Koeman to Arsenal?
- Thread starter sawtooth
- Start date
Troublemaker!
Wouldn't expect anything less from him, starts something then runs for cover :smirk:
Tongo
Journeyman Pro
Yeah, I'm finding the chat about Everton amusing. Another club who thinks they are bigger than they really are. Times have changed, clubs have been overtaken in the pecking order.
Blue in Munich
Crocked Professional Yeti Impersonator
Troublemaker!
In fairness to LB, I think you'll find that was me……………
Still, having been suitably chastened by the great and the good of the forum, I went away and had a word with myself and found this in the process;
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/why-people-kicking-chelsea-over-eden-1555651
Sums the whole incident up far more succinctly than I ever could, and confirms I won't be changing my opinion about Charlie Morgan anytime soon.
In fairness to LB, I think you'll find that was me……………
Still, having been suitably chastened by the great and the good of the forum, I went away and had a word with myself and found this in the process;
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/why-people-kicking-chelsea-over-eden-1555651
Sums the whole incident up far more succinctly than I ever could, and confirms I won't be changing my opinion about Charlie Morgan anytime soon.
Yeah but we live in a leftie, tree hugging, claim society, nansy pansy country now where the facts of the matter, or the over egging of minor facts like calling him a child, are in this case, a nonsense.
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
What defines the status of a club? As the only team we've been compared to on this thread is Soton and compared to them we're massive, 2 good seasons under Koeman and one FA Cup win some time back doesn't compare with Evertons history,
Compare anything you like!
No Everton fan has claimed to be a big Club, but are on the fringes of 4-6 over recent years, last 2 seasons have been shocking, currently I'd put us as no better than top 10.
Are Leicester now a big Club because they've won 1 league title in their history? Or are Chelsea now a mid table team after 1 bad season?
Tongo
Journeyman Pro
What is massive? Attendance? Cos Sunderland had 47000 in at the weekend and Newcastle regularly attract bigger crowds than Saints.
So what about history? Forest won the league and two European Cups compared to Saints FA Cup. And then there's Villa. What difference does that make to the here and now? Nothing.
At this moment in time Saints and Everton are on the same level, regardless of anything else.
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Oh oh, history. Must be a Liverpool thing
persoanlly, with the money that's flooding the premier league. I think that things could change. And that it will be a case of the top 4/5 theN the rest. Leicester whilst having a good bit of pr, realistically aren't gonna see their status change too much in one season imo. Players destined for saints, West Ham, Everton etc may now go there. But the big clubs will still be ahead of them.
For me I'd say Everton and saints are equally as appealing to players. Both can be sold differently, yes we had a spell away from the league. But since our return have been on an upward curve and are showing a consistent attempt at European football. Everton for their good seasons aiming at top 5-6 have had plenty of blips too. I'd hazard a guess that since the pl started you've averaged no better than 10th. You had plenty of seasons fighting relegation with us in the early 90's. So a player in his 20's now, isn't gonna care to much about your history, much like they wouldn't about Leeds, forest or villas.
For me, it just doesn't make sense to go to you. Stay with us another year and as long as we finish mid table or above with good football, it'll not harm his rep. Go to you and he'd need to get cl footy to enhance it.
This is a whole new thread/topic, your noisy neighbours will obviously go on about history, even though their creating very little lately and so that is becoming diluted over time, on that basis, is Nottingham Forest STILL a big club, if not, over what time does a previous big club (any) lose that standing, if at all?
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
You're the one finding talk about Everton amusing, can't you tell us what defined massive or big.
Maybe we shoukd contact the FA and get Blackburn back in the PL.
History is the foundations a Club is built on, we may continue to decline and get relegated in the next few seasons, I'm not the one laughing at other Clubs,
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
So in reverse, how long does a club need to have continued success to be included, one or two good or bad seasons doesn't define a Club.
If we're talking about who is a big club and who is equal to who, I'd equate Everton with Villa. Villa are a prime example of a top half club that has been badly managed... oh, that sounds similar to Everton too. For me, Everton have a choice to make. Carry on as is, and risk a Villa-esq demise, or wake up to the fact they have some good players and a lousy manager. There's no reason, apart from Martinez, why Everton can't be compared with Soton
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
Oh oh, history. Must be a Liverpool thing
persoanlly, with the money that's flooding the premier league. I think that things could change. And that it will be a case of the top 4/5 theN the rest. Leicester whilst having a good bit of pr, realistically aren't gonna see their status change too much in one season imo. Players destined for saints, West Ham, Everton etc may now go there. But the big clubs will still be ahead of them.
For me I'd say Everton and saints are equally as appealing to players. Both can be sold differently, yes we had a spell away from the league. But since our return have been on an upward curve and are showing a consistent attempt at European football. Everton for their good seasons aiming at top 5-6 have had plenty of blips too. I'd hazard a guess that since the pl started you've averaged no better than 10th. You had plenty of seasons fighting relegation with us in the early 90's. So a player in his 20's now, isn't gonna care to much about your history, much like they wouldn't about Leeds, forest or villas.
For me, it just doesn't make sense to go to you. Stay with us another year and as long as we finish mid table or above with good football, it'll not harm his rep. Go to you and he'd need to get cl footy to enhance it.
As of today with 2 games to go we sit in 6th overall since it's inception, only 7 Clubs have played every season (Villa were one of them)
If we are comparing recent times then absolutely Soton are performing better and are currently a better team, but as previously discussed the difficulty is defining what is a big club, Arsenal get a lot of stick for constantly finishing 4th, I would be over the moon for Everton to do that, success is only relevant to each Club, Martinez may lose his job, but this season we've reached 2 Cup Semi finals and could finish top ten, if we win our last 2 games, (Sunderland and Norwich) possible and Chelsea lose there last 2 (Liverpool and Leicester) possible, we would finish above them, does that make us a bigger club? no, not in a million, a few seasons does not define a Club.
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
if Boro next season reach 2 Cup semi-finals and finish top ten, will you consider yourselves badly managed?
Where do you get the average sixth from? Is that from total points accumulated? Obviously being a mainstay will help that. But could that not be countered by the fact that as of next season, 6 teams will have been mainstay. And your bottom of that pile?
i mean average finishing position. From what I can see since it started, your average finish is 11th. Ours is probably 16.5.....
my point being that whilst I accept you have a greater pedigree from before my lifetime. When a player or manager is considering a move. One big signing Lukaku (who would happily leave), you've done little more than us and would simply a sideways move as you said. And I can't see Koeman going for that.
So you're happy with Martinez, and what he's achieved with your team? Seems to me you've spent most of the season saying he needs to go. Are you now saying you were way off the mark and want to keep him?
As for the Boro, if they avoid relegation I'll be happy. They don't score enough goals, and against Prem defences they'll score even less. Equally, against Prem attacks they'll concede more.
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
6th is overall points total, 10th points per games
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/All-TimePremierLeagueTable1992-93to2010-11.html
I'm not interested in Koeman and actually see it more of a slight on you's if he graciously gives you one more season before moving to Arsenal, I'd say thanks but no thanks, why should anyone else show loyalty at the Club if he's not.
I was more reacting to Everton being laughed at.
I don't think he's doing us a slight. He has a contract. If he honours that and leaves. No problem imo. Much better than Pinocchio hawking himself at any club showing a remote interest whilst with us.
I dont think Everton are laughable at all. I think they struggled being one of the last old school clubs owned by a fan. If you could get a modern stadium you could easily take Spurs place as I'd consider you a bigger club than them. But in modern times when cash is king. I fear you could easily fall back to mid table. Which is where your points have you. I think all the extra billions is gonna mean that unless you're part of the top 4, players will simply sign for who pays the best.
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
No mate, Martinez has took us backwards imo, and that's my pointy success in the PL is all relative to the Club, I like to think I'm quite honest and neutral when it comes to football and when Martinez took over Moyes had us reasonably comfortable in top 6-8 over recent years, Martinez got us 5th with appoints total that would've guaranteed CL football every other PL Season to date and enough for runners-up a few times, last 2 seasons everyone has gone on about our squad and potential to go to the next level and challenge 4-6 and we've gone backwards.
Lots of clubs are improving and it's becoming hard but I still expect with the players and set up to be 8th at minimum and challenging above.
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Deleted member 16999
Guest
We had the issue with Moyes, everyone knew he was replacing Ferguson but he denied it and said he would have talks at the end of his contract, players whose contracts were due were then asking for the same deal and it unsettled the squad.
Players wouldn't commit as they didn't know if the manager was staying or not, what if Koeman spends millions on players who the next manager doesn't rate?
