how many strokes is it?

[vkurup]

At the stroke play last week, on a P4 one of the PPs pulled his drive left. We foraged for his ball and found it against the wall and under the hollies. He had no place to stand, so declared it unplayable, he dropped it one club length away from the hole but it was still unplayable and so dropped another club length. From there he got near the green, 3 putts and he was in..

Drive, 1 or 2 penalty?, 1 to greenside, 3 putts ..

 

[Deleted member 15717]

I make it 7 shots...but why didn't he take 2 club lengths for his unplayable on the first attempt?

 

[Region3]

2 penalty shots. His choice to only drop 1 club length, and provided the first drop meets the criteria for a good drop the ball is then in play.

 

[vkurup]

We put it down as 7.. so all is good..

However how do you count the first relief being unplayable? On his first drop , the ball was in in ankle high roubgh but he would have had to stoop under an overhanging branch. If the ball was found there, he might have had to play as it lies. But we agreed that it was unplayable and he dropped another club length from there ..

 

[Deleted member 15717]

It's all down to the player. They can declare any lie unplayable and take a penalty. All he is doing in this case is dropping again under penalty. No dramas.

 

[chrisd]

I think you'll find he was allowed a 2 club length drop and the ball could roll a further club length. Also he could have gone back to where he last played from or taken a stroke and distance drop if it were feasible. So, had he known that his drop was 2 club lengths he would probably have saved one shot

 

[Kellfire]

Yea, I always try to remember the general rule that a penalty is two club lengths and a free drop is one.

Are there exceptions though?

 

[pbrown7582]

We put it down as 7.. so all is good..

However how do you count the first relief being unplayable? On his first drop , the ball was in in ankle high roubgh but he would have had to stoop under an overhanging branch. If the ball was found there, he might have had to play as it lies. But we agreed that it was unplayable and he dropped another club length from there ..

It's an extra penalty as he didn't use the full relief allowable. Once the ball is dropped it's back in play. If he had of dropped in the position of the 2nd drop the 7 would of been 6.

Good general rule of thumb as noted is penalty drop 2 club lengths free drop 1. There are a few cases where this is not completely correct but a good guide.

 

[vkurup]

I think you'll find he was allowed a 2 club length drop and the ball could roll a further club length. Also he could have gone back to where he last played from or taken a stroke and distance drop if it were feasible. So, had he known that his drop was 2 club lengths he would probably have saved one shot

It's an extra penalty as he didn't use the full relief allowable. Once the ball is dropped it's back in play. If he had of dropped in the position of the 2nd drop the 7 would of been 6.

Good general rule of thumb as noted is penalty drop 2 club lengths free drop 1. There are a few cases where this is not completely correct but a good guide.

A bit lost now.. Let me run these options again.

He could have re-teed up. He did hit a provisional down the fairway. If he continued to play that instead of trying to find the ball... he would be 3 off the tee, 2nd shot on green, + 3 putts = 7.

We found the first ball wedged against a fence & in the rough... 1st drop also in rough, another relief taken and then on the green. So Tee + 1 drop + 2nd drop + approach + 3 putt = 7

Alternatively, he could Tee + 1 drop + try and hit it & assume it gets it on the green + 3 putt = 6??

Is this correct... something does not feel right on the 6 count. Could he have done a Tee + 1 drop + 2nd drop + approach + 2 putt = 6???

This month's GM rule section talks taking relief from immovable objects but it slightly different when the immovable object is part of the course as in this case where the fence is the boundary wall that defines the OOB for the course.

 

[pbrown7582]

where he went wrong was only taking 1 club relief for the first drop he was entitled to 2 under penalty which was in effect the same place as he dropped for the 2nd time so therefore he could of saved one of the penalty shots by knowing his full range of options under an unplayable lie.

 

[vkurup]

where he went wrong was only taking 1 club relief for the first drop he was entitled to 2 under penalty which was in effect the same place as he dropped for the 2nd time so therefore he could of saved one of the penalty shots by knowing his full range of options under an unplayable lie.

Are we saying... Tee + 1st drop in a 2 club radius + approach + 3 putt = 6??

How does he mark the first club length? Just put a tee rather than 'drop a ball'

 

[drew83]

just wondering what is "1 club"....I play +1 inch clubs, & my driver is obviously longer than my PW for example....is there a "rule" on which club you use? Does everyone use say a 7 iron? that way roughly all about equal?

 

[bobmac]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZG_TjTINXY

 

[louise_a]

Use the longest club you have, you don't have to use the club you are going to play the shot with.

If the ball was up against a fence was there a local rule that free relief was allowed?

 

[drew83]

cheers Louise

 

[vkurup]

Use the longest club you have, you don't have to use the club you are going to play the shot with.

If the ball was up against a fence was there a local rule that free relief was allowed?

yeah, he used the driver which we all agreed was correct.

Just had a look in the 2015 Diary and the strokesaver, no local rules listed. I am sure the scorecard has one but I cant find a scorecard. As the fence is a boundary fence, i suspect you may not be eligible for a free drop, but I could be wrong.

In case of free drop, would that be 1 club length or 2??

 

[pbrown7582]

Generally free drop is 1 club length

 

[pbrown7582]

Are we saying... Tee + 1st drop in a 2 club radius + approach + 3 putt = 6??

How does he mark the first club length? Just put a tee rather than 'drop a ball'

Yes exactly.

Measure 2 club lengths and mark extent of drop allowable, Mark the Ball.
Take the drop in marked area.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Honestly - you'd think that by now we'd all know that you can declare a ball unplayable at any time - even slap bang in the middle of the fairway or indeed in the middle of the green (as someone mentioned elsewhere).

So @vkrup's PP would never have had to play the ball under the bush

 

[Kellfire]

Also, you don't need to mark the area of the drop. It just helps to do so if you are challenged.