Premier League 2019-2020 we’re off

[Orikoru]

He is only 22 or 23, and had 2-3 bad injuries.

The criteria was based on the one season of play, not their whole career.

Who says it was? They were comparing Liverpool's team with the Man Utd team of 1999. So I would take that to mean their career up to and including 1999. So if we're talking about Giggs, he had just won his 5th Premier League, had over 50 league goals and lord knows how many assists by that point. That's the player you're comparing to.

 

[Papas1982]

We did mate. We chased him until the end, but, Riola's deal with Dortmund is crazy. They bought him for 18 mil and anything they get for him over 20m goes to Riola. Dortmund get a class player for a couple of years and 2m profit. Not a bad deal if you look at it in the short term, I'm not if UTD were offered the same deal , but were probably arrogant in their discussions with Riaola given the relationship the club has with this particular agent, and the comments he is making about the club.

From everything I read you were pretty much offered a similar deal. It's understandable that Utd see themsleves as less of a stepping stone than dortmund considering your status.

Plus Riaola has bent you over a few times. So get your stance on the deal. Personally think you (Utd) should have swallowed your pride, but can see why you didn't.

Tbf it was only a joke ??

 

[Papas1982]

Who says it was? They were comparing Liverpool's team with the Man Utd team of 1999. So I would take that to mean their career up to and including 1999. So if we're talking about Giggs, he had just won his 5th Premier League, had over 50 league goals and lord knows how many assists by that point. That's the player you're comparing to.

I'd still take Mane in a 433.
Giggs in the 442.

A clubs success doesn't solely determine a players ability either, Djemba And Kleberson have league titles and Gerrard doesnt, who are you gonna pick?
Mane has 6 Premier league seasons behind him and has massively outscored Giggs, even when at Saints, not sure about assist tbh.

Edit.

Just checked PL stats. During his PL career Giggs involved in 0.48 Goall's per game. Mane 0.58 per game.

Giggs with a higher ratio of assists. So they fit their respective teams well.

 

[Orikoru]

I'd still take Mane in a 433.

A clubs success doesn't solely determine a players ability either, Djemba And Kleberson have league titles and Gerrard doesnt, who are you gonna pick?
Mane has 6 Premier league seasons behind him and has massively outscored Giggs, even when at Saints, not sure about assist tbh.

Kleberson obviously. He also won a World Cup.

Edit: anyway, I'm changing mine after discussing it with my mates.

Schmeichel
Neville Stam VVD Robertson
Becks Scholes Keane Giggs
Mane Salah​

 

[Junior]

From everything I read you were pretty much offered a similar deal. It's understandable that Utd see themsleves as less of a stepping stone than dortmund considering your status.

Plus Riaola has bent you over a few times. So get your stance on the deal. Personally think you (Utd) should have swallowed your pride, but can see why you didn't.

Tbf it was only a joke ??

I agree, we should have bitten the bullet and swallowed our pride !

 

[HomerJSimpson]

So FIFA's solution to VAR and offside is to change the offside rules to suit VAR.

Unlike them to make a hash of anything isn't it? Bound to over complicate, fudge or confuse the issue again

 

[pokerjoke]

Its no use arguing when someone is acting so stupid, and cant answer the question posed.

I think you should go and see a doctor.

The whole discussion was over one season, not their careers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! for the fifth time.

Lmao Pete sounds like your losing your mind
Let’s just take a step back.
The original post 9985 from Orikoru was about a team debate from Utds 99 team and yours this season as a combined team.
You said look at it from the last 12 months for both teams.
You also said Gomez would probably get in and emphasised his clean sheets stats.
(My point there would be they are not Gomez stats they are Liverpool’s stats,the whole team working hard,a very good back 4 and a world class keeper.
You then said Stam/Gomez “you would probably side with Stam over the career he had.
So you changed from 12 months to career,well make your mind up.
Now wether we are comparing 12 months or career imo Gomez has achieved nothing it’s all probability.
He’s played 61 league games in 5 years and never scored.
A season is 40 games for a top player in a team fighting on all fronts.
When I asked you what season you were referring to you came up with Winter and Spring.
Seriously.
Anyway on a positive note you must have been pleased with a 1-0 last night?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Strange game last night, Liverpool played really well and had a large chunk of possession yet they had few [if any] shots on target.

 

[USER1999]

I don't get Wengers proposed change to the offside rule. He thinks it will get rid of being offside by millimetres. It won't. It just moves the measurement from the most forward part, to the most rearward part. Same measurement, same decisions to be made.

 

[clubchamp98]

Strange game last night, Liverpool played really well and had a large chunk of possession yet they had few [if any] shots on target.

Not sure about “ played really well”
They had possession but didn’t do much with it.
When a team sits back like that it’s tough we hardly got behind them.
I can’t remember the keeper making a save.
Our free kicks and corners were poor, and in a game like that was our best chance to score.
We had a couple of chances but never hit the target.
Very frustrating but that’s football ,all about the result.

 

[Kellfire]

I don't get Wengers proposed change to the offside rule. He thinks it will get rid of being offside by millimetres. It won't. It just moves the measurement from the most forward part, to the most rearward part. Same measurement, same decisions to be made.

Allows more goals though.

 

[Orikoru]

I don't get Wengers proposed change to the offside rule. He thinks it will get rid of being offside by millimetres. It won't. It just moves the measurement from the most forward part, to the most rearward part. Same measurement, same decisions to be made.

I'm not sure, I think he's onto something he's just worded it strangely (maybe language barrier - despite all his years living in England he still had an odd turn of phrase). If we can get back to level with the defence being onside, then I'll be happier anyway. And I think that's what he means. Although he's gone too far the other way as it sounds like in his method you could be onside if you drag your toe behind you to be inline with the defence while the rest of you is beyond them, haha.

Honestly it's like lunatics running the asylum with VAR, they overcomplicate it when it actually needs to be simplified.

 

[USER1999]

But even with level, now offside can be measured, and it will be, mm is the measurement. How level is level?

 

[clubchamp98]

But even with level, now offside can be measured, and it will be, mm is the measurement. How level is level?

They should just use the shoulders!
If any of your shoulders are onside your on .
Daylight between your shoulders and the defenders your off.
But any system under VAR will need to be measured.

 

[User62651]

Not sure about “ played really well”
They had possession but didn’t do much with it.
When a team sits back like that it’s tough we hardly got behind them.
I can’t remember the keeper making a save.
Our free kicks and corners were poor, and in a game like that was our best chance to score.
We had a couple of chances but never hit the target.
Very frustrating but that’s football ,all about the result.

going to Atletico is about as tough as it gets, no matter what domestic form they might be showing. Pre match said to my eldest that Liverpool would lose despite form suggesting otherwise and was proved correct. Spanish opposition away is always tough.
1-0 is ok though, 2-0 you'd be out.
This 2nd leg is very dangeorus for Liverpool, think they may be a little overrated tbh, still good enough to win ECL again of course but not so far ahead of the top European clubs as some might say.
Robertson and A Arnold were a bit flat last night, maybe going behind so early changed the psyche of the team. go 1-0 down to Athletico and thy defend as a unit better than anyone. You have to score first v them. Lots of possession and sideways play but no penetration. I almost though Klopp should have an Andy Carroll/Peter Crouch type target man on the bench just as a plan B, a means to play route 1 when it could be a last resort option. Worked with Spurs and LLorente last year for example.
Game on though.

 

[Orikoru]

But even with level, now offside can be measured, and it will be, mm is the measurement. How level is level?

As I've said before, you don't need to measure anything, just let the ref/lino review it on screen, have a look at the replay and if they look level he's onside. It really could be that simple. Just like the decisions they make in real time, they make a judgement on whether he's level or offside, having a second look at it on-screen just helps them make that judgement.

 

[clubchamp98]

going to Atletico is about as tough as it gets, no matter what domestic form they might be showing. Pre match said to my eldest that Liverpool would lose despite form suggesting otherwise and was proved correct. Spanish opposition away is always tough.
1-0 is ok though, 2-0 you'd be out.
This 2nd leg is very dangeorus for Liverpool, think they may be a little overrated tbh, still good enough to win ECL again of course but not so far ahead of the top European clubs as some might say.
Robertson and A Arnold were a bit flat last night, maybe going behind so early changed the psyche of the team. go 1-0 down to Athletico and thy defend as a unit better than anyone. You have to score first v them. Lots of possession and sideways play but no penetration. I almost though Klopp should have an Andy Carroll/Peter Crouch type target man on the bench just as a plan B, a means to play route 1 when it could be a last resort option. Worked with Spurs and LLorente last year for example.
Game on though.

Yes I agree the CF have said on many occasions we have no plan B.
But this is Klopp way ,he has total faith in it. And to be fair it’s worked very well.!
He could have put VVD up for the last 15 mins ,he had a big height advantage but the crosses never found him, but think he was quite happy with 1-0.
A lot of the time Firmino is not in the box as he’s working in the 10 role.
This makes it tough for the fullbacks to find someone with a cross unless the midfielders get past the strikers.
We had a few chances but didn’t take them.
An away goal would have been nice but you have to credit them they stopped us scoring and not many teams have done that.

 

[clubchamp98]

As I've said before, you don't need to measure anything, just let the ref/lino review it on screen, have a look at the replay and if they look level he's onside. It really could be that simple. Just like the decisions they make in real time, they make a judgement on whether he's level or offside, having a second look at it on-screen just helps them make that judgement.

I agree but they seem very reluctant to use the screen!
I am wondering why?

 

[Liverbirdie]

Lmao Pete sounds like your losing your mind
Let’s just take a step back.
The original post 9985 from Orikoru was about a team debate from Utds 99 team and yours this season as a combined team.
You said look at it from the last 12 months for both teams.
You also said Gomez would probably get in and emphasised his clean sheets stats.
(My point there would be they are not Gomez stats they are Liverpool’s stats,the whole team working hard,a very good back 4 and a world class keeper.
You then said Stam/Gomez “you would probably side with Stam over the career he had.
So you changed from 12 months to career,well make your mind up.
Now wether we are comparing 12 months or career imo Gomez has achieved nothing it’s all probability.
He’s played 61 league games in 5 years and never scored.
A season is 40 games for a top player in a team fighting on all fronts.
When I asked you what season you were referring to you came up with Winter and Spring.
Seriously.
Anyway on a positive note you must have been pleased with a 1-0 last night?

Lmao Pete sounds like your losing your mind - Good, will you propose me for the lunatic asylum - just 5 day for me, couldnt do the weekends also like you.
Let’s just take a step back.
The original post 9985 from Orikoru was about a team debate from Utds 99 team and yours this season as a combined team. - Firstly, you've mentioned soft lad, no interest in him, just based on the when Carra and keane were talking about it and the criteria they used.
You said look at it from the last 12 months for both teams. - yes, see above.
You also said Gomez would probably get in and emphasised his clean sheets stats. - Yes, even over the last few months 10 clean sheets in 11 is some form. We hardly had any clean sheets when it was Matip or Lovren alongside VVD this season, which is why Gomez is nearly/just as important as VVD.
(My point there would be they are not Gomez stats they are Liverpool’s stats,the whole team working hard,a very good back 4 and a world class keeper. - see above, hardly any clean sheets when Gomez not in.
You then said Stam/Gomez “you would probably side with Stam over the career he had. - I brought in the "career" thing, cos you wouldnt shut up about it, and as I repeatedly said - people are always going to look at stellar careers of retired players, instead of young players at the start of their career, but it shouldnt be used (or tempered, as much as possible in this discussion). BUT it absolutely shouldnt be trotted out every 2 miniutes like you were doing.
So you changed from 12 months to career,well make your mind up. - used it once for the reason above, not loads of times.
Now wether we are comparing 12 months or career imo Gomez has achieved nothing it’s all probability. - He has won one CL, same as Jaap Stam and not using Nandrolone - yes, look it up.
He’s played 61 league games in 5 years and never scored. - Why are you judging CH's on goals, it should be further down the list after clean sheets, honours etc. You ignored Giggs goals compared to mane's (a position you should be judging goals and assists on).
A season is 40 games for a top player in a team fighting on all fronts. - Yes, did u know Stam only made 79 appearances for Man U in 3 seasons.......about 26/27 a season on average - did that surprise you.
When I asked you what season you were referring to you came up with Winter and Spring. - Glad you got the joke.
Seriously.
Anyway on a positive note you must have been pleased with a 1-0 last night? Yes.

Anything else?

Disclaimer alert: Any spelling mistakes are probably Tony's, and none of these statistics were supplied from Wikipedia (Milton Keynes branch).

Go on expand on what I've said.......

 

[Liverbirdie]

Wenger's recommendation for VAR and offside is the very worst option put forward so far, even worse than allowing "daylight".

Peter Crouch may come out of retirement now.

Can you imagine a 6ft 7 inch fella doing a diving header and having just his little pinky toe onside, so its okay? Ludicrous.