Push Fade

[JustOne]

@swingsitlikehogan - people tend to hit DOWN a little more (or shall we say LESS UP) with their 3-wood which lends itself a little more to hitting a draw, so does the slightly shorter shaft (easier to swing from the inside).

This whole thread is somewhat splitting hairs as the reason it's called a PUSH-fade is that you push the ball, that means it will start to the right of your alignment... and if it's fading then it'll go even more right. The straighter your swingpath and the squarer the face the less curvature you'll get on ANY BALL FLIGHT. If you want to START any shot more online then you need a squarer clubface, if you want it to curve less then you need to straighten out your path so it's closer to the face direction AT IMPACT.

If you're gonna hit a push-fade then the ball is going to be heading to the right of your alignment, if you're lined up down the middle then you're going to be visiting the right rough quite a lot.

 

[SocketRocket]

But you started by saying

I would suggest a 'Fade" would be a better shot for you.

And then you finished by telling him how to hit it straight

He is hitting a push fade. I did suggest that a 'Fade' is a better shot for him. Do you disagree with this?

I suggested that closing down the difference between his clubface direction and swingpath would help him do this. I said 'Closing Down' I didnt say he should have them exactly the same. Did I ? I then went on to suggest that if he could do this he could then look into his alignment.

You can always PM me if you want any clarification on my posts.

 

[bobmac]

The OP asks a question.
The question gets answered
Then the pedantic bickering starts.
Another swing thread where I've completely lost interest AGAIN
No wonder I get fed up trying to help people

 

[JustOne]

The OP asks a question.
The question gets answered
Then the pedantic bickering starts.
Another swing thread where I've completely lost interest AGAIN
No wonder I get fed up trying to help people

All the threads go like that..... I wouldn't let it get your back up big guy

:-D

 

[One Planer]

Thanks for all the input gentlemen.

Plenty of food for thought after reading through the replies.

Like I said in the OP, I'm more than happy to hit the push fade as it gives me, in my view alot more distance than a pull fade. If aiming fractionally more left to give me a better start line is the only adjustment I need to play the shot then so be it.

I still want to learn other flights so improving the swing path and impact position (Face angle) will be paramount, but as it stands I'm happy with the push fade as I can hit this without too much thought.

Thanks again gentlemen :thup:

 

[chris661]

The OP asks a question.
The question gets answered
Then the pedantic bickering starts.
Another swing thread where I've completely lost interest AGAIN
No wonder I get fed up trying to help people

Well once the question is answered why do you bother going back into it if it annoys you so much?

 

[Alex1975]

The OP asks a question.
The question gets answered
Then the pedantic bickering starts.
Another swing thread where I've completely lost interest AGAIN
No wonder I get fed up trying to help people

It’s not like that bob, you are highly respected, and I have never heard anyone say anything but that... People like to test themselves and learn and join in and contribute where they can, often to grow their own knowledge. Sometimes people want to be corrected and or have their knowledge questioned.

It really is not meant to be anything other than chowing the fat.

 

[SocketRocket]

The OP asks a question.
The question gets answered
Then the pedantic bickering starts.
Another swing thread where I've completely lost interest AGAIN
No wonder I get fed up trying to help people

Bob. I have not questioned your answers at all, I gave my advice to the OP and you took it on yourself to question it, all I did from there was clarify what I had said. Just reread the thread.

What exactly would you prefer?

 

[bobmac]

Bob. I have not questioned your answers at all. I gave my advice to the OP and you took it on yourself to question it, all I did from there was clarify what I had said.

What exactly would you prefer us to do?

One of the things I learned during my training was to listen. Listen to or read the question carefully and answer the question.
The OP in this case wanted to start his push fade a little straighter. That was it.

I shouldn't have had a go at you as there are others on here who seem to go out of their way to try and discredit my advice and question my knowledge not only on the swing but all matters golf.

I just get fed up sometimes especially with the weather this summer but I shall try and lighten up and pay less heed to my detractors.
Apologies

 

[SocketRocket]

One of the things I learned during my training was to listen. Listen to or read the question carefully and answer the question.
The OP in this case wanted to start his push fade a little straighter. That was it.

I shouldn't have had a go at you as there are others on here who seem to go out of their way to try and discredit my advice and question my knowledge not only on the swing but all matters golf.

I just get fed up sometimes especially with the weather this summer but I shall try and lighten up and pay less heed to my detractors.
Apologies

OK, thanks for the reply.

I still think a fade would be much better shot for him, push fades IMO are not a good idea.

 

[One Planer]

OK, thanks for the reply.

I still think a fade would be much better shot for him, push fades IMO are not a good idea.

Why so Brian?

 

[SocketRocket]

Why so Brian?

A 'push fade' starts out right and then fades right from there. Why would you want to do that other than bending the ball around a right dogleg, the ball will end up in the right side rough most of the time, unless you start off aiming well left of target.

A fade is a nice controlled shot that starts a little left and bends back into the target. A much more powerful, useful standard shot in my opinion.

 

[bobmac]

A fade is a nice controlled shot that starts a little left and bends back into the target

If you aimed straight would that be a pull fade?

 

[JustOne]

If you aimed straight would that be a pull fade?

Bob, I don't want to do anyone a disservice here but one minute you're saying that people question what you have said and you then straight away go on to question someone yourself. Now I'm sure that this is just healthy debate and I'm all for that but it does seem a bit unfair for you to (metaphorically speaking) throw toys out of the pram each time a thread goes off the rails or appears not to suit you to then add fuel to the fire yourself. I for one would like to see us all live in perfect harmony where everyone's replies are perfect and never questioned (hell I've had enough stick for stack and tilt over the years) but that's not how a forum works...as we know even Faldo would get questioned on this forum!!

You are without doubt the heartbeat of this forum and I for one am grateful for your posts, I've learned a lot of things from you, not least to listen, but you also changed my attitude (for the better) towards instruction as a whole. There isn't anything that you say that I don't respect...even if I don't necessarily agree with at the time of posting.

On that note, perhaps it's lost in translation sometimes (I have quite a wry humour) however I don't think I disagreed with a single thing you said in this thread....and I do wish you'd stop beating yourself up everytime it appears that way.. you're a top, top bloke and you should be aware of that....... and the right answer was definitely Frimley-on-Thames! ;-)

 

[bobmac]

I just read the OP.
He wants to hit a "better" push fade without it turning into a pull fade.
SR then tells him he should learn how to hit a pull fade? he specifically said he didnt want that shape.
If as a golf pro I did that in a lesson, I wouldn't last 5 mins.
The whole point of asking questions is to find out what the pupil wants from the lesson, not to tell him what he should learn.
SR still thinks he's right, I still think I'm right.
We'll have to agree to differ.

 

[JustOne]

I totally agree Bob, however I'm not about to start ripping in to SR for his opinion, or take it personally. If I could give you a big hug and say "don't worry about it" I would LOLOL

 

[Foxholer]

I thought a push fade wash hit with an in to out or an in to in swingpath......

I agree. And squaring the face will turn that into a straight Push - which may or may not be more desirable than the P-F.

If the swing path was 5 degrees out to in to the target and the club face was open 10 degrees to the target, what would you expect the ball flight to be ?

Doh!!

I think I dropped into Old Ball Flight mode there!

Thanks Bob! (smiley mode) applause (/smiley mode)

Reminder to self: It's (almost) all about Face Angle (and slightly about Swing Path)!

 

[SocketRocket]

If you aimed straight would that be a pull fade?

I'm getting a bit fed up with this! My opinion is that push fades are not a good standard shot shape, THAT'S MY OPINION. The OP asked me why I thought that and I told him.


You seem to want to interfere with my post and then suggest that others are doing the same to you. As I said before , I dont interfere with your suggestions and I respectfully suggest that you read what I have said properly before interfering with mine.

 

[JustOne]

I'm getting a bit fed up with this! My opinion is that push fades are not a good standard shot shape, THAT'S MY OPINION. The OP asked me why I thought that and I told him.

(nb: trying to stay away from the Bobmac/SocketRocket tension that is in the air.....)

Socket, I'm not going to dispute your opinion as you are entitled to it, however I am (am I not?) allowed to discuss it with you and therefore ask questions? I'd be interested in your reasoning behind your opinion seeing that a pull fade would require that the swingpath be more out-to-in at impact.... would you subsequently start recommending that people start their downswings with their shoulders to help promote the required OTT move?

 

[SocketRocket]

(nb: trying to stay away from the Bobmac/SocketRocket tension that is in the air.....)

Socket, I'm not going to dispute your opinion as you are entitled to it, however I am (am I not?) allowed to discuss it with you and therefore ask questions? I'd be interested in your reasoning behind your opinion seeing that a pull fade would require that the swingpath be more out-to-in at impact.... would you subsequently start recommending that people start their downswings with their shoulders to help promote the required OTT move?

Of course you can discuss my opinions with me, it is a forum after all.

I tend to think that a fade or draw is a good controlled shot that most good players want to hit (nothing much wrong with straight either) . Shots like push fades or pull draws to me are shot patterns that encourage putting the ball in the rough.

Now! someone like the OP may want to hit a push fade and if thats what floats his boat great. It's just that my initial reaction is to try and encourage him to hit a stock shot that will enable him to play better golf. If he wants to ignore that then thats OK with me, I wont get wobbly about it.

Getting back to your question: No, I dont suggest that people start their downswing with their shoulders, I assume the OP may already be hitting somewhat out to in as he is creating fade spin, he may be hitting 'in to in' also with an open clubface and right side alignment, without a video we can only guess. I suggested originally that if he closed down the difference between his clubface direction and swingpath then he would be in a better position and maybe a correction to his alignment would then get him hitting better shots. As you know, to hit a fade you dont need to make an excessive out to in swing.