Scotland Debate

[Foxholer]

Absolutely, and that is the problem for a number of companies.

If there was a Scottish pound, surely it can only be used in Scotland then it would also require an exchange rate for crossing the border, very messy.

I wasn't meaning a Scottish Pound - surely Poond anyway - but simply use the UK Pound - with all the risks (cannot influence policy etc) that entails. The 'Bank of Last Resort' would already have to be something other then Bank of England anyway. And, of course, the Euro could be used in the same way - though more hassle!

 

[Val]

They will have to put contingency plans in place in case it DOESN'T come about - besides they may not yet have asked.

Maybe because YES contains a risk whereas NO doesn't (other than the UK leaving the EU) - and if they support a YES they will have to explain how they can do that given the uncertainty over currency etc. I think you are therefore more likely to have companies sit on the fence saying they are OK either way.

No large business will support a yes where there is uncertainty over currency especially if they cross border trade with the UK.

People can dress all the ands, if's and but's they like, if you are a multi million pound organisation why would back a proposal that could potentially cost your company lots of money when there is an alternative that costs nothing?

 

[Val]

I wasn't meaning a Scottish Pound - surely Poond anyway - but simply use the UK Pound - with all the risks (cannot influence policy etc) that entails. The 'Bank of Last Resort' would already have to be something other then Bank of England anyway. And, of course, the Euro could be used in the same way - though more hassle!

Surely you need a currency union to allow that?

 

[NWJocko]

They could offer Devo-max as a means to ensure a NO vote. So why don't they?

Do keep up. That was knocked on the head at the outset when Salmond was after his safety net on get ballot paper but the only way Westminster would allow a referendum was a straight Yes/No to Independence.

Amazed you don't know that with all the pontificating you do on the subject!!!!

 

[NWJocko]

He will say that in public - but when he has the chairmen of EVERY major company in Scotland coming to him in private and asking him whether there is absolutely 100% no chance of Scotland becoming part of a 'Sterling Zone' in the event of a YES - what will he say. They will look him in the eye and ask - you do know what this could mean to Scotland and it's people - and you the rUK government are willing to force Scotland to operate outside of the EU and a 'sterling zone' with all that that might entail. Because if you are saying this as part of your 'Campaign Fear' then please be fully aware of the real meaning of what you say.

We do go round in circles.

It is up to Salmond to negotiate and agree he picture post Yes. I still don't know why you see the onus on Westminster but then you never answer that question!!!

 

[Foxholer]

Surely you need a currency union to allow that?

No. Why? Plenty of countries use the US Dollar without having Currency Union.

In fact, there are plenty that say Europe would be better to have it that way (but with the Euro). That way the 'one size fits all' ECB wouldn't need to juggle Germany's efficiency with Greece's corruption! But that wouldn't suit the 'Federal States of Europe' goals that seem to be dominant.

 

[Val]

No. Why? Plenty of countries use the US Dollar without having Currency Union.

In fact, there are plenty that say Europe would be better to have it that way (but with the Euro). That way the 'one size fits all' ECB wouldn't need to juggle Germany's efficiency with Greece's corruption! But that wouldn't suit the 'Federal States of Europe' goals that seem to be dominant.

Hmm, fair point. Surely there had to be permission or agreement of sorts somewhere though, it can't be as easy as just picking a currency and saying that'll do.

If that's the case we should adopt the dong, it would be nice to listen to the wife say she has a good handful of dong

 

[williamalex1]

No. Why? Plenty of countries use the US Dollar without having Currency Union.

In fact, there are plenty that say Europe would be better to have it that way (but with the Euro). That way the 'one size fits all' ECB wouldn't need to juggle Germany's efficiency with Greece's corruption! But that wouldn't suit the 'Federal States of Europe' goals that seem to be dominant.

View attachment 9437will this do

 

[Doon frae Troon]

View attachment 9437will this do

Note the 'Sterling', that is not on the Bank of UK [England] notes.

 

[Foxholer]

Note the 'Sterling', that is not on the Bank of UK [England] notes.

And where it can be cashed in.

As the Scottish banks are authorised to print those notes (with some provisos) by the UK Government, that authorisation, the printing and what is printed on them would be another thing that would need to be reviewed and very likely have to change.

Btw. It is a criminal offence to reproduce banknotes in any way without consent!!

 

[DCB]

That has been doing the rounds for a while. Don't really think it can be classed as a bona fide banknote by.any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Foxholer]

That has been doing the rounds for a while. Don't really think it can be classed as a bona fide banknote by.any stretch of the imagination.

Doesn't matter whether it's bona fide or not!

Here's a rather relevant bit from Bank of England. There'll be an equivalent for Scottish Notes.
[Extract]
Introduction
Under section 18(1) of the Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981 it is a criminal offence for any person, without the prior consent in writing of the Bank of England, to reproduce on any substance whatsoever, and whether or not on the correct scale, any Bank of England banknote or any part of a Bank of England banknote. The Bank of England also owns the copyright in its banknotes.

Novelty Banknotes
The Bank of England does not give authority for any reproductions in the form of a novelty banknote (e.g. one where a celebrity or other images are shown on a banknote or other such changes). This is because there have been instances of notes altered in this way, being accepted as genuine banknotes by unsuspecting members of the public.

[/Extract]

'Harmless' as they are, their mere presence means that the Forum is breaking the law!

 

[ger147]

Doesn't matter whether it's bona fide or not!

Here's a rather relevant bit from Bank of England. There'll be an equivalent for Scottish Notes.
[Extract]
Introduction
Under section 18(1) of the Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981 it is a criminal offence for any person, without the prior consent in writing of the Bank of England, to reproduce on any substance whatsoever, and whether or not on the correct scale, any Bank of England banknote or any part of a Bank of England banknote. The Bank of England also owns the copyright in its banknotes.

Novelty Banknotes
The Bank of England does not give authority for any reproductions in the form of a novelty banknote (e.g. one where a celebrity or other images are shown on a banknote or other such changes). This is because there have been instances of notes altered in this way, being accepted as genuine banknotes by unsuspecting members of the public.

[/Extract]

'Harmless' as they are, their mere presence means that the Forum is breaking the law!

They are not Bank of England notes.

 

[Foxholer]

They are not Bank of England notes.

Read the line above [Extract]!

Only quoted the BofE because it specifically mentioned Novelty ones. Here's a bit more that includes Scottish.



The reproduction of banknotes is an offence. The law states that:
(1) It is an offence for any person, unless the relevant authority has previously consented in writing, to reproduce on any substance whatsoever, and whether or not on the correct scale, any British currency note or any part of a British currency note.
(2) In this section—
“British currency note” means any note which—
(a) has been lawfully issued in England and Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland; and
(b) is or has been customarily used as money in the country where it was issued; and
(c) is payable on demand; and
“the relevant authority”, in relation to a British currency note of any particular description, means the authority empowered by law to issue notes of that description. (Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981, s.18).

If you want to reproduce parts of a banknote, consent of the bank is required in advance. This applies to the reproduction of the front or the back of a banknote, for reproductions of all banknotes issued in the UK whether current legal tender or not; and for all possible reproductions, including modified or distorted reproductions. Until you receive written consent, you are not entitled to reproduce any banknote or any part of a banknote. Permission to reproduce banknotes or parts of it needs to be sought from the issuing bank.

 

[ger147]

Read the line above [Extract]!

Only quoted the BofE because it specifically mentioned Novelty ones. Here's a bit more that includes Scottish.



The reproduction of banknotes is an offence. The law states that:
(1) It is an offence for any person, unless the relevant authority has previously consented in writing, to reproduce on any substance whatsoever, and whether or not on the correct scale, any British currency note or any part of a British currency note.
(2) In this section—
“British currency note” means any note which—
(a) has been lawfully issued in England and Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland; and
(b) is or has been customarily used as money in the country where it was issued; and
(c) is payable on demand; and
“the relevant authority”, in relation to a British currency note of any particular description, means the authority empowered by law to issue notes of that description. (Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981, s.18).

If you want to reproduce parts of a banknote, consent of the bank is required in advance. This applies to the reproduction of the front or the back of a banknote, for reproductions of all banknotes issued in the UK whether current legal tender or not; and for all possible reproductions, including modified or distorted reproductions. Until you receive written consent, you are not entitled to reproduce any banknote or any part of a banknote. Permission to reproduce banknotes or parts of it needs to be sought from the issuing bank.

Not arguing with the law about bank notes, just your quoting of the BoE about Scottish bank notes.

I notice that the novelty notes rule is not part of the act.

 

[williamalex1]

Oops were going to have to take the makers of the Monopoly money to court , their notes are better than Salmonds twinties.

 

[Foxholer]

Oops were going to have to take the makers of the Monopoly money to court , their notes are better than Salmonds twinties.

Only if Monopoly money reproduced/copied 'British Currency Notes'. As that's not the case, no problem.

I believe it's also fine to create your own e.g. Bank of Mum and Dad notes, provided they are not 'based' on British Currency ones. And the guy that I heard this from was one I was 'minded to believe' - an employee of one of those Scottish Banks with a law degree - and I think working in something like the 'Corporate Legal' area! He had a bit of a panic when someone was photocopying/amending one of their notes in a similar jokey way for a social evening!

Still! Back fully On Topic! Currency does seem to be one of the 'sticking points'!:lol:

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Went along to my village yes debate tonight.
Some interesting speakers including a Scottish Socialist and one anti-English idiot.
My SNP voting English wife soon put the idiot right though.

The Yes folk seem to be quite confident that the voters will buy into a Scottish currency. A fiscal studies expert [from the floor] said that it is just one great big bluff and that there is no way a rUK will not accommodate a Scottish pound. A Standard Life insider also said Scotland will keep the pound and that they [SL] are going nowhere.

Mainly greyskulls in the audience, disappointing that there were no young folk.
The yes folk think the momentum is with them and they will just about carry the day.
As a fence sitter, I think I will remain there. No vote debate coming soon. Their new slogan 'Be positive Vote NO'.

 

[CMAC]

Went along to my village yes debate tonight.
Some interesting speakers including a Scottish Socialist and one anti-English idiot.
My SNP voting English wife soon put the idiot right though.

The Yes folk seem to be quite confident that the voters will buy into a Scottish currency. A fiscal studies expert [from the floor] said that it is just one great big bluff and that there is no way a rUK will not accommodate a Scottish pound. A Standard Life insider also said Scotland will keep the pound and that they [SL] are going nowhere.

Mainly greyskulls in the audience, disappointing that there were no young folk.
The yes folk think the momentum is with them and they will just about carry the day.
As a fence sitter, I think I will remain there. No vote debate coming soon. Their new slogan 'Be positive Vote NO'.

I prefer 'You have to be dence to vote for independence' :mmm:


You have to admire their unwavering resilience in ignoring facts, Mr Salmond has taught them well:blah:

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Went along to my village yes debate tonight.
Some interesting speakers including a Scottish Socialist and one anti-English idiot.
My SNP voting English wife soon put the idiot right though.

The Yes folk seem to be quite confident that the voters will buy into a Scottish currency. A fiscal studies expert [from the floor] said that it is just one great big bluff and that there is no way a rUK will not accommodate a Scottish pound. A Standard Life insider also said Scotland will keep the pound and that they [SL] are going nowhere.

Mainly greyskulls in the audience, disappointing that there were no young folk.
The yes folk think the momentum is with them and they will just about carry the day.
As a fence sitter, I think I will remain there. No vote debate coming soon. Their new slogan 'Be positive Vote NO'.

According to George Soros it would seem that the euro would be the most likely currency for Scotland in the event of a Yes vote.

If so I wish all you Scots the best of luck.