Divisions for comps?

[apj0524]

For Monthly Medals, we have 3 fixed divisions: 10 and lower, 11 to 18, and 19 and higher. Generally there is a fairly equal number of entries in each division.

For all other comps, divisions and division boundaries are flexible dependent on entries; i.e. they can (and do) move up/down a stroke to balance the number of players in each division. For a 2 division comp (over 30 entrants) the boundaries will typically be as follows: 15 and lower, and 16 and higher; and a 3 division comp (between 30 and 60-70 entrants) will typically have the following boundaries: 12 and lower, 13 to 19, and 20 and higher.

All division splits are by Playing Handicap - saves having to answer the question "why are two players with the same handicap in different divisions" every week.

The purpose is to give more players the opportunity to win prizes and also to spread the prize money around. Each division pays top 3 unless there are over 45 players in a division, in which case top 4 get paid.

Do you make it clear what the Divisions are going to be before the start of the competition, EG are saying the must be clearly stated before the competition, see below from their guidance " Defining Handicap Limits in Competitions "?

These divisions could be adjusted to reflect the demographic of the individual Club. The course handicap could be used as the limit for the divisions if the Committee chooses; but this must be clearly stated before play. The course handicap approach would not be recommended if any competitors were entering from outside the club; as it would require some effort for players to determine their eligibility prior to entry/arrival

 

[apj0524]

Unusual as the recommendation from EG was for comps to be based on HI (to avoid confusion) as most county/opens etc are based on HI.

England Golf - Defining Handicap Limits in Competitions also says

These divisions could be adjusted to reflect the demographic of the individual Club. The course handicap could be used as the limit for the divisions if the Committee chooses; but this must be clearly stated before play

 

[apj0524]

For Monthly Medals and Stablefords we have 4 Divisions, traditionally this has been:

Plus ~ 12 / 13 ~ 18 / 19 ~ 28 / 28 Plus

But this has meant that the prize money for Div 1 and Div is not much because of the Demographic of the clubs handicaps so having looked at the statistics I will be balancing out the Divisions better this year

 

[Old Skier]

England Golf - Defining Handicap Limits in Competitions also says

These divisions could be adjusted to reflect the demographic of the individual Club. The course handicap could be used as the limit for the divisions if the Committee chooses; but this must be clearly stated before play

There's that old word "could".

 

[benjo09]

Up to 14 is Div 1 at ours and anything above is Div 2. They have also introduced a single gross prize for all comps for the best gross score as we have a lot of lower handicap players who wouldn't have a chance in the handicap comps.

 

[doublebogey7]

No divisions at our place.

 

[wjemather]

Do you make it clear what the Divisions are going to be before the start of the competition, EG are saying the must be clearly stated before the competition, see below from their guidance " Defining Handicap Limits in Competitions "?

These divisions could be adjusted to reflect the demographic of the individual Club. The course handicap could be used as the limit for the divisions if the Committee chooses; but this must be clearly stated before play. The course handicap approach would not be recommended if any competitors were entering from outside the club; as it would require some effort for players to determine their eligibility prior to entry/arrival

Our terms of competition are very clear on how divisions are set for each competition.
In my view, the guidance is trying to cover too many things at once (entry limits, trophy limits, divisions and division limits), but my reading of this statement is only that it must be made clear that it is Course Handicap that is being used (as opposed to Handicap Index) before play.

 

[IanMcC]

We have 2 divisions. Playing Handicap 14 and below, and Playing Handicap 15 and above. There are about 10-15% fewer players in the higher handicap division on average, so it is a little easier for them to win or place, but that is offset by the best gross prize, which always goes to a top division player.
My members moan about almost everything, but I have never heard a complaint about the divisional set up.

 

[patricks148]

I think we have 3 and there is always a scratch prize too. No idea what the cut off are for each division is though

 

[Slab]

Our divisions (when used) are Men and Women. But usually only used for club champs weekend, other than that there's no divisions
Some of the Opens have handicap divisions but these vary from one event to the next

 

[Backsticks]

Categories should be a thing anyway. Give prizes to the top 10 if you want to give more prizes. Category wins, other the the best one, are not really wins at all. It's handicapped golf, and everyone is playing the same system. There is only one real winner, one real second, etc.
They come from a historical misconception that high handicappers win more, and low handicappers can't compete with them, and so need their egos massaged by "winning" from amongst other low handicappers.

 

[wjemather]

Categories should be a thing anyway. Give prizes to the top 10 if you want to give more prizes. Category wins, other the the best one, are not really wins at all. It's handicapped golf, and everyone is playing the same system. There is only one real winner, one real second, etc.
They come from a historical misconception that high handicappers win more, and low handicappers can't compete with them, and so need their egos massaged by "winning" from amongst other low handicappers.

While handicap systems aim to provide everyone with an equitable chance of competing, they function best in matchplay and small field competitions.

As field size increases, the likelihood of a nett score being returned that is simply unattainable for a scratch golfer increases, and such an occurrence becomes probable in large fields. For an extreme example, take 100 scratch golfers and 100 bogey golfers in normal conditions; there is an extremely low probability that any scratch golfer will return 8 under CR, but there is a very high probability that at least one of the bogey golfers will.

No handicap system can reasonably account for this while maintaining equity, and so divisions have long been recommended as the best means of mitigation.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

My old club

Categories should be a thing anyway. Give prizes to the top 10 if you want to give more prizes. Category wins, other the the best one, are not really wins at all. It's handicapped golf, and everyone is playing the same system. There is only one real winner, one real second, etc.
They come from a historical misconception that high handicappers win more, and low handicappers can't compete with them, and so need their egos massaged by "winning" from amongst other low handicappers.

I know you are trolling but this is hilarious. It’s the high handicaps that need an ego massage. If you want fair competition, do away with handicaps and let the best player win.

The only real winner is whoever shoots the lowest gross. Handicaps just create an illusion for people who are bad at golf to believe they are able to compete with people who are better than them.

 

[Orikoru]

At my old club it was either two divisions (split at 18) or three divisions where the first one was up to 14, then it was 15 to.. I dunno, 22 or 24 or something, then the third one higher than that.

I'm not sure if my current club has divisions.. I've never noticed actually. Ok, just checked the last monthly Stableford and it was two divisions, div one was 1 to 14 or 15 (nobody with 15 handicap entered so I can't tell).

 

[Voyager EMH]

Lowest gross prize and no divisions. We have a board comp for 10-18 only and two board comps for 19s and over.
I have not seen anything on this thread that leads me to believe divisions would be an improvement.
The only disgruntled are the 7,8,9 handicappers that never win a lowest gross and don't place anywhere in the club championship.
You can't please everyone etc etc.

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Our committee has decided to introduce divisions for all club comps as follows

Division One – Players with a handicap of 5 or less

Division Two – Players with a handicap of 6 to 12

Division Three – Players with a handicap of 13 plus

I don’t have a problem with the concept of divisions, however the proposed splits seem a bit skewed.

Can I ask those who have divisions at their club what split you have?

Those would be logical based on the categories of handicap.

We're about to introduce them at our club, but only two, and yet to be reviewed based on average playing numbers, but a quick check makes me believe it's likely to be 0-12 / 13+

 

[Foxholer]

Categories should be a thing anyway. Give prizes to the top 10 if you want to give more prizes. Category wins, other the the best one, are not really wins at all. It's handicapped golf, and everyone is playing the same system. There is only one real winner, one real second, etc.
They come from a historical misconception that high handicappers win more, and low handicappers can't compete with them, and so need their egos massaged by "winning" from amongst other low handicappers.

That's simply wrong! Certainly noticeably so when I was a Competitions Secretary.
Matchplay tended to be the other way around though.

 

[rudebhoy]

Our committee has decided to introduce divisions for all club comps as follows

Division One – Players with a handicap of 5 or less

Division Two – Players with a handicap of 6 to 12

Division Three – Players with a handicap of 13 plus

I don’t have a problem with the concept of divisions, however the proposed splits seem a bit skewed.

Can I ask those who have divisions at their club what split you have?

Just heard sense has prevailed and the divisions have been amended to 0-9, 10-17 and 18+. Seems a lot fairer across the board.

 

[Swango1980]

Our committee has decided to introduce divisions for all club comps as follows

Division One – Players with a handicap of 5 or less

Division Two – Players with a handicap of 6 to 12

Division Three – Players with a handicap of 13 plus

I don’t have a problem with the concept of divisions, however the proposed splits seem a bit skewed.

Can I ask those who have divisions at their club what split you have?

In the old days, my old club had 2 divisions. 0-18 and 19+. However, it could quite often become a bit of a joke, where Div 1 had 30 players, Div 2 had 4 or 5 players.

So, when the new Comp Sec came in, he only decided the Division split the day before the competition, and he selected the split point to ensure a balanced number of entrants in both divisions.

 

[Sats]

We have 3;

1st +hcp - 14
2nd: 15-25
3rd: 26+