Golf committees are killing golf clubs....

[hovis]

I remember a survey saying that memberships were dropping. However, the same survey said people didn't necessarily want membership, but wanted to play golf.

So, no amount of "attractive, new shiny, all bells and whistles options" are likely to speak to that group. If that group is large, then clubs are at an impasse, surely.

Attract new blood, yes, by only if the new blood want to be attracted. Which they may not. If that's the case, members will feel aggrieved at all sorts of offers being offered to people who have no intention of joining, and packing out the course.

At the belfry we have tons of junior and intermediate members. from the " young uns" I've spoken to this is down to our place having a very relaxed dress code, freedom to play off any tee you like, jeans, trainers and phones anywhere you like, no "mr captains " and a very relaxed environment.

Weather this is right or wrong is erelevant. But if I was in charge of the nearest members club I'd be looking closely at my current situation and wonder why the belfry are full with members and i cant afford sand for the bunkers

 

[Bratty]

I realise that I haven't answered Fish's question though!

We have just put something in place that means the committee will now comprise of Men's (also club) Captain, Lady Captain, Vice Captain, representative from Vet's section, previous Men's Captain, Men's team organiser, 3 x comps/handicap secretaries, two of whom must be elected each year and one will serve two years to ensure consistency. There must be a gap of two years between sitting on the committee and re-election for all places.

This is designed to give an elements of consistency and also new views.

I feel that the number leaving due to committee decisions is far less than the number leaving due to financial or time constraints, or moving house, or something else. However, it would be very interesting to see a national poll of those who left.

 

[User20205]

Comparing the Belfry to Beau Desert isn't really a fair comparison.

The percentage of elderly members isn't unusual, however I do agree that clubs should work harder to keep the younger members they do have.

Over the long term you may find members returned from the belfry when they realised it also has specific drawbacks.

 

[Bratty]

At the belfry we have tons of junior and intermediate members. from the " young uns" I've spoken to this is down to our place having a very relaxed dress code, freedom to play off any tee you like, jeans, trainers and phones anywhere you like, no "mr captains " and a very relaxed environment.

Weather this is right or wrong is erelevant. But if I was in charge of the nearest members club I'd be looking closely at my current situation and wonder why the belfry are full with members and i cant afford sand for the bunkers

Some members clubs are like the Belfry, some are like mine, and some are still very much old school.

It's their choice to be that way, and if that's what the members or clubs want, then so be it.

Who am I to question their decision, unless I'm a member of said club?

 

[FairwayDodger]

No matter how good the committee they are not going to get every decision "correct" and are never going to please everyone all the time anyway. Generally, though, these are sincere people giving up their time for the benefit of the club, doing their best and getting plenty of grief and little thanks for their efforts.

My thanks to committee members everywhere!

 

[Liverbirdie]

Surely he means council and not committees?

Unless different terminology is used from club to club, I thought that the committees run sections such as handicap/comps, social, greens, house etc

Council is the overarching body that runs everything.

 

[Hobbit]

I'm not sure committee's are killing golf clubs. If they were they'd be disappearing hand over fist. And if they were massively out of step there'd be EGM's and votes of no confidence etc going on all over the place. Unpopular decisons invariably lead to disgruntlement, but these can be overturned at AGM's... not heard a lot of that going on either.

With regard to the young businessman and his idea. Its pretty much a direct copy of 2-for-1 vouchers in the eyes of a club, i.e. they're selling tee times at half price. I dare say that most clubs who were in need of bringing in visitors have already tried the 2-for-1 option. For some it works, and is still in operation, and for others it proved too much hassle and has been dropped.

He's trying to set something up that is in competition with something that is already established. As to the article, its just plain lazy journalism with only one side of the story.

 

[GB72]

Not sure that committees are killing clubs but in alot of instances they are steadfastly maintaining the status quo. That will suit some clubs and not others and it will suit some members and not others. In my admittedly limited experience the incumbants or friends of the incumbent are voted in and this does not give a diversity of opinion. As such decisions are made on thr basis of the wants of a certain demographic. This is not limited to lack of age representation but also sex. Women still do not have their own comps at weekends at my place despite that detering working women from joining. Jeans may now be allowed in our clubhouse and the main dissent is that the committee members voting against them dont wear them. There is a large degree of protectionism and as long as that suits the club and the membership that is fine. What it will not do is attract different ages, sexes or social or other demographics. It will not expand the game but as I have said before I really think that golf at grass roots level has no interest in growing the game and is happy how it is.

 

[Blue in Munich]

The kid's spot on; I mean why wouldn't a club sign up to the opportunity to share it's green fee money with the creator of this scheme when they could just sell it to the customers direct and keep it all? Obviously a huge committee error there.

At my club, the committee that is apparently killing the club has to make a decision as to the number where we start a waiting list; despite committing the other cardinal sin that golf club committees make by continuing to charge a £2,000 joining fee they are attracting increasing numbers of members. By God they're doing a dreadful job…….

 

[jp15g08]

I think the resistance to his company is that Its a rather simply idea of selling vouchers for a reduced green fee...so simply that the club could easily do it themselves without having to split the profits. You could easily do a loyalty card scheme where you play 5 rounds get the sixth free, they by encouraging people to return and hopefully they join as a member by the end.Also he's spent most of his £ 2500 on petrol and a website....best be a flash website!

 

[Foxholer]

Beau desert has big problems. The're end of year accounts show that 60% of its members are 55 and over, 27% are 30 to 54, and 10% are 18 to 29 and 3% junior's. 71% of people leaving are in the Junior to 54 range.

This is why clubs are closing. Imo too many people with unwillingness to let go of the old and move with the times and attract some young blood

I'd suggest that those figures would be pretty much the same as they were 5 years ago or will be 5 years in the future!

And while the division seems slightly skewed towards higher aged members, I don't believe Beau Desert has a problem at all!

 

[Fish]

Also he's spent most of his £ 2500 on petrol and a website....best be a flash website!

and impossible to find!!

I've Googled The Golf Bundle and nothing, other than some start up pages for something in Minnesota

Googled his name and the company name and hey presto, you get a Linkedin page with no link to a website but some basic details of him

https://uk.linkedin.com/pub/tom-bowen/9b/997/625

A Twitter page again with no link to a super state of the art website and almost zero mention of his "business" throughout his tweets, the only mention being in his profile Looking at his Tweets & Replies section some clubs have/are now questioning him :smirk:

https://twitter.com/bowenboy22

Nothing showing from a basic company check, which I would expect with a yearling limited company but again. no website link!

http://companycheck.co.uk/director/918966892/TOM--BOWEN/director-summary

I found a YouTube video of him sky diving which isn't worth linking but nothing else

So, in conclusion, he a so-called "pioneering" business student and now director of his own company who has tinkered in the last year creating some social media platforms to sell an idea but there is nowhere to be seen on any of these said platforms a link to his website which the "bulk" of a £2500 grant was spent towards But, looking through his tweets, he's been abroad & looked to buy a new car, I wish I could have done that in my 1st year when I started my first business

I think he needs to go back to business school and rethink his career because all he's done so far IMO, is spunk £2500

I, like some above also think its lazy journalism, his views and opinions do not represent a lot of the hard working committees up and down the country who offer their time and services for free.

The bottom line here is, its nothing new, its basic and not unique. A lot of clubs now offer a flexible membership for the more adhock golfer that still wants to be a member and use credits if they play more than the issue of initial credits, this voucher scheme is more directed at nomads and is selling price only, as in, cheap golf tee times.

 

[Slab]

Fish, agree with your post above, doesn't really seem like there's an operational business and would expect any committee to do the same checks you've done and bin any support they may have verbally indicated for the scheme

I realise that I haven't answered Fish's question though!

We have just put something in place that means the committee will now comprise of Men's (also club) Captain, Lady Captain, Vice Captain, representative from Vet's section, previous Men's Captain, Men's team organiser, 3 x comps/handicap secretaries, two of whom must be elected each year and one will serve two years to ensure consistency. There must be a gap of two years between sitting on the committee and re-election for all places.

This is designed to give an elements of consistency and also new views.

I feel that the number leaving due to committee decisions is far less than the number leaving due to financial or time constraints, or moving house, or something else. However, it would be very interesting to see a national poll of those who left.

Wanted to ask folks what lengths does your committee go to in attempting to retain those who plan to leave the club? (regardless of the reason)

Is it a function of a club committee?
If it is, should they attempt retention?
What form should/does this retention effort take?



edit to add: personally I've left three club memberships and a range membership, not one word ever expressed about any of them, whether that was in thanks for time served or attempt to see what the problem was, any solution that might be available or any attempt to get me to return in the future

 

[hovis]

I don't believe Beau Desert has a problem at all!

They have serious problems. The're specialised mower to cut the heather and heath has broken and can't afford a new one so they're trying to fix it without success and they have no money to sand all the bunkers.

I interestingly enough the ''committee" voted against allowing a two day event to be held at the club because it would pretty much close it to members. Admirable but at a huge financial loss

 

[needmoreclub]

No matter how good the committee they are not going to get every decision "correct" and are never going to please everyone all the time anyway. Generally, though, these are sincere people giving up their time for the benefit of the club, doing their best and getting plenty of grief and little thanks for their efforts.

My thanks to committee members everywhere!

Thanks for that FD, nice to know some folk appreciate the work we do and time we put in.

 

[Bratty]

Wanted to ask folks what lengths does your committee go to in attempting to retain those who plan to leave the club? (regardless of the reason)

Is it a function of a club committee?
If it is, should they attempt retention?
What form should/does this retention effort take?

edit to add: personally I've left three club memberships and a range membership, not one word ever expressed about any of them, whether that was in thanks for time served or attempt to see what the problem was, any solution that might be available or any attempt to get me to return in the future

I don't see it as a function of our committee, as we are a proprietary club. The management should be doing everything in their power to with out why people are leaving.

Exit interviews, letters of thanks, etc. would work nicely. I'll raise this at next committee meeting.

Why did you leave, by the way? Was it at any time due to the committee?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I have certainly learned this year that being on the committee someone will always complain about any decision or choice that is made - at our place it's always the same people and mainly ex captains or presidents but you will never please everyone

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Our committee is certainly trying to move the club with the times. We are in the middle of a trial period for weekend tee booking (between 7:30am and 11:30am - members bookings only). Boy has it caused upset - and if the members sanction continuing with it when we are polled/surveyed on it end August then I'm guessing a fair few members might leave for a club that doesn't operate such a system.

But that will be a members decision, not a committee one.

Meanwhile - a fair number of complaints about it heading committee way from a few - the rest of us either for it or wait and see. As usual the vocal minority etc.

Whether or not we continue with it for members tee bookings as being trialled, I'm thinking we'll probably keep it in place for booking tee-times for visitors at quieter times. Even that is not 100% popular - but not unreasonable and financially pragmatic.

 

[Slab]

I don't see it as a function of our committee, as we are a proprietary club. The management should be doing everything in their power to with out why people are leaving.

Exit interviews, letters of thanks, etc. would work nicely. I'll raise this at next committee meeting.

Why did you leave, by the way? Was it at any time due to the committee?

No I don’t think I could directly blame any of the committees for the reason for leaving

First club was just that and my membership was a birthday pressie that I couldn’t afford the following year
Another club just got too difficult for me to play with long rough/tougher set up so I wasn’t enjoying losing a couple of sleeves a round and scoring so poorly
Last one I was moving abroad so not much they could’ve done about it even if they asked

The range just let standards drop way too much in all areas to see it as a reasonable return on my annual investment

So whether they could have done anything or not for a lot of places its seems no small effort/cost to get you to join so why not at least find out why folks are leaving, maybe there's something to be done maybe not

 

[North Mimms]

Plenty of club members are quite happy to moan about their committee.
Only a tiny fraction are willing to step up and offfer to serve on said committee.

It's a thankless unpaid job