England debate

[Doon frae Troon]

Bugger off and take the Tennants Extra with you but leave some of the Scotch behind. Seriously though 300 years of having a chip on your shoulder is tiresome!! Using that alone to determine a vote and chance your future on is just mad which and is what the average person will be doing and they will do it just to p*ss the Tories off in Westminster and that's what Salmon wants. Ill give it a year and they will be climbing the wire trying to get out and begging for a hand out on numerous levels....Toll booths in place, draw bridge up and minefield all the Northern Territories. Vote yes you can have it but get on with it and dont bloody whine on about it afterwards when it all goes t*ts up under that plonker!!!

Salmon is going to get something out of this.... a job... but that's its, no one else will benefit, South of the border and definitely not the people who matter in Scotland. I cant understand why people cant see it....hope, change, a new life??? Really come on its not a bloody fantasy adventure film its about bunch of greedy politicians dealing a hand for themselves... No one wins here apart from Politicians. Scotland cant have a total independent country without us supporting them and we will suffer big time without Scotland, its an economic fact. I wish them luck they are going to need it. I think they will get the independence but it wont really be independence but they can pretend for a while. :thup:

I don't see how the politicians will benefit as many will be out of a job.
Scotland has yet to decide on a second chamber but I would imagine it will not be a second house of lords.
rUK will basically be an England and Wales assembly with a much reduced house of lords.

 

[Fyldewhite]

I would wish them well and given the prospect of England and Wales turning into an ever more right wing xenophobic, anti-European, divided society without a decent left wing opposition, I would in all probability move there.

 

[GB72]

I will be honest and say that I have paid very little attention to the whole independence debate. I have no say in it, no vote and so pretty much took the view that what will be, will be and we all live with the consequences.

The debate, however, has pretty much become unavoidable over the last week and I am frankly embarrassed about what it has become. The whole idea of independence appears to have become lost in a sea of political points scoring. A vote for independence is a kick in the teeth for the Tories etc. Not sure exactly what the hell that has to do with it. The Government in situ has to defend the union whoever happens to be in power. This is a matter of such importance that I had hoped that the debate could remain more reasoned and give the people an honest set of opinions without resorting to nationalism and political name calling but that seems to be far too much to ask. I am pretty glad that I have avoided it for this long.

What I hope is that the people of Scotland get what they want and what they need and that the rest of the union does all it can to support any necessary transition. I would really hate to see any bitterness or points scoring continue after the vote and it would be particularly disappointing for the Westminster government to try and make things difficult to cause a string of 'I told you so' headlines. If it ends in independence then that should be a cause for celebration as should Scotland remaining part of the union.

 

[Liverbirdie]

I would wish them well and given the prospect of England and Wales turning into an ever more right wing xenophobic, anti-European, divided society without a decent left wing opposition, I would in all probability move there.

Fancy car-sharing?

 

[FairwayDodger]

I will be honest and say that I have paid very little attention to the whole independence debate. I have no say in it, no vote and so pretty much took the view that what will be, will be and we all live with the consequences.

The debate, however, has pretty much become unavoidable over the last week and I am frankly embarrassed about what it has become. The whole idea of independence appears to have become lost in a sea of political points scoring. A vote for independence is a kick in the teeth for the Tories etc. Not sure exactly what the hell that has to do with it. The Government in situ has to defend the union whoever happens to be in power. This is a matter of such importance that I had hoped that the debate could remain more reasoned and give the people an honest set of opinions without resorting to nationalism and political name calling but that seems to be far too much to ask. I am pretty glad that I have avoided it for this long.
.

Pretty much hitting the nail on the head..... shame you've not paid attention until now, there's another thread on this that might have benefited from this wisdom.

 

[AmandaJR]

I will be honest and say that I have paid very little attention to the whole independence debate. I have no say in it, no vote and so pretty much took the view that what will be, will be and we all live with the consequences.

The debate, however, has pretty much become unavoidable over the last week and I am frankly embarrassed about what it has become. The whole idea of independence appears to have become lost in a sea of political points scoring. A vote for independence is a kick in the teeth for the Tories etc. Not sure exactly what the hell that has to do with it. The Government in situ has to defend the union whoever happens to be in power. This is a matter of such importance that I had hoped that the debate could remain more reasoned and give the people an honest set of opinions without resorting to nationalism and political name calling but that seems to be far too much to ask. I am pretty glad that I have avoided it for this long.

What I hope is that the people of Scotland get what they want and what they need and that the rest of the union does all it can to support any necessary transition. I would really hate to see any bitterness or points scoring continue after the vote and it would be particularly disappointing for the Westminster government to try and make things difficult to cause a string of 'I told you so' headlines. If it ends in independence then that should be a cause for celebration as should Scotland remaining part of the union.

Well said and pretty much where I've been with it all. Now it is becoming very real and the yes vote suddenly possible I'm more interested BUT don't want a reluctant member of the United Kingdom as that's no unity. I don't know enough about it to debate the pros and cons but as an Englishwoman through and through but half Scot (go figure!) I like things just the way they are.

PS I do occasionally feel affronted at the desire to not be in the United Kingdom and resort to a childish "sod you then and you aint sharing our pound"...

 

[One Planer]

I will be honest and say that I have paid very little attention to the whole independence debate. I have no say in it, no vote and so pretty much took the view that what will be, will be and we all live with the consequences.

The debate, however, has pretty much become unavoidable over the last week and I am frankly embarrassed about what it has become. The whole idea of independence appears to have become lost in a sea of political points scoring. A vote for independence is a kick in the teeth for the Tories etc. Not sure exactly what the hell that has to do with it. The Government in situ has to defend the union whoever happens to be in power. This is a matter of such importance that I had hoped that the debate could remain more reasoned and give the people an honest set of opinions without resorting to nationalism and political name calling but that seems to be far too much to ask. I am pretty glad that I have avoided it for this long.

What I hope is that the people of Scotland get what they want and what they need and that the rest of the union does all it can to support any necessary transition. I would really hate to see any bitterness or points scoring continue after the vote and it would be particularly disappointing for the Westminster government to try and make things difficult to cause a string of 'I told you so' headlines. If it ends in independence then that should be a cause for celebration as should Scotland remaining part of the union.

On the whole, I agree Greg.

Re: The bit on bold.

The people, as a whole, won't get what they want. Latest polls are neck and neck so there are bound to be some disappointed YES/NO voters either way.

How Scotlands divided people deal with that division post vote is the main question for me at the minute.

Would they be entitled to leave Scotland and reside within the remains of the Union?

Would they have to stay in the new iScotland?

How would a new iScotland finance stack up should the current NO voters decide to leave post YES?

I don't think anyone has the answers. Anyone claiming to is either deluded or has a knack for distorting the truth.

 

[FairwayDodger]

BTW, don't forget that even if (heaven forbid) there is a yes vote a very large proportion of us don't want independence at all but will be stuck with it.

 

[Crazyface]

I hope they vote YES. Then we can, with immediate effect, clear the Scottish members of Parliament out and move closer to having our own ENGLISH government.

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

 

[One Planer]

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

Would you want to be the Prime Minister who presided over the end of the Union?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I hope they vote YES. Then we can, with immediate effect, clear the Scottish members of Parliament out and move closer to having our own ENGLISH government.

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

I think your question has been covered on the Scotland debate thread quite well.

Trouble is it is the minority Scots who are doing the telling so you may not have noticed.

 

[Val]

I hope they vote YES. Then we can, with immediate effect, clear the Scottish members of Parliament out and move closer to having our own ENGLISH government.

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

You'll still have another 2 countries to get rid of first you ignoramus

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Not fussed. Total apathy about the whole thing. No reason to treat anybody differently, not just the Scots. Do unto others and all that

 

[Dodger]

I hope they vote YES. Then we can, with immediate effect, clear the Scottish members of Parliament out and move closer to having our own ENGLISH government.

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

The contents of this post is why plenty will chose YES.

Heard the bald BBC bloke tonight telling everyone that Alex is rubbing his hands as he sees what's happened today with the visit means another step in the right direction for votes for 'Him'.

Bald bloke may I remind you we are not voting for 'Him' as you put it but carry on with your dreadfully lazy journalism.

 

[JustOne]

I cant understand why people cant see it....hope, change, a new life??? Really come on its not a bloody fantasy adventure film its about bunch of greedy politicians dealing a hand for themselves... No one wins here apart from Politicians.

I think it's just the people with the biggest chip on their shoulder blowing the most smoke, a very small percentage who have an opportunity to vent their frustrations to an audience that was never there before.

Anyone would think that the streets were going to be paved with gold and everyone would just be given free money! They must be falling for the spin-doctors trickery.

#mugs

 

[USER1999]

I'm not fussed either way. What bothers me is the cost of the whole thing. I have a sneaking suspicion that there will be loads of over paid fat cats setting up quangos to decide how the assets are split, which will drag on for years, costing the tax payer an absolute mint. I can't see how it's not going to be hideously expensive, at the cost of the uk tax payer.

Why should I have to pay for Scottish independence? If they vote for it, they should pick up the tab.

 

[chrisd]

Cameron must be desperate for Scotland to stay to be faffing about like he is....but why in Gods name....why? No one ever tells you why.

Because it would probably end his career as PM, being the Prime Minister presiding over the Scots leaving the Union - really not good on his CV!

 

[Hacker Khan]

I kind of think it will be decided on the economic issues in the end, as most things are. To me it's clear that the main political parties, the money markets and quite a few businesses are worried about the financial consequences of splitting up. So, rightly or wrongly, I expect that to end up swaying the argument.