Premier League 2019-2020 we’re off

[Deleted member 1740]

Correct, highest for an FA cup game for a club side, possibly swelled by many Stoke fans that are only down the road, but still, yes, a record.Fair play.

But.......

It was still 4k below capacity.

And........

The record for a league game at Maine Road, was actually achieved by your bitter rivals Man United. Ouch.

Hello, hello.......

BFT ?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Its a narrative that some people are formulating for various reasons, and we know what one of the reasons is.

How can a league be weaker or less competitive if there are lets say 6-8 clubs still in with a shout of getting 4th or 5th place? The title race is, because a potentially once in a lifetime run of results from one team.

Surely, outwith the title race, its more competitive?

Because if the “normal” big 6 all perform you normally get 1 or 2 of the lesser teams looked at as having an exceptional season fighting for 7th with a big gap to the rest, and this year we have one outstanding team and 6-8 mediocre.

So if you prefer mediocre teams taking points off each other then yes they are more competitive with each other, but going on the standards set by the, “normal”, big 6 over the recent years the PL as a whole is not as strong this season as previous imo.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

What’s this “top 4” smashed thjng ?

And in the CL ? Has it really been smashed ? Who out of the top clubs in Europe have won the CL in the past decade ? No one - it’s the same teams - Barce , Madrid , Liverpool etc

The Top 4 was always promoted by Sky as Utd, Chelsea, LPool and Arsenal, we now have the Big 6 thanks to Spurs and City.

Sky rubbish, but it is what’s happened.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Linked arguments though.

Whether VAR is making the big teams not get "home side / big decisions" as much may be one factor, the less well off clubs being in a better state to repel larger clubs in them taking their players, all in all the league is more competitive, provided 4 finalists 9 months ago to the premier European trophies, and all current sides getting to the knockout stages of Europe, so not sure how the league is weaker.

Granted, due to our form you think it looks that way, but we had shown a normal form for top 1-2-3 in a league we would probably be on around 50 points at this stage, but due to us winning 95% of games it skews the rest of the league. What are most challengers on points wise around this time of year, traditionally - around what City and Leicester are on?

 

[MegaSteve]

For me, Pep is playing a blinder... The owners like the thrill of the chase... As soon as they've done some winning they lose interest and look elsewhere for their 'kicks'...

 

[Liverbirdie]

Because if the “normal” big 6 all perform you normally get 1 or 2 of the lesser teams looked at as having an exceptional season fighting for 7th with a big gap to the rest, and this year we have one outstanding team and 6-8 mediocre.

So if you prefer mediocre teams taking points off each other then yes they are more competitive with each other, but going on the standards set by the, “normal”, big 6 over the recent years the PL as a whole is not as strong this season as previous imo.

See my reply to Tony, about normal challengers points total for around this time of year.

 

[Liverbirdie]

The Top 4 was always promoted by Sky as Utd, Chelsea, LPool and Arsenal, we now have the Big 6 thanks to Spurs and City.

Sky rubbish, but it is what’s happened.

Yes, and us 3 are also of an age when the "big 5" was always touted, as well - Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton, United and Spurs - maybe in that order, as well.

 

[pokerjoke]

Linked arguments though.

Whether VAR is making the big teams not get "home side / big decisions" as much may be one factor, the less well off clubs being in a better state to repel larger clubs in them taking their players, all in all the league is more competitive, provided 4 finalists 9 months ago to the premier European trophies, and all current sides getting to the knockout stages of Europe, so not sure how the league is weaker.

Granted, due to our form you think it looks that way, but we had shown a normal form for top 1-2-3 in a league we would probably be on around 50 points at this stage, but due to us winning 95% of games it skews the rest of the league. What are most challengers on points wise around this time of year, traditionally - around what City and Leicester are on?

Don’t think we will ever agree on this

 

[Orikoru]

Coul

Could VAR be a factor ?
Big decisions going against the so called big clubs .
Lots of goals chalked off
Plus a lot of teams can’t defend to save their lives. Including City.
A good defender is worth his weight in gold now ,years ago that was exclusively for strikers.

I wouldn't put it down to VAR. Every club has their own reasons for under-performance. With City they left their squad grossly under-strengthed with no replacement for Kompany despite having no trust in Stones or Otamendi. No decent left back brought in either. With Arsenal and Man Utd it's just poor management. For Chelsea obviously they were going through a period of transition with the transfer ban and youngsters being used - and they coped reasonably well for a while. For Spurs I think it was staleness of having the same core squad for too long, and the new signings weren't able to make a big impact early on in the season.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Don’t think we will ever agree on this

maybe not, but you havent given one stat, or good insight, just your gut feeling - maybe back the argument up with something?

 

[Deleted member 16999]

See my reply to Tony, about normal challengers points total for around this time of year.

I don’t in anyway think this reflects on you lot and what you’re achieving/achieved, even if the other 5 were on top form you’d still be miles ahead, but Leics would be talked about possibly reaching the EL and Sheff Utd would be talked about at being safe with 40pts with games to spare, not as a team possibly in the mix for a EL spot.

City if they win all their remaining fixtures can only get 90pts, so by their standards they’ve gone backwards as have the other 4.

 

[clubchamp98]

I wouldn't put it down to VAR. Every club has their own reasons for under-performance. With City they left their squad grossly under-strengthed with no replacement for Kompany despite having no trust in Stones or Otamendi. No decent left back brought in either. With Arsenal and Man Utd it's just poor management. For Chelsea obviously they were going through a period of transition with the transfer ban and youngsters being used - and they coped reasonably well for a well. For Spurs I think it was staleness of having the same core squad for too long, and the new signings weren't able to make a big impact early on in the season.

Yes I see your point but I think VAR has had a part to play by disallowing goals it’s changed some results .
But only a factor not the whole reason.

 

[Orikoru]

Yes I see your point but I think VAR has had a part to play by disallowing goals it’s changed some results .
But only a factor not the whole reason.

It may have been a slight leveller if you take the view that big clubs used to get the benefit on more decisions. But in that case Liverpool have been immune somehow?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Sometimes it is not about the club, it is whether the player wants to go. I am not suggesting he does at this point but you can never tell, he has no afinity to Liverpool after all. Perhaps the lure of Turin will be greater than sunny Liverpool

Can almost sense the hope ?. Affinity to a club can grow when a player goes to the club - would you say Tim Cahill has an affinity to Everton ? I would say so and no doubt many others have the same - I have no doubt that VVD is growing an affinity to the club and it helps when the club is doing well - 5 years ago I would say that regardless of any affinity players would go but now - where is the next step up for a player ? For the first time in a long time currently I can’t see our best players leaving and in fact can so others wanting to come

 

[pokerjoke]

maybe not, but you havent given one stat, or good insight, just your gut feeling - maybe back the argument up with something?

No because it’s so glaringly obvious
Not a googler so can’t be bothered to look it up.
Perhaps you can get google Phil to do a comparison.
Sorry must of missed your stats

 

[Papas1982]

I think there’s a confusion between competition and ability.
imo the league isn’t s competitive at the top due to the top 2-6 being equally worse. That doesn’t detract from how good Liverpool are.

@Liverbirdie you asked how the teams compare to previous seasons re the also rans. Since Leicester won the league, the 3 remaining teams that finished in the top 4 have averaged approx 80 points, approx 85% of the league winners tally.
This season, if form continues, and it could be argued that city and Leicester are gonna gave worse finishes than the start of the season. The top 3 are on course to average 70 points at less than 70% of Liverpool’s title.

Of course stats can be used to show anything, but I don’t think anyone can really say City are playing as well as previous seasons. Utd and Arsenal just look awful. the quality of the football has imo dropped massivEly. Now none of this makes Liverpool’s football or title win any worse, they’d still have beaten those teams if the were 15% better, but the league whilst more competitive in the fact that points are so close. Isn’t made up of 19 other really good teams.

 

[Papas1982]

Can almost sense the hope ?. Affinity to a club can grow when a player goes to the club - would you say Tim Cahill has an affinity to Everton ? I would say so and no doubt many others have the same - I have no doubt that VVD is growing an affinity to the club and it helps when the club is doing well - 5 years ago I would say that regardless of any affinity players would go but now - where is the next step up for a player ? For the first time in a long time currently I can’t see our best players leaving and in fact can so others wanting to come

Tbf Pete.

Players have left everyone for Madrid, no matter how big their current club. Maybe the success in Europe will help keep him, but having seen his ambition (lack of loyalty) first hand. I’d not be surprised if he hoped to ply his trade in Spain at some point.

 

[clubchamp98]

It may have been a slight leveller if you take the view that big clubs used to get the benefit on more decisions. But in that case Liverpool have been immune somehow?

No we havnt we were fourth in the VAR league.
I think it hasn’t affected us as we have won a lot by more than one goal ,we have had quite a few chalked off
But a game that would have been decided by one goal becomes a draw.
But it was about the rest of the league being weaker, but they are all taking points off each other.

 

[Tashyboy]

My lad was saying something along the lines of “ the way things are going, City will be doing a guard of Honour to Liverpool as Prem league champs when they play at City”.

 

[Slime]

You're incredibly biased in favour of Man City a lot of the time and the occasional throw away comment to the contrary doesn’t negate that.

Of course he's biased, it's his team.
We're all biased towards the team we support, surely.
But some, obviously, more so than most and I wouldn't put Tashy in that bracket.