Dispersion - I don't get it

[Soft hands]

Honestly does the shaft make that much of a difference?

When I got my irons tried plenty of shafts and it just came down to what felt best really. I can't say that any stood out from the others dispersion wise.

 

[Deleted member 15717]

Honestly does the shaft make that much of a difference?

When I got my irons tried plenty of shafts and it just came down to what felt best really. I can't say that any stood out from the others dispersion wise.

Yes. Engine of the club...it does most of the work, and will transmit the energy. It is the bit you are holding at the end of the day!

 

[Rip-it]

Yes. Engine of the club...it does most of the work, and will transmit the energy. It is the bit you are holding at the end of the day!

Face to path and angle of attack is going to be the master of where your ball goes, no shaft will ever override this. Never Ever!

You will get different ball flights with different shafts but ultimately the ball will still go the same direction.

 

[Soft hands]

I know, but what I do has to be the biggest factor how I deliver the club to the ball at impact?

Maybe I haven't been playing long enough but I I tried plenty shafts in both driver and iron fittings and only real difference for me was feel as in weight. I honestly had no clue how they felt like they were reacting during the swing.

 

[Spear-Chucker]

Ping's 'Tour' shafts are no 'better quality' than their non-Tour ones! Nothing wrong with the quality of either style btw! There was a time when the really high volume Driver marketers (TM, Callaway, Cobra) often used stupidly low quality shafts - and got away with it because either no-one really knew better/realised the difference it could make or the comparison facilities just weren't available! It wasn't all doom and gloom though! Occasionally, a 'real' one would be used, possibly with a different paint job. So there were potential 'bargains' (like the TM R510TP)! There's a video somewhere on YouTube showing the different thickness of some shafts - made-for and real ones - which could be alarming - and the actual materials used were (are?) often different too! Low Quality Control (when making many 10s of thousands of shafts in a short period for a particular release, as opposed to making hundreds in the same time frame) is a big issue for 'Made For' as opposed to 'Real' shafts too! I have swapped my favourite Droiver shaft into nearly a dozen different heads over the years (nearly 10), with no problems. That would be impossible with one of the thin-walled cheapo ones that used to be supplied on Drivers

If Tashy's shaft (oooh-er) is Ping's 'Tour' shaft, then the 'Tour' is a (marketing?) misnomer! It's not a shaft made for/from 'the Tour', merely a slightly heavier, shorter one with less torque. It's very likely that it's these attributes that provide the increased stability that allows Tashy to 'go after it' either as a high handicap slash or with an element of 'control' - the effect of which is quite possibly a 'more centred' strike, which often has more effect on distance than a small increase in clubhead speed!

Also, very often, 'going after it' actually produces LESS actual clubhead speed (irrespective of centredness of strike)! It may feel 'faster', but sequencing tends to go haywire and actual LM values show swing speed is LOWER!

The 'secret' of fitting is finding a shaft that has the correct attributes for the particular player - and will also suit him/her when (s)he gets more confident in the changed results that the initial fitting provides!

Dispersion values could well be over-rated - though they could also indicate a potential future issue! A 10 yard value is likely to still be either on the fairway or semi and could well be discounted if there's significant distance gained. A 20 yard figure almost certainly spells trouble (already) though!

Nice post - I'd agree.

Manufacturing processes are better than ever these days and the variance in size, length, flex, kick point et al will be there but probably minimal at worst and largely irrelevant to the majority. Matching the shaft specification to the player and the clubhead are paramount and always will be. Different materials and manufacturing processes will produce different results and these may be more expensive due to design, tooling and raw material costs hence the difference in price - marketeers will exploit/accentuate this of course.

In terms of dispersion for me? It's paramount. I went for a regular flex in my 4 wood against the suggestion of stiff flex as it gave me slightly less distance but a much better dispersion and for the first time in years I have a go-to wood for the tee.

 

[Tashyboy]

Face to path and angle of attack is going to be the master of where your ball goes, no shaft will ever override this. Never Ever!

You will get different ball flights with different shafts but ultimately the ball will still go the same direction.

It always will be but why would you put a stiff shaft in the hands of a senior or lady with a swing speed of 60 mph. Dread the thought that you put a whipy shaft in a tour pros hands with 120 mph SS. Even though he can hit it well, it's not going where he wants.

 

[Soft hands]

It always will be but why would you put a stiff shaft in the hands of a senior or lady with a swing speed of 60 mph. Dread the thought that you put a whipy shaft in a tour pros hands with 120 mph SS. Even though he can hit it well, it's not going where he wants.

They are extreme cases, I'm not saying shafts make no difference just curious as to how much?

 

[Rip-it]

I agree in the elite player case, generally speaking though its not worth worrying about as long as your close in flex.

To many people feel it'll change there game and it really won't in the long term. Obviously the placebo effect works for a while though.

 

[Tashyboy]

Ping's 'Tour' shafts are no 'better quality' than their non-Tour ones! Nothing wrong with the quality of either style btw! There was a time when the really high volume Driver marketers (TM, Callaway, Cobra) often used stupidly low quality shafts - and got away with it because either no-one really knew better/realised the difference it could make or the comparison facilities just weren't available! It wasn't all doom and gloom though! Occasionally, a 'real' one would be used, possibly with a different paint job. So there were potential 'bargains' (like the TM R510TP)! There's a video somewhere on YouTube showing the different thickness of some shafts - made-for and real ones - which could be alarming - and the actual materials used were (are?) often different too! Low Quality Control (when making many 10s of thousands of shafts in a short period for a particular release, as opposed to making hundreds in the same time frame) is a big issue for 'Made For' as opposed to 'Real' shafts too! I have swapped my favourite Droiver shaft into nearly a dozen different heads over the years (nearly 10), with no problems. That would be impossible with one of the thin-walled cheapo ones that used to be supplied on Drivers

If Tashy's shaft (oooh-er) is Ping's 'Tour' shaft, then the 'Tour' is a (marketing?) misnomer! It's not a shaft made for/from 'the Tour', merely a slightly heavier, shorter one with less torque. It's very likely that it's these attributes that provide the increased stability that allows Tashy to 'go after it' either as a high handicap slash or with an element of 'control' - the effect of which is quite possibly a 'more centred' strike, which often has more effect on distance than a small increase in clubhead speed!

Also, very often, 'going after it' actually produces LESS actual clubhead speed (irrespective of centredness of strike)! It may feel 'faster', but sequencing tends to go haywire and actual LM values show swing speed is LOWER!

The 'secret' of fitting is finding a shaft that has the correct attributes for the particular player - and will also suit him/her when (s)he gets more confident in the changed results that the initial fitting provides!

Dispersion values could well be over-rated - though they could also indicate a potential future issue! A 10 yard value is likely to still be either on the fairway or semi and could well be discounted if there's significant distance gained. A 20 yard figure almost certainly spells trouble (already) though!

Excellent write up foxy, love the bit where you explain " going after it". That is me and my " goin after it " is usually followed by " that's gone tits up". Maybe there's a message there.

Re the tour shaft. A guy at our place works at Ping HQ. He turned up at the Saturday morning kids roll up at our range. I was with young Bradley. He had the new Ping driver. Fitted for it at the HQ. I had a smash and it went miles ( for me). I hit half a dozen and straight down the middle. So I had a look on eBay and two weeks later one appeared. £60 later it's mine. Then went for the fitting for me new pings a couple of months later. Ironically the guy at Ping also lowered the loft on my driver with the tour shaft.
Re "Tour". It means about as much as XR 3after an escort.

 

[hovis]

Yes. Engine of the club...it does most of the work, and will transmit the energy. It is the bit you are holding at the end of the day!

sorry but its not the engine of the club. you are the engine of the club. shaft makes very little difference to launch, spin and dispersion. shaft selection is more fine tuning.

all a shaft does is return the face to the ball. for a shaft to be responsible for spraying it all over the place is nonsense. its all in their head. i know a golfer that will push a driver 30 yards right and blame the shaft. so are we to believe that the shaft was responsible for the face being wide open at impact.
when Justin rose tested the matrix shafts the face angle difference from there highest torque shaft to lowest was 0.6 degrees. not exactly slicing numbers is it

i have witnesses tons of blind shaft testing with golf pros and results are always very similar.

 

[hovis]

It always will be but why would you put a stiff shaft in the hands of a senior or lady with a swing speed of 60 mph. Dread the thought that you put a whipy shaft in a tour pros hands with 120 mph SS. Even though he can hit it well, it's not going where he wants.

i have seen a tour pro hitting a shaft he was told was regular and was in fact a ladies shaft. he was melting the ball and averaged 5 yads more. his spin and launch where almost identical but dispersion was very slightly off. he started missing a few average 6 yards left. not the spraying that people claim.

 

[Rip-it]

sorry but its not the engine of the club. you are the engine of the club. shaft makes very little difference to launch, spin and dispersion. shaft selection is more fine tuning.

all a shaft does is return the face to the ball. for a shaft to be responsible for spraying it all over the place is nonsense. its all in their head. i know a golfer that will push a driver 30 yards right and blame the shaft. so are we to believe that the shaft was responsible for the face being wide open at impact.
when Justin rose tested the matrix shafts the face angle difference from there highest torque shaft to lowest was 0.6 degrees. not exactly slicing numbers is it

i have witnesses tons of blind shaft testing with golf pros and results are always very similar.

Love it 👍👍

 

[patricks148]

sorry but its not the engine of the club. you are the engine of the club. shaft makes very little difference to launch, spin and dispersion. shaft selection is more fine tuning.

all a shaft does is return the face to the ball. for a shaft to be responsible for spraying it all over the place is nonsense. its all in their head. i know a golfer that will push a driver 30 yards right and blame the shaft. so are we to believe that the shaft was responsible for the face being wide open at impact.
when Justin rose tested the matrix shafts the face angle difference from there highest torque shaft to lowest was 0.6 degrees. not exactly slicing numbers is it

i have witnesses tons of blind shaft testing with golf pros and results are always very similar.

i think we are wasting our time with some here, they have all been brain washed:rofl:

 

[turkish]

went again last night and hit about 20 drives and all again were either straight to target or not far offline so would you say this is simply a placebo effect? or maybe too small sample size to say?

definitely feeling more controlled and confident with it.

Like someone else said I struggle to control a ladies flex shaft(and have tested for a laugh) with my swing tempo compared to a stiff flex shaft so unsure how you can say they don't make any difference

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

sorry but its not the engine of the club. you are the engine of the club. shaft makes very little difference to launch, spin and dispersion. shaft selection is more fine tuning.

all a shaft does is return the face to the ball. for a shaft to be responsible for spraying it all over the place is nonsense. its all in their head. i know a golfer that will push a driver 30 yards right and blame the shaft. so are we to believe that the shaft was responsible for the face being wide open at impact.
when Justin rose tested the matrix shafts the face angle difference from there highest torque shaft to lowest was 0.6 degrees. not exactly slicing numbers is it

i have witnesses tons of blind shaft testing with golf pros and results are always very similar.

The shaft IS the engine of the club, it affects pretty much everything from shape of shot to flight to spin. A chopper won't notice much difference but someone who hits the ball pretty consistently certainly will notice the difference between different shafts. I used to have a r7 driver with a standard shaft that into the wind would balloon massively but when I got fitted for a different shaft in it I gained something like 80-100 yards on shots into the wind because the spin rate dropped from over 5000 rpm to under 3000.

And 0.6 degree out with a driver is the difference between playing your 2nd shot from the fairway instead of the rough over a distance of 300+ yards that those boys hit the ball.

 

[hovis]

The shaft IS the engine of the club, it affects pretty much everything from shape of shot to flight to spin. A chopper won't notice much difference but someone who hits the ball pretty consistently certainly will notice the difference between different shafts. I used to have a r7 driver with a standard shaft that into the wind would balloon massively but when I got fitted for a different shaft in it I gained something like 80-100 yards on shots into the wind because the spin rate dropped from over 5000 rpm to under 3000.

And 0.6 degree out with a driver is the difference between playing your 2nd shot from the fairway instead of the rough over a distance of 300+ yards that those boys hit the ball.

all the golfers i play with are plus handicappers. and non of then care about shafts. the club head is the biggest factor.

as for the engine being the shaft and affected flight, spin, lainch and dispersion...... its just nonsense that people WANT to believe. the fist lesson the pga give its students is blind shaft testing. i have witnessed 100's of pga students being jaw dropped at the findings.

this bloke might know a thing about golf clubs. paying particular attention to point number 1
http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/552963-10-myths-about-shafts/

 

[Rip-it]

all the golfers i play with are plus handicappers. and non of then care about shafts. the club head is the biggest factor.

as for the engine being the shaft and affected flight, spin, lainch and dispersion...... its just nonsense that people WANT to believe. the fist lesson the pga give its students is blind shaft testing. i have witnessed 100's of pga students being jaw dropped at the findings.

this bloke might know a thing about golf clubs. paying particular attention to point number 1
http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/552963-10-myths-about-shafts/

Bombshell dropped.
Great work posting this mate, hopefully people will take notice. 👍👍

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

all the golfers i play with are plus handicappers. and non of then care about shafts. the club head is the biggest factor.

as for the engine being the shaft and affected flight, spin, lainch and dispersion...... its just nonsense that people WANT to believe. the fist lesson the pga give its students is blind shaft testing. i have witnessed 100's of pga students being jaw dropped at the findings.

this bloke might know a thing about golf clubs. paying particular attention to point number 1
http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/552963-10-myths-about-shafts/

Brilliant! If you believe what he says then more fool you, his comments are full of contradictions! I find some of his comments quite incredible, he is basically trying to talk himself out of a job as a clubfitter!!

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Bombshell dropped.
Great work posting this mate, hopefully people will take notice. 👍👍

What should we be taking notice of?

 

[Soft hands]

A shaft can change spin by 2000 rpm? Are they shafts at two opposite ends of the spectrum?

I must be a decent chopper like I say I can't really feel any difference I'd have no issues taking my dad's regular driver out if I needed too. .

I wouldn't mind trying some top end shafts to see the difference, I know I can change my spin from 2800 to 1900 depending on delivery and that's just 4 swings.