New Kitchen Advice

[Aztecs27]

Just a thought, with the rapid advances in air fryers, do you need a double oven?
We have a double air fryer and a double oven. We use the main oven a lot less, plus of course, lower electricity bills.

Good point, but it still requires the same size cabinet if we’re having it at eye/waste height and the second oven would be one with built in microwave so we don’t have to take up worktop space with one (or have to find wall space to integrate one).

 

[Aztecs27]

Are you joking,we’re all sat waiting for the next update

Don't joke....



This is was the status as of last night. Breezeblocks and brickwork being started today and should be built up to DPC by tomorrow evening all being well.

For those who care about what we're actually having done....the ridiculous and pointless flat roof structure that's there now will obviously be coming down and where that meets the main house will be the inside side wall of the kitchen which then leads through to a hallway (old kitchen) to access the utility.

It's not the most conventional layout, but what is the current dining room (adjacent to the hallway) will become an extra living area, which is absolutely crucial with two young kids (and dogs!)



The rear window will actually be closer to the patio doors (the total area for which will be smaller than it is now, as it's massive and we want utilise more wall space for the kitchen.

We're struggling with the wall that backs onto the utility (in red above), as it isn't isn't huge, so trying to fit everything we want there (as we want a corner pantry to fit everything in), to give us as much space as possible along the back for worktop space is proving tricky.

Feel free to share your opinions (right or wrong ), it's quite cathartic to be able to share the progress.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Having not so long ago gone through exactly what you are going through - we are in a semi so some similar considerations to yourself I think.

Good idea to build a little lobby to your back door..we haven't (yet) done that but have the scope to add one in time. But doing so when we were doing our build would have caused issues with our neighbors as we would do it onto the boundary between us and our neighbors - but they have a lean-to built onto the shared/party garden wall (was put up decades ago when the proviso owner of our place wouldn't have been bothered as she had one also). We would have had to have their lean-to knocked down and we would have had to pay for a new one - yes - quite...never mind the cost. Also see you've created a little internal hall space to give a complete separation between outside and in through the backdoor and new lobby...like that.

I note also that you aren't building onto your neighbors (extensions I assume) - and have left a little gap. Could be a fiddle to keep clear if you are that bothered about doing that - but saves a lot of debate about responsibilities if anything untoward happens and potential future party wall agreement hassle. How did you manage on the foundations front with your new wall being so very close to your neighbour's?

I like that you have kept the two living rooms separate...many would be tempted to knock them together whilst build work and disruption is ongoing - and that you haven't joined your dining room into your new space but can open and close doors as suits. When our children were younger we too kept our kitchen and front room rooms separate for same reason (and awe would have had to swap kitchen and dining room to do it) - if someone wants to knock them together in the future when we sell up then that's something they can do.

BTW - whether you considered it or not - you've saved a bucketload of money not knocking out the back wall of your downstairs to open it all up...doing that cost us an absolute packet.

We've done it now as it suits us as a couple with kids flown the next.

Good luck with the build - and hopefully what you end up with exceeds your vision and expectations - what we have done has most certainly exceeded ours and has been transformational to how we view and use our downstairs.

 

[Aztecs27]

Having not so long ago gone through exactly what you are going through - we are in a semi so some similar considerations to yourself I think.

Good idea to build a little lobby to your back door..we haven't (yet) done that but have the scope to add one in time. But doing so when we were doing our build would have caused issues with our neighbors as we would do it onto the boundary between us and our neighbors - but they have a lean-to built onto the shared/party garden wall (was put up decades ago when the proviso owner of our place wouldn't have been bothered as she had one also). We would have had to have their lean-to knocked down and we would have had to pay for a new one - yes - quite...never mind the cost. Also see you've created a little internal hall space to give a complete separation between outside and in through the backdoor and new lobby...like that.

I note also that you aren't building onto your neighbors (extensions I assume) - and have left a little gap. Could be a fiddle to keep clear if you are that bothered about doing that - but saves a lot of debate about responsibilities if anything untoward happens and potential future party wall agreement hassle. How did you manage on the foundations front with your new wall being so very close to your neighbour's?

I like that you have kept the two living rooms separate...many would be tempted to knock them together whilst build work and disruption is ongoing - and that you haven't joined your dining room into your new space but can open and close doors as suits. When our children were younger we too kept our kitchen and front room rooms separate for same reason (and awe would have had to swap kitchen and dining room to do it) - if someone wants to knock them together in the future when we sell up then that's something they can do.

BTW - whether you considered it or not - you've saved a bucketload of money not knocking out the back wall of your downstairs to open it all up...doing that cost us an absolute packet.

We've done it now as it suits us as a couple with kids flown the next.

Good luck with the build - and hopefully what you end up with exceeds your vision and expectations - what we have done has most certainly exceeded ours and has been transformational to how we view and use our downstairs.

Thanks for this. just to address a few of the questions;

- yes we've left a small gap - it will essentially be covered over with flashing that's cut into the neighbours wall (which they're ok with as they're top bananas). As you say, prevented massive issues (and expense with party wall nonsense. So as such it cost us £550 for a party wall surveyor to do a consultation at house and identifying all of the potential issue areas, take pictures and draw up the party wall agreement (instead of a few thousand)

- In terms of the foundations, it helped that the previous owner of our house was a pain and demanded our neighbours dig footings of 2m rather than a standard 1m - so when they dug them out, there was no issues whatsoever (fortunately!)



The party wall consultant, as a precaution recommended digging in two parts as you cn see above, fortunately, it's all gone according to plan (so far!)

with regards to removing the wall at the back - this is precisely why we kept it haha. a fully open plan would have been great - but this is a perfect compromise and the "hallway" (that runs from the front of the house to the kitchen) should provide great space for some cabinets for storage and will be the place where the dogs sleep too.

The internal door from the dining area into the "new" living area may or may not be put in - we're undecided yet. I like the idea of being able to close it off, but also don't want to make it cramped etc. either way, the horrendous doors you see above will be gone and that's the main thing!

 

[cliveb]

Something else to consider, is that we are at the junction point in cosmetic looks where the older stainless steel look is being phased out for the new black/charcoal and textured finish instead. This is not just brand specific but industry wide.

Just a quick question about this. When you say the fashion now is for a "textured finish", are you saying that ovens these days don't have smooth surfaces?
If that's the case, I hate to think the effect that will have on ease of cleaning.

 

[Golfmmad]

Just a quick question about this. When you say the fashion now is for a "textured finish", are you saying that ovens these days don't have smooth surfaces?
If that's the case, I hate to think the effect that will have on ease of cleaning.

I think he was talking about the sink.

 

[Bazz]

Don't joke....

View attachment 57413

This is was the status as of last night. Breezeblocks and brickwork being started today and should be built up to DPC by tomorrow evening all being well.

For those who care about what we're actually having done....the ridiculous and pointless flat roof structure that's there now will obviously be coming down and where that meets the main house will be the inside side wall of the kitchen which then leads through to a hallway (old kitchen) to access the utility.

It's not the most conventional layout, but what is the current dining room (adjacent to the hallway) will become an extra living area, which is absolutely crucial with two young kids (and dogs!)
View attachment 57415


The rear window will actually be closer to the patio doors (the total area for which will be smaller than it is now, as it's massive and we want utilise more wall space for the kitchen.

We're struggling with the wall that backs onto the utility (in red above), as it isn't isn't huge, so trying to fit everything we want there (as we want a corner pantry to fit everything in), to give us as much space as possible along the back for worktop space is proving tricky.

Feel free to share your opinions (right or wrong ), it's quite cathartic to be able to share the progress.

Looks good, every house we look at now has this sort of kitchen diner layout, as you say it's ideal for family living.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Just a quick question about this. When you say the fashion now is for a "textured finish", are you saying that ovens these days don't have smooth surfaces?
If that's the case, I hate to think the effect that will have on ease of cleaning.

I think he was talking about the sink.

No, I wasn't talking about the sink. I was talking about the fascia's and surrounds of ovens primarily, which up till recently were stainless steel. Now they are putting a dark and textured finish on what was stainless steel. So now trims, panels and edging can be a dark painted perhaps lightly ribbed finish. Each brand has their own way of doing it, but it is most definately the way ovens especially are going.
My reservation on it is that it will show scratches and marks a lot more as a result.

 

[cliveb]

No, I wasn't talking about the sink. I was talking about the fascia's and surrounds of ovens primarily, which up till recently were stainless steel. Now they are putting a dark and textured finish on what was stainless steel. So now trims, panels and edging can be a dark painted perhaps lightly ribbed finish. Each brand has their own way of doing it, but it is most definately the way ovens especially are going.
My reservation on it is that it will show scratches and marks a lot more as a result.

That, and be more difficult to clean. Surely the obvious finish would be glass, like on an induction hob. That's a breeze to clean.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

That, and be more difficult to clean. Surely the obvious finish would be glass, like on an induction hob. That's a breeze to clean.

Yes, but edge trims, handles, door edges etc arent always glass...

 

[Aztecs27]

@Bunkermagnet - cheers for the heads up on the ovens. I looked at some Siemans ones today, and the iQ700 oven and compact oven that can be had for £2250 all in is a lot more appealing than paying nearly £4k for two Neff N90's.

Yes it doesn't have the slide and hide doors, but I'll live if I'm saving £1500+ haha

 

[Bunkermagnet]

@Bunkermagnet - cheers for the heads up on the ovens. I looked at some Siemans ones today, and the iQ700 oven and compact oven that can be had for £2250 all in is a lot more appealing than paying nearly £4k for two Neff N90's.

Yes it doesn't have the slide and hide doors, but I'll live if I'm saving £1500+ haha

Slide and hide is really for galley kitchens or old ladies.

 

[rudebhoy]

@Bunkermagnet - cheers for the heads up on the ovens. I looked at some Siemans ones today, and the iQ700 oven and compact oven that can be had for £2250 all in is a lot more appealing than paying nearly £4k for two Neff N90's.

Yes it doesn't have the slide and hide doors, but I'll live if I'm saving £1500+ haha

We are looking at NEFF ovens for our new kitchen, my understanding is that the hide and slide door is only on their single ovens, not the doubles?

 

[Bunkermagnet]

We are looking at NEFF ovens for our new kitchen, my understanding is that the hide and slide door is only on their single ovens, not the doubles?

Correct. Double ovens are not the seller they were, so many companies are reducing or even stopping production of them. They may well stay around, but the choices will be very limited.

 

[D-S]

Correct. Double ovens are not the seller they were, so many companies are reducing or even stopping production of them. They may well stay around, but the choices will be very limited.

I would assume the popularity of double draw air fryers does away with a lot of the need for a second oven and increases flexibility.

 

[Aztecs27]

We are looking at NEFF ovens for our new kitchen, my understanding is that the hide and slide door is only on their single ovens, not the doubles?

Correct. We are buying 2 ovens. A normal size one and a compact eith microwave function

 

[Bunkermagnet]

I would assume the popularity of double draw air fryers does away with a lot of the need for a second oven and increases flexibility.

Its more that now people have a single oven and a combination oven microwave as well

 

[Fade and Die]

@Bunkermagnet - cheers for the heads up on the ovens. I looked at some Siemans ones today, and the iQ700 oven and compact oven that can be had for £2250 all in is a lot more appealing than paying nearly £4k for two Neff N90's.

Yes it doesn't have the slide and hide doors, but I'll live if I'm saving £1500+ haha

Slip a warning drawer under the combination oven and we could be kitchen buddies

 

[Golfmmad]

I would assume the popularity of double draw air fryers does away with a lot of the need for a second oven and increases flexibility.

See post 418

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Its more that now people have a single oven and a combination oven microwave as well

This is what we have had installed. NEFF pair of ovens.

I was unsure about the combi oven microwave as had read some -ve stuff about how well they work as microwave without a turntable but truth is any issues that there might be we find to be insignificant. Also we went for ‘slide and hide’ door to main oven. Not essential but nice to have for easier access - especially when needing access to do a bit of cleaning of the oven.