New bunker rule for qualifiers

[rulefan]

It is entirely up to the club. But I think it inadvisable to have two Local Rules in force, so I would have the 6" rule for all play.

Further to my comments earlier.
If bunkers are not in a absolutely disastrous condition, clubs should simply adopt the Preferred Lies (6") rule or Play it as it Lies for a ball in a bunker.

If one or more bunkers are a disaster area then I would suggest the the affected bunker(s) are designated as GUR and marked individually with a GUR (or GUR/NPZ) sign.
A player cannot have 3 options. ie Play as it Lies, PL or GUR.
It is either PaiL or PL
or PaiL or GUR.

 

[rulie]

Further to my comments earlier.
If bunkers are not in a absolutely disastrous condition, clubs should simply adopt the Preferred Lies (6") rule or Play it as it Lies for a ball in a bunker.

If one or more bunkers are a disaster area then I would suggest the the affected bunker(s) are designated as GUR and marked individually with a GUR (or GUR/NPZ) sign.
A player cannot have 3 options. ie Play as it Lies, PL or GUR.
It is either PaiL or PL
or PaiL or GUR.

When the PGA Tour uses preferred lies (LCP) and a player hits his ball into an area on the fairway marked as GUR, are you saying that he cannot use LCP within the area of GUR and then choose not to play from the GUR but to take relief from the GUR and again use LCP? Where does it say that in the Guide?

 

[rulefan]

Where does it say that in the Guide?

The CONGU guide says: (NB My underlining)

Bunkers: If clubs introduce a Local Rule to allow preferred lies in bunkers, scores will be acceptable for competition or supplementary score purposes. (Using Model Local Rule E-3)

Please note: The distance for preferred lies in the bunker is limited to 6 inches and the area cannot be smoothed before placing.

As an alternative (but not combined with the preferred lies detailed above) if the condition of bunkers is so poor that it interferes with the proper playing of the game, a club Committee may declare all bunkers to be Ground Under Repair, scores will be acceptable for competition or supplementary score purposes.

I admit my suggestion re declaring an individual bunker being GUR could be a stretch of the wording, given the use of 'all bunkers'.

So probably a strict interpretation is that
all bunkers may be declared GUR or
LCP may be used in all bunkers.
But it has to be one or the other.

 

[rulie]

I was asking about the Official Guide to the Rules of Golf, not the CONGU guide to handicapping.

 

[rulefan]

I was asking about the Official Guide to the Rules of Golf, not the CONGU guide to handicapping.

I understood the thread was about CONGU qualifying competitions in the Covid19 situation.

 

[jim8flog]

When the PGA Tour uses preferred lies (LCP) and a player hits his ball into an area on the fairway marked as GUR, are you saying that he cannot use LCP within the area of GUR and then choose not to play from the GUR but to take relief from the GUR and again use LCP? Where does it say that in the Guide?

When a Tour player gets in to that situation they call for a referee to advise them what to do

 

[rulie]

When a Tour player gets in to that situation they call for a referee to advise them what to do

And I'm trying to clarify what that advice would be under the Rules of golf.

 

[rulefan]

It seems to be regionally or country based but this might help

https://www.randa.org/en/theranda/initiatives/golf-during-covid-19

 

[rulie]

It seems to be regionally or country based but this might help

https://www.randa.org/en/theranda/initiatives/golf-during-covid-19

Here was the question: When the PGA Tour uses preferred lies (LCP) and a player hits his ball into an area on the fairway marked as GUR, are you saying that he cannot use LCP within the area of GUR and then choose not to play from the GUR but to take relief from the GUR and again use LCP? Where does it say that in the Guide on the Rules of golf?

 

[mikejohnchapman]

We received the enclosed which is copied in part:

The attached document ‘Competition Protocols Under Covid-19 Restrictions’ outlines the new procedures which must be followed for competition play. Please READ THE DOCUMENT carefully and in full as not doing so could lead to disqualification from a competition.

NEW LOCAL RULE

From Friday 5th June 2020 a new temporary local rule concerning preferred lies in bunkers comes into effect as follows:

"When a player's ball lies in a bunker, the player may take free relief once by marking the ball’s original position and then placing the ball back in the bunker within 6 inches of its original position, not nearer the hole. The ball may be cleaned before being placed."

ThiS specifies Competition play.

Do you feel relief will be available in roll ups/ none competitions?

We originally went with the one club length for social golf but as qualifiers came into view we changed it to 6" for all.

 

[rulefan]

Here was the question: When the PGA Tour uses preferred lies (LCP) and a player hits his ball into an area on the fairway marked as GUR, are you saying that he cannot use LCP within the area of GUR and then choose not to play from the GUR but to take relief from the GUR and again use LCP?

No.

Where does it say that in the Guide on the Rules of golf?

It doesn't

But how is the above relevant to this thread which is titled 'New bunker rule for qualifiers' ?

 

[jim8flog]

Here was the question: When the PGA Tour uses preferred lies (LCP) and a player hits his ball into an area on the fairway marked as GUR, are you saying that he cannot use LCP within the area of GUR and then choose not to play from the GUR but to take relief from the GUR and again use LCP? Where does it say that in the Guide on the Rules of golf?

I think your answer can be in part found in the interpretations

16.1c/2 – After Lifting Ball Player May Change Relief Options Before Putting a Ball in Play
If a player lifts his or her ball to take relief under Rule 16.1c, he or she is not committed to the intended relief option under Rule 16.1c until the original ball is put in play or another ball is substituted under that option.

For example, a player elects to take relief from temporary water in a bunker and lifts the ball with the intention of taking free relief in the bunker (Rule 16.1c(1)). The player then realizes that where the Rule requires the ball to be dropped in the bunker will result in a very difficult shot.

After lifting the ball, but prior to putting a ball in play, the player may choose either of the two options of the Rule despite the original intention to take relief under Rule 16.1c(1).

 

[rulie]

I think your answer can be in part found in the interpretations

16.1c/2 – After Lifting Ball Player May Change Relief Options Before Putting a Ball in Play
If a player lifts his or her ball to take relief under Rule 16.1c, he or she is not committed to the intended relief option under Rule 16.1c until the original ball is put in play or another ball is substituted under that option.

For example, a player elects to take relief from temporary water in a bunker and lifts the ball with the intention of taking free relief in the bunker (Rule 16.1c(1)). The player then realizes that where the Rule requires the ball to be dropped in the bunker will result in a very difficult shot.

After lifting the ball, but prior to putting a ball in play, the player may choose either of the two options of the Rule despite the original intention to take relief under Rule 16.1c(1).

Rulefan has provided the answer(s). The actions that I described in the question are not prohibited under the Rules of golf (as I already suspected, but wanted to make that point clear for others).