Please list all the things you do when dealing with comp cards and scores

[tobybarker]

As someone about to be lumped with processing comp cards I'd like a definitive list of what needs doing. Previous incumbents have done it in a slightly haphazard fashion, it seems to me, and I'd like to formalise it some more.

 

[jim8flog]

1st you need to do is to ensure that all the cards are there and then work out which ones are missing (and try to establish the reason the cards are missing at some point).

If the cards have been input on to a computer system prior to your handling them I would only check the top 5 cards in winning order in each division for the correct scores against the computer system.

Check all cards for players and markers signature, check all cards for correct course handicap

Ensure you know what is a reason for a DQ and what is not e.g. no name on the card is not a DQ look at requirement for cards. Rule 3.3b tells you what a player, a marker and the committee must record on the card. What and what is not a DQ can be found in Guidance to the Rules of Handicapping Appendix J.

 

[Old Skier]

Do you insist that players book in via your PSI prior to starting comp, this helps with an easy way of confirming cards have been returned and entered.

We pre print all cards which stops a lot of confusion.

 

[tobybarker]

thanks guys

 

[Colin L]

You could, of course, manage the competition entirely electronically and not use paper cards. Saves a great deal of time.

 

[wjemather]

You could, of course, manage the competition entirely electronically and not use paper cards. Saves a great deal of time.

You make that sound far simpler than it is. Electronic scorecards are not sufficiently reliable, even if everyone were willing/able to use them. Connectivity is almost always a problem, with the committee receiving physical scorecards and inputting scores on the system manually themselves. This is extra work, not time saving at all.

 

[Old Skier]

You could, of course, manage the competition entirely electronically and not use paper cards. Saves a great deal of time.

Interested in this, I can only find references to the requirement to completing score cards in the Rules of Golf and nothing on electronic score cards for competitions.
Any info appreciated.

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Interested in this, I can only find references to the requirement to completing score cards in the Rules of Golf and nothing on electronic score cards for competitions.
Any info appreciated.

Same thing

 

[Lord Tyrion]

You make that sound far simpler than it is. Electronic scorecards are not sufficiently reliable, even if everyone were willing/able to use them. Connectivity is almost always a problem, with the committee receiving physical scorecards and inputting scores on the system manually themselves. This is extra work, not time saving at all.

It worked very well at my club during covid times. No cards were returned, all scores entered via the psi terminal in the club. At the end of the day, push the button, job done.

 

[IanMcC]

1. Ignore the rubbish about electronic scoring only. There is absolutely no trail for checking accuracy of entries if physical scorecards are not used.
2. Use the scorecards to check ALL GROSS SCORES ON ALL CARDS, not just the top 5 or so, have been entered correctly on the electronic system. Many mistakes are made, and the important thing for all golfers is that the score sent to WHS is correct.
3. When you pick up the scorecard, immediately scan for 2 signatures and a Handicap 'number'. The Rules say that correct Course Handicap is required, but, frankly, if you adhere to this, there will be just as many DQs as valid cards. (At least for the first few comps.) If the player has at least one of the HI, CH or PH correct, then I would deem it acceptable. Most people on here will hate this advice, btw.
4. Be prepared for detective work using the start sheet, Handicap Indexes and sign in times to determine who's card is in your hand if it doesn't have a name. It happens more often than you would think, and this fault alone is not a DQ, as stated above.
5. Store all cards for a calendar year. You never know when controversy will strike.

 

[wjemather]

It worked very well at my club during covid times. No cards were returned, all scores entered via the psi terminal in the club. At the end of the day, push the button, job done.

That process does not comply with the rules of golf, even under covid guidance. The R&A's covid clarifications permitted players to mark their own cards and the committee to accept an alternative method of certification, e.g. verbal, which seems to be missing from what your club were doing.

Importantly, PSIs do not meet the requirements of an electronic scorecard.

 

[wjemather]

1. Ignore the rubbish about electronic scoring only. There is absolutely no trail for checking accuracy of entries if physical scorecards are not used.
2. Use the scorecards to check ALL GROSS SCORES ON ALL CARDS, not just the top 5 or so, have been entered correctly on the electronic system. Many mistakes are made, and the important thing for all golfers is that the score sent to WHS is correct.
3. When you pick up the scorecard, immediately scan for 2 signatures and a Handicap 'number'. The Rules say that correct Course Handicap is required, but, frankly, if you adhere to this, there will be just as many DQs as valid cards. (At least for the first few comps.) If the player has at least one of the HI, CH or PH correct, then I would deem it acceptable. Most people on here will hate this advice, btw.
4. Be prepared for detective work using the start sheet, Handicap Indexes and sign in times to determine who's card is in your hand if it doesn't have a name. It happens more often than you would think, and this fault alone is not a DQ, as stated above.
4. Store all cards for a calendar year. You never know when controversy will strike.

Point 3 - it's not a question of hating it; it's simply not in compliance with the rules of golf. Course Handicap is the requirement, and it's best your members learn this before getting DQed in an away comp, and then blaming you.

Point 5 - a few weeks should be more than enough, if such precautions are deemed necessary.

 

[Old Skier]

Point 3 - it's not a question of hating it; it's simply not in compliance with the rules of golf. Course Handicap is the requirement, and it's best your members learn this before getting DQed in an away comp, and then blaming you.

Point 5 - a few weeks should be more than enough, if such precautions are deemed necessary.

Agree with point 3

Point 5 - best to check with your county authority as ours has stated 6 month requirement from them in case of an appeal. This also applies to GP cards however with away GP cards normally done via the EG app I’m not sure they can hold you to that.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

That process does not comply with the rules of golf, even under covid guidance. The R&A's covid clarifications permitted players to mark their own cards and the committee to accept an alternative method of certification, e.g. verbal, which seems to be missing from what your club were doing.

Importantly, PSIs do not meet the requirements of an electronic scorecard.

How was it missing? One person marked a card for the whole group, others could if they wanted to but it never happened. At the end of each round the marker would tell people their scores, they go, okay, thumbs up, whatever, job done. If anyone disagreed with a score then they could go to the manager and explain the disagreement but I'm not aware that ever happened. So, score entered, player agrees with score entered ?‍.

It's back to psi plus card now, it did months ago when cards came back into play, but the system worked effortlessly during that time.

 

[wjemather]

How was it missing? One person marked a card for the whole group, others could if they wanted to but it never happened. At the end of each round the marker would tell people their scores, they go, okay, thumbs up, whatever, job done. If anyone disagreed with a score then they could go to the manager and explain the disagreement but I'm not aware that ever happened. So, score entered, player agrees with score entered ?‍.

For a start, you cannot adequately verify and certify holes scores if only one player has recorded them.

 

[rulefan]

For a start, you cannot adequately verify and certify holes scores if only one player has recorded them.

Even with cards there is only a requirement for one entry to be made on one card.

 

[wjemather]

Even with cards there is only a requirement for one entry to be made on one card.

Not my point.

 

[Colin L]

You make that sound far simpler than it is. Electronic scorecards are not sufficiently reliable, even if everyone were willing/able to use them. Connectivity is almost always a problem, with the committee receiving physical scorecards and inputting scores on the system manually themselves. This is extra work, not time saving at all.

It worked fine for us over last season.

 

[Colin L]

Interested in this, I can only find references to the requirement to completing score cards in the Rules of Golf and nothing on electronic score cards for competitions.
Any info appreciated.

Interpretation 3.3b(2)/1
... The Committee may require players to use a scorecard other than a paper scorecard (such as an electronic form of scorecard)......

 

[rulefan]

It worked fine for us over last season.

And is still working for us now.