Sports persons taking the knee

[2blue]

Mmmmmmmm......

 

[Canary_Yellow]

This I could not get my head around, why a black power salute when taking a knee is supposed to be non political. Black power is supposed to be political.
Yet the photo showing the Black power stand, again was That taken and shown for a reason.
Personally I think the taking a knee has run its course. Racism has no place anywhere especially in sport.

How can it have run its course when clearly from the wider discussion that has come out of the actions of the millwall fans there is still so much ignorance and misunderstanding?

I could understand an argument to replace it with something else if you think the issue is it’s losing its impact?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

This I could not get my head around, why a black power salute when taking a knee is supposed to be non political. Black power is supposed to be political.
Yet the photo showing the Black power stand, again was That taken and shown for a reason.
Personally I think the taking a knee has run its course. Racism has no place anywhere especially in sport.

It only runs its course when there is no more persecution based on someone’s colour. Until that day then no protest against racism will ever “run its course”

I fail to comprehend how white people can decide that a protest against racism has overrun ?

Can any one of us ever really comprehend what a black person has had to put with in their life. Not once have I been treated different because I’m white yet I suspect a black person would have to put up with that sort of judgment and persecution daily, weekly , monthly. I saw it in the military and I’m appalled at myself for just standing by back then and thinking it was just something thag didn’t affect or concern me

 

[Tashyboy]

How can it have run its course when clearly from the wider discussion that has come out of the actions of the millwall fans there is still so much ignorance and misunderstanding?

I could understand an argument to replace it with something else if you think the issue is it’s losing its impact?

The actions of Millwall fans ( and others) in no way has influenced my thoughts on how I feel re taking a knee. At the start it meant something and it still does. But personally I feel it comes across now as something we just do pre match. I feel it does need replacing with something else.

 

[2blue]

It only runs its course when there is no more persecution based on someone’s colour. Until that day then no protest against racism will ever “run its course”

I fail to comprehend how white people can decide that a protest against racism has overrun ?

Can any one of us ever really comprehend what a black person has had to put with in their life. Not once have I been treated different because I’m white yet I suspect a black person would have to put up with that sort of judgment and persecution daily, weekly , monthly. I saw it in the military and I’m appalled at myself for just standing by back then and thinking it was just normal

Absolutely this!!!
History has taught us that change can only be won by standing together, strong.... or in this case kneeling. There'll always be those who support those standing strong & sadly, there'll always be those who find reason/excuse to do otherwise.

 

[PhilTheFragger]

Whilst I am totally in favour of the anti racist aims of the BLM movement, I do feel that the original message has been somewhat hijacked by political radicals and has therefore lost its impact.

Additionally I feel that the act of kneeling indicates subserviance, whereas nobody should be subserviant to another, we are looking for equality after all.

Linking arms or another gesture to show support for this vital cause is needed in order to refocus the message

Just my opinion, written without my Mod hat on

 

[SatchFan]

I thought taking the knee was something to do with Game of Thrones.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Whilst I am totally in favour of the anti racist aims of the BLM movement, I do feel that the original message has been somewhat hijacked by political radicals and has therefore lost its impact.

Additionally I feel that the act of kneeling indicates subserviance, whereas nobody should be subserviant to another, we are looking for equality after all.

Linking arms or another gesture to show support for this vital cause is needed in order to refocus the message

Just my opinion, written without my Mod hat on

This explains the reason why they go down on one knee

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/explainers-53098516

An image of Martin Luther King going down on one knee while in prayer at a civil rights march in 1965 has been widely used in recent years.

 

[PhilTheFragger]

This explains the reason why they go down on one knee

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/explainers-53098516

An image of Martin Luther King going down on one knee while in prayer at a civil rights march in 1965 has been widely used in recent years.

I’m aware of the reasons why taking the knee was chosen, but most cultures would view kneeling as a subservient attitude, which isn’t equal, whereas linking arms is.

I have no problem at all with the message, but the imagery is at odds with that message

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I’m aware of the reasons why taking the knee was chosen, but most cultures would view kneeling as a subservient attitude, which isn’t equal, whereas linking arms is.

I have no problem at all with the message, but the imagery is at odds with that message

Surely it shouldn’t matter what other cultures see when it’s the message that black people from all cultures have decided because they see it as both a sign of respect as well as protest.

There are many images for someone kneeling which go back to the medieval times but in modern society many see it as a sign of respect. If the thinking it’s a sign of obedience or submission then maybe we also need to change that level of thinking ?

 

[BiMGuy]

Surely it shouldn’t matter what other cultures see when it’s the message that black people from all cultures have decided because they see it as both a sign of respect as well as protest.

There are many images for someone kneeling which go back to the medieval times but in modern society many see it as a sign of respect. If the thinking it’s a sign of obedience or submission then maybe we also need to change that level of thinking ?

Again, it is for the people kneeling to decide whether or not that is an appropriate way to to get the message out there.

The fact it is still bothering people shows the message still need to be put out there. Same as Lewis forcing F1 to do something. The outrage every week is enough to keep them doing it.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I’m aware of the reasons why taking the knee was chosen, but most cultures would view kneeling as a subservient attitude, which isn’t equal, whereas linking arms is.

I have no problem at all with the message, but the imagery is at odds with that message

Bit surprised you see taking the knee as subserviant being ex-military.

As a Junior Soldier were told it was for 2 reasons, resting while patrolling as you stayed alert and as a show of respect.

I do agree the meaning of it has been lost/hijacked recently though.

 

[PhilTheFragger]

Surely it shouldn’t matter what other cultures see when it’s the message that black people from all cultures have decided because they see it as both a sign of respect as well as protest.

There are many images for someone kneeling which go back to the medieval times but in modern society many see it as a sign of respect. If the thinking it’s a sign of obedience or submission then maybe we also need to change that level of thinking ?

Going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

Historically people have knelt to their God(S), their masters, to plead for mercy, to beg etc etc,
None of these denote equality

No one group of people should be above another, therefore the symbolism that represents this should be universally recognised as one of equality and not subservience.

 

[Kellfire]

For me taking a knee symbolises the fact that I don’t stand above anyone due to things like their race. I’ve never actually looked up what it means but I’m happy with my interpretation.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

For me taking a knee symbolises the fact that I don’t stand above anyone due to things like their race. I’ve never actually looked up what it means but I’m happy with my interpretation.

That’s the key - as Phil says for centuries taking the knee was showing a sign of submission to authority but that’s what history shows not how modern society should see it.

Paul has it right and where the kneeling came from with Kapernick speaking to someone in the military and being told it was a sign of respect - and that’s the message they have been trying to portray , we could all have our own opinions on what it portrays but we need to listen to the ones doing the protesting and understand their reasons

 

[drdel]

IMO the UK BLM is a radical organisation that detracts from the core message.

Taking the knee should be a purely personal choice and no one should be badgered or intimidated one way or another.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

IMO the UK BLM is a radical organisation that detracts from the core message.

Taking the knee should be a purely personal choice and no one should be badgered or intimidated one way or another.

Totally agree, but for that to happen people need to understand what taking the knee in this context means and not use their own interpretation.

 

[Tashyboy]

Totally agree, but for that to happen people need to understand what taking the knee in this context means and not use their own interpretation.

I think the problem is that whatever the physical action is re highlighting rascism , it will be hijacked and interpreted by extremists from both ends of the spectrum. This is a matter that should be covered in schools from an early age similar to the “DARE” drugs programme.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

IMO the UK BLM is a radical organisation that detracts from the core message.

Taking the knee should be a purely personal choice and no one should be badgered or intimidated one way or another.

I am with you. Having grown up in the late 70's and 80's I was fully aware of racism (and yes engaged in it myself to my shame), and saw it on the terraces, on the streets and even in the workplace. I think the Black Lives Matters has an important message but we've had the "Kick It Out" campaign for a while now and what has that realistically done to move the needle, either in the professional game or at grass root level. I think this BLM message and what happened at Millwall (and may happen there tonight) has become a political message and for that some of the impact, especially at sporting events has been lost. It is up to sporting bodies (imo) to get their house in order and can do more good far quicker by recognising those from different backgrounds (and crudely putting it for, the colour of their skin) and appointing them to key posts as long as they there on merit and not as a token gesture. Lets not forget it isn't that long ago in reality that the glass ceiling of women on boards of big companies or even in charge happened. Now, we are starting to get there slowly in terms of sexual equality and hopefully if sport can use coloured role models in power to show it can be done will send a more powerful and long term message than taking a knee will

 

[Colonel Bogey]

Don’t want to be booed but happy to be bullied...hmm

Gotta laugh at that. EVERYONE is being bullied into knee thing.