Itv leaders debate.

[c1973]

I reckon the flip side of UKIPs 'homophobic,racist,bigoted,prejudiced' comments could (for some) be a counterbalance to all the other parties insistence that 'all women only' lists are used for selecting MPs.

Discrimination is wrong, but it cuts both ways and I don't see any outrage over the creep of 'positive' discrimination. For me, there's no difference, discrimination is discrimination no matter how you dress it up.


One thing they have done is bring a subject, that many in power find uncomfortable (or indeed, impossible) to deal with subjectively to the table. It's obviously an issue for many people, whether we like it or not, and as a result it should be on the agenda.

Why is it many parties appear to be doing all they can to avoid the issue, yet UKIP (rightly or wrongly, dependant on your view) are being demonised for (in their own way) proposing solutions?

Just a thought.

 

[User20205]

I am not a UKIP spokesman so have no need to speak for them. You are however free to check out their view yourself.

My own views are personal and I have no wish to discuss them with you. Why do you ask?

You alluded to them earlier. I know you're not a spokesman for ukip, but a self confessed follower.

I'm just looking for clarification. It's a bit of a cop out if you make it clear that you agree with their most populist policies but duck the issue on the less palatable.

Generally I don't understand what possible objection anyone could have about two people that love each other marrying.

 

[SocketRocket]

Not sure what you mean. I've merely seen the racist, sexist and homophobic quotes attributed to UKIP candidates and officials and decided that I could never vote for them. Anyone who does is, at best, turning a blind eye to these. That seems a matter of fact rather than any prejudice on my part.

It is your opinion and it would be best to acknowledge that rather than discredit those with a contrary viewpoint. I guess you do accept they are entitled to their view and are entitled to vote as they see fit.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Rather a childish comment Sir. I will have different views to you but I will not try to discredit yours by insults.

Right, so you've never called me a yoghurt knitter then? Don't play the moral high ground card/easily offended of middle England , it was said in half jest and half as a play on the fact /opinion that immigration is all kippers go on about.

Also if you find that insulting then I'd suggest you avoid the Internet as there is a lot worse out there than some flippant comment about kippers.

 

[SocketRocket]

You alluded to them earlier. I know you're not a spokesman for ukip, but a self confessed follower.

I'm just looking for clarification. It's a bit of a cop out if you make it clear that you agree with their most populist policies but duck the issue on the less palatable.

Generally I don't understand what possible objection anyone could have about two people that love each other marrying.

I have never voted UKIP and am still undecided who I will vote for this time. I dont believe UKIP have a policy on Gay Marriage. If you read my previous comments I suggested that there were a large number of voters who were unhappy with the way it was put into law by the Tories and along with other issues these people will turn their votes away from Labour and Conservative and to UKIP. I was also explaining that IMO this is more of an issue that is driving us towards a Hung Parliament than the SNPs.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I think that last nights debate and the following QT shows that we are beginning to see the end of the UK two party system.

On QT Gove was savaged by the audience and the other four panel members for his crass anti SNP rant.
He looked absolutely amazed that they all ganged up on him and did not share his 'populist' view.
I never thought I would see that in England and it made me a little more hopeful for the future of the UK.

 

[FairwayDodger]

It is your opinion and it would be best to acknowledge that rather than discredit those with a contrary viewpoint. I guess you do accept they are entitled to their view and are entitled to vote as they see fit.

The racist, sexist and homophobic quotes from UKIP candidates and officials are a matter of fact. Anyone voting for UKIP either has not heard these quotes (seems unlikely), shares them or is prepared to turn a blind eye to them. Unless you can suggest a fourth option?

 

[c1973]

The racist, sexist and homophobic quotes from UKIP candidates and officials are a matter of fact. Anyone voting for UKIP either has not heard these quotes (seems unlikely), shares them or is prepared to turn a blind eye to them. Unless you can suggest a fourth option?

And anyone voting for Conservative, Labour, Lib Dems, SNP etc is prepared to turn a blind eye to corruption, theft and abuse of a public office.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

The racist, sexist and homophobic quotes from UKIP candidates and officials are a matter of fact. Anyone voting for UKIP either has not heard these quotes (seems unlikely), shares them or is prepared to turn a blind eye to them. Unless you can suggest a fourth option?

4th opinion is.........They don't have a [UKIP] sense of humour.

IT WAS JUST A JOKE........Honest.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

And anyone voting for Conservative, Labour, Lib Dems, SNP etc is prepared to turn a blind eye to corruption, theft and abuse of a public office.

Hence why i will vote for no one

 

[Pin-seeker]

Hence why i will vote for no one

Same here,that's why I don't moan about politics.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

It has started.
Next step.......North British domination then..........then the UK, Europe and finally the World.:lol:

http://wingsoverscotland.com/new-friends/

 

[Adi2Dassler]

 

[Adi2Dassler]

 

[Hacker Khan]

I reckon the flip side of UKIPs 'homophobic,racist,bigoted,prejudiced' comments could (for some) be a counterbalance to all the other parties insistence that 'all women only' lists are used for selecting MPs.

Discrimination is wrong, but it cuts both ways and I don't see any outrage over the creep of 'positive' discrimination. For me, there's no difference, discrimination is discrimination no matter how you dress it up.


One thing they have done is bring a subject, that many in power find uncomfortable (or indeed, impossible) to deal with subjectively to the table. It's obviously an issue for many people, whether we like it or not, and as a result it should be on the agenda.

Why is it many parties appear to be doing all they can to avoid the issue, yet UKIP (rightly or wrongly, dependant on your view) are being demonised for (in their own way) proposing solutions?

Just a thought.

But all parties have policies on immigration. It's just they also have other issues instead of being a one issue party and ukip's immigration policy is the most extreme/racist/sensible to ensure the future of the UK, depending on your point of view.

And as for positive discrimination then I am sure FairwayDodger made a superb defence of it in previous times. I agree that discrimination is discrimination, but one can be a force for good needed to ensure all get a fair chance and one can be a force for evil with the sole purpose of excluding minorities, or worse . And saying they are both the same is very simplistic and ignoring the current and historical context.

 

[Hacker Khan]

You alluded to them earlier. I know you're not a spokesman for ukip, but a self confessed follower.

I'm just looking for clarification. It's a bit of a cop out if you make it clear that you agree with their most populist policies but duck the issue on the less palatable.

Generally I don't understand what possible objection anyone could have about two people that love each other marrying.

I can clear that one up. As it is a change in society that happened since 1978 UKIP will be opposed to it. They have much the same policy on iPhones, coffee shops in the high street and the X Factor. Against the lot of them. Common sense.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

View attachment 14757

That is so funny on so many levels.

Progressive Alliance getting bandied about a lot today........sounds good to me for a UK umbrella party.

 

[c1973]

Hence why i will vote for no one

And one of the reasons why none of them will be getting my vote. :thup:



A fair bit of hypocrisy in politics concerning the portrayal of UKIP imvho though. Also a fair bit of hypocrisy coming from them as well mind you.

 

[Hobbit]

And as for positive discrimination then I am sure FairwayDodger made a superb defence of it in previous times. I agree that discrimination is discrimination, but one can be a force for good needed to ensure all get a fair chance and one can be a force for evil with the sole purpose of excluding minorities, or worse . And saying they are both the same is very simplistic and ignoring the current and historical context.

Totally disagree! If I went for a job, and was the best person/most suited etc and I didn't get the job based on positive discrimination I would be right royally pee'd off. There is no fairness in positive discrimination - two wrongs don't make a right. All positive discrimination achieves is to build resentment, and potentially create racism in someone who wasn't previously racist.

By all means beef up the discrimination laws, especially the punishments, and forcibly enforce them.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Totally disagree! If I went for a job, and was the best person/most suited etc and I didn't get the job based on positive discrimination I would be right royally pee'd off. There is no fairness in positive discrimination - two wrongs don't make a right. All positive discrimination achieves is to build resentment, and potentially create racism in someone who wasn't previously racist.

By all means beef up the discrimination laws, especially the punishments, and forcibly enforce them.

Or it could help to change attitudes in society to those that have suffered centuries of prejudice.

I think the situation where sometime gets to interview stage and is clearly the best person for the job but doesn't get it is a bit of a red herring as on the very rare situation when applications are invited from certain areas of society, that happens when they are deciding who is being interviewed.