get a free drop unless there is a LR defining them as integral parts of the course?