Incorrect Online Score Entry

[jpjeffery]

We use online entry for our Monthly Medals (plus a few other comps when there's no carbon-based unit available to fulfil the scorer duties), for which we ask that the marker enters the player's score via the MasterScoreboard webpage after agreeing the scores with the player after completing the 18th.

Usually this goes well.

Over the weekend one of our players (we'll call him Max) submitted a score of gross 90 net 77, which for him is not a score that would flag up any interest for me to check the online scorecard (the only cards I actually looked at were two NRs, just to make sure they'd submitted the scores for the holes they'd actually completed).

After I published the results Max announced to our club WhatsApp group that his score was wrong...by an additional EIGHT shots! (i.e. his score was gross 82 net 69)...and sent images of his scorecard

I asked him who entered his score, to which he said that he did it himself.

The first 12 holes were correct, but then he entered...

• a 2 instead of a 5
• 16 instead of 4 (that's not a typo on my part!)
• 4 instead of 6
• 3 instead of 4
• 5 instead of 3

...and the last was correct.

So overall the score he entered was higher than he played, but was made up of three holes that were lower than he played, plus two that were higher than he played.

Fortunately his net 69 still wasn't enough to win, so no harm done there, and we'd prefer his card to be accurate in order for his WHS HI to not be skewed the wrong way by the incorrect score.

But, what's the rulebook ruling here?

 

[rulefan]

We use online entry for our Monthly Medals (plus a few other comps when there's no carbon-based unit available to fulfil the scorer duties), for which we ask that the marker enters the player's score via the MasterScoreboard webpage after agreeing the scores with the player after completing the 18th.

Usually this goes well.

Over the weekend one of our players (we'll call him Max) submitted a score of gross 90 net 77, which for him is not a score that would flag up any interest for me to check the online scorecard (the only cards I actually looked at were two NRs, just to make sure they'd submitted the scores for the holes they'd actually completed).

After I published the results Max announced to our club WhatsApp group that his score was wrong...by an additional EIGHT shots! (i.e. his score was gross 82 net 69)...and sent images of his scorecard

I asked him who entered his score, to which he said that he did it himself.

The first 12 holes were correct, but then he entered...

• a 2 instead of a 5
• 16 instead of 4 (that's not a typo on my part!)
• 4 instead of 6
• 3 instead of 4
• 5 instead of 3

...and the last was correct.

So overall the score he entered was higher than he played, but was made up of three holes that were lower than he played, plus two that were higher than he played.

Fortunately his net 69 still wasn't enough to win, so no harm done there, and we'd prefer his card to be accurate in order for his WHS HI to not be skewed the wrong way by the incorrect score.

But, what's the rulebook ruling here?

What do your competition conditions say about entering scores? When is the score deemed to be 'returned'?

 

[jpjeffery]

What do your competition conditions say about entering scores? When is the score deemed to be 'returned'?

Well, that's a good question actually. I'm not sure we've published anything specifically about that, at least not that covers online entry.

But my question was really about RandA rules.

 

[Jules]

Unless you have a Code of Conduct Policy that specifically states that a penalty will be applied, the score entry into the computer is only an aid to the committee. The definitive score is that submitted on the scorecard. You should just correct the score to agree with the submitted card, and refresh the competition result.
3.3b(2)/1 – Players Are Required to Enter Only Scores on a Scorecard
There is a difference between requiring players to enter a score for a round into a computer (such as for handicapping purposes) and being required to enter hole scores using an electronic form of scorecard approved by the Committee (such as a mobile scoring application).
The Committee may require players to use a scorecard other than a paper scorecard (such as an electronic form of scorecard), but the Committee has no authority to impose a penalty under Rule 3.3b(2) for failing to enter scores elsewhere.
However, to help in administrative matters (such as the efficient production and communication of competition results), a Committee may apply a penalty under a Code of Conduct (Rule 1.2b) or provide disciplinary sanctions (such as revoking entry into the next competition) for failing to enter scores elsewhere.

 

[Colin L]

Well, that's a good question actually. I'm not sure we've published anything specifically about that, at least not that covers online entry.

But my question was really about RandA rules.

Rulefan's question was about R&A Rules. There needs to be a defined "cut-off" moment when a score is considered to be "returned". This is the formal moment of return after which it isn't possible for the player to correct any mistakes. There also needs to be a clear statement as to which is the definitive scorecard the electronic one or the physical one. I get the impression the physical card is not actually handed in and so the electronic one would seem to be formal one. If that is the case and the time for correcting has passed, your man is disqualified for having returned a score at a hole lower than he actually took. [Rule 3.3b(3)]

 

[Swango1980]

Well, that's a good question actually. I'm not sure we've published anything specifically about that, at least not that covers online entry.

But my question was really about RandA rules.

I believe that is why rulefan asked you the question. How can the competition committee be definitive as to when a score is officially returned, and the players playing in the competition understand that requirement?

Although I suspect you might consider the scorecard returned(?) I'd be nervous if I had to rely on another player to enter my score for me, and risk DQ for their mistake. I appreciate that, on this occasion, the player made the mistake so that is not particularly an issue. It was just when you initially stated that you request the Marker enters the score.

 

[jpjeffery]

Unless you have a Code of Conduct Policy that specifically states that a penalty will be applied, the score entry into the computer is only an aid to the committee. The definitive score is that submitted on the scorecard. You should just correct the score to agree with the submitted card, and refresh the competition result.
3.3b(2)/1 – Players Are Required to Enter Only Scores on a Scorecard
There is a difference between requiring players to enter a score for a round into a computer (such as for handicapping purposes) and being required to enter hole scores using an electronic form of scorecard approved by the Committee (such as a mobile scoring application).
The Committee may require players to use a scorecard other than a paper scorecard (such as an electronic form of scorecard), but the Committee has no authority to impose a penalty under Rule 3.3b(2) for failing to enter scores elsewhere.
However, to help in administrative matters (such as the efficient production and communication of competition results), a Committee may apply a penalty under a Code of Conduct (Rule 1.2b) or provide disciplinary sanctions (such as revoking entry into the next competition) for failing to enter scores elsewhere.

Thanks, Jules

I'm strongly inclined to agree.

Much like players only being required to submit accurate gross hole-by-hole scores, leaving the net/stableford calculation to the committee (in reality to the software used by the committee) on the rounds that playing a round of golf is an exercise in playing a round of golf, not an exercise in arithmetic. By which I mean we shouldn't also be judging players based on their competence on using an electronic input screen.

 

[Jules]

Rulefan's question was about R&A Rules. There needs to be a defined "cut-off" moment when a score is considered to be "returned". This is the formal moment of return after which it isn't possible for the player to correct any mistakes. There also needs to be a clear statement as to which is the definitive scorecard the electronic one or the physical one. I get the impression the physical card is not actually handed in and so the electronic one would seem to be formal one. If that is the case and the time for correcting has passed, your man is disqualified for having returned a score at a hole lower than he actually took. [Rule 3.3b(3)]

R&A is very clear about the validity of entering the score into a computer. 5a: Setting the rules of the competition states: the Committee may request that players assist the Committee by entering their scores into a computer system at the end of the round, but a player should not be penalized under the Rules of Golf if he or she fails to comply with this request or makes a mistake in doing so.

 

[jpjeffery]

Rulefan's question was about R&A Rules. There needs to be a defined "cut-off" moment when a score is considered to be "returned". This is the formal moment of return after which it isn't possible for the player to correct any mistakes.

I believe that is why rulefan asked you the question. How can the competition committee be definitive as to when a score is officially returned, and the players playing in the competition understand that requirement?

Ah, I see, thanks both (and Rulefan).

It's a(nother) good point and one we should work on clarifying.

 

[Colin L]

These definitions should be in your Terms of the Competition.

 

[Colin L]

R&A is very clear about the validity of entering the score into a computer. 5a: Setting the rules of the competition states: the Committee may request that players assist the Committee by entering their scores into a computer system at the end of the round, but a player should not be penalized under the Rules of Golf if he or she fails to comply with this request or makes a mistake in doing so.

The reverse is permitted. If the Committee makes computer or app entry the required form of score returns, it cannot penalise under the Rule of Golf for failing to return a physical card. See Interpretation 3.3b(2)/1
https://www.randa.org/rog/interpretations/rule-3