Dispersion - I don't get it

[Deleted member 16999]

all the golfers i play with are plus handicappers. and non of then care about shafts. the club head is the biggest factor.

as for the engine being the shaft and affected flight, spin, lainch and dispersion...... its just nonsense that people WANT to believe. the fist lesson the pga give its students is blind shaft testing. i have witnessed 100's of pga students being jaw dropped at the findings.

this bloke might know a thing about golf clubs. paying particular attention to point number 1
http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/552963-10-myths-about-shafts/

Good article, but in explaining Myth 1 he does say a badly fitted shaft can affect accuracy, isn't that dispersion? So calling it nonsense while the document you link contradicts you is confusing.

 

[hovis]

Good article, but in explaining Myth 1 he does say a badly fitted shaft can affect accuracy, isn't that dispersion? So calling it nonsense while the document you link contradicts you is confusing.

i was simply saying peoples thought process of the shaft being everything is wrong. i agree shafts effect dispersion but no where near what most think it does

 

[hovis]

A shaft can change spin by 2000 rpm? Are they shafts at two opposite ends of the spectrum?

I must be a decent chopper like I say I can't really feel any difference I'd have no issues taking my dad's regular driver out if I needed too. .

I wouldn't mind trying some top end shafts to see the difference, I know I can change my spin from 2800 to 1900 depending on delivery and that's just 4 swings.

show me evidence of a shaft effecting speed spin by 2000rpm. you can't because thats crazy

 

[hovis]

Brilliant! If you believe what he says then more fool you, his comments are full of contradictions! I find some of his comments quite incredible, he is basically trying to talk himself out of a job as a clubfitter!!

i would listen to tom wishons advice over anyone on a golf forum

doesn't the fact that his trying to do himself out of a job speak volumes?

 

[Soft hands]

show me evidence of a shaft effecting speed spin by 2000rpm. you can't because thats crazy

I'm asking the question as drive4show shaft change moved his spin from 5000 to 3000 into headwind.

It seems a lot I'd imagine the bulk was strike dependant.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

i would listen to tom wishons advice over anyone on a golf forum

doesn't the fact that his trying to do himself out of a job speak volumes?

You seem to have pretty fixed ideas based on what you have seen from all these hundreds of pga pros and plus handicappers you hang around with. Maybe you should get yourself onto a launch monitor to try a few different shafts in the same head to see what a difference they can make.

 

[hovis]

You seem to have pretty fixed ideas based on what you have seen from all these hundreds of pga pros and plus handicappers you hang around with. Maybe you should get yourself onto a launch monitor to try a few different shafts in the same head to see what a difference they can make.

i have taken part many times in blind shaft testing where all the shafts are black. the only thing that makes a considerable difference to my swing is shaft weight. i can hit a senior flex just as well as my current shaft it just feels odd

 

[hovis]

I'm asking the question as drive4show shaft change moved his spin from 5000 to 3000 into headwind.

It seems a lot I'd imagine the bulk was strike dependant.

sorry. didn't notice the question mark on your statement. my fault for not reading it properly

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

i have taken part many times in blind shaft testing where all the shafts are black. the only thing that makes a considerable difference to my swing is shaft weight. i can hit a senior flex just as well as my current shaft it just feels odd

Sounds interesting, how do I get myself onto one of these blind tests?

 

[hovis]

Sounds interesting, how do I get myself onto one of these blind tests?

do your pga qualification or be friends with the instructor/fitter

the first time he had me do it was to show me how full of crap i was when i used to believe that my ahina shaft was launching too low. i was instantly converted

 

[Foxholer]

...
this bloke might know a thing about golf clubs. paying particular attention to point number 1
http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/552963-10-myths-about-shafts/

I certainly agree with the above! Transmission (as opposed to Engine) is a great description/analogy!

As for Head or Shaft being the bigger factor...I believe it depends on the player! All modern Heads are pretty much on the limit of legal performance and are all pretty forgiving - so, imo, it's really a case of what sounds and feels the best. Same applies to shafts, though it's only 'feel' that counts here! Getting the right balance for general (or specific) conditions is what matters! There is certainly more potential to alter feel by changing the shaft than by changing the head!

And shaft weight definitely affects the swing - at least for me! I've used shafts from 54 to 83 grams and in R, S, SX and X flexes! A Stiff Code 8 feels a bit cumbersome; 60gm R flex shafts (I've tried 2) scare me into holding back - though an even lighter, but boardier, one actually felt great at Kings of Distance Stoke Park a while ago! Currently using a 54gm S flex that feels really good (Matrix RUL). Have previously used 67gm Code 6 SX or 74gm TP7 for several years. Didn't have a problem hitting X flex White Tie in Adams Blue at Wentworth a while ago!

 

[Foxholer]

do your pga qualification or be friends with the instructor/fitter

the first time he had me do it was to show me how full of crap i was when i used to believe that my ahina shaft was launching too low. i was instantly converted

I believe it's VERY difficult for the player to really see what is happening to their Drives - except for near extremes, like ballooning and hooks/slices! I've always thought I launch the ball too high, but many PPs state that it's actually really quite low! I believe the reason is lack of perspective on 'straight' shots and a touch of 'being fooled' on the dodgy ones!

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I believe it's VERY difficult for the player to really see what is happening to their Drives - except for near extremes, like ballooning and hooks/slices! I've always thought I launch the ball too high, but many PPs state that it's actually really quite low! I believe the reason is lack of perspective on 'straight' shots and a touch of 'being fooled' on the dodgy ones!

I believe it's probably just you that has a problem! I think most people can judge fairly well what is happening!

 

[Three]

Often read posts on here where people say that their dispersion with X club was better than Y club. OK, that's fine but surely the only causes can be a) their swing or b) crap shaft in one of the clubs?

I have a top end shaft in my driver so if I tested a super whizzy new driver like an Epic and it had better dispersion then I would either be swinging badly with mine or very hacked off with my expensive shaft!

See, let's go back to the beginning.

Being "top end" or "expensive", really all that means is that they managed get you to pay more for their product.
You have to get out of the mindset that this shaft is somehow "better" than something which doesn't cost as much.

If you did hit a new Epic and it had better dispersion, it would mean that the head/shaft combo would be better for you than what you're using, irrespective of what you paid (assuming similar distances).

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

See, let's go back to the beginning.

Being "top end" or "expensive", really all that means is that they managed get you to pay more for their product.
You have to get out of the mindset that this shaft is somehow "better" than something which doesn't cost as much.

If you did hit a new Epic and it had better dispersion, it would mean that the head/shaft combo would be better for you than what you're using, irrespective of what you paid (assuming similar distances).

Sorry to burst your bubble but I had a fitting using the 'proper' Titleist fitting kit (not the standard half dozen shafts in a big box in the corner of the pro shop) and picked the shaft that produced the best results. I didn't know the price of the shafts I was trying, just went purely on the one that produced the best results for my swing.

For a pro, you really do come out with some crap.

 

[Three]

Often read posts on here where people say that their dispersion with X club was better than Y club. OK, that's fine but surely the only causes can be a) their swing or b) crap shaft in one of the clubs?

I have a top end shaft in my driver so if I tested a super whizzy new driver like an Epic and it had better dispersion then I would either be swinging badly with mine or very hacked off with my expensive shaft![/QUOTE]

Sorry to burst your bubble but I had a fitting using the 'proper' Titleist fitting kit (not the standard half dozen shafts in a big box in the corner of the pro shop) and picked the shaft that produced the best results. I didn't know the price of the shafts I was trying, just went purely on the one that produced the best results for my swing.

Lol. Keep your knickers on, we're talking about sticks.

You started the post by saying that if you hit a new club with less dispersion than your own, you would be, quote "very hacked off" because you spent more money on yours.
The whole discussion is about whether people are deluded or not in the thinking that different shafts make much difference to the majority of golfers.

It's very obvious, if club A performs better than club B for you, then club A is better FOR YOU, irrelevant of whether you had a fitting, got persuaded to spend more money etc etc.

What's wrong with that?

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Often read posts on here where people say that their dispersion with X club was better than Y club. OK, that's fine but surely the only causes can be a) their swing or b) crap shaft in one of the clubs?

I have a top end shaft in my driver so if I tested a super whizzy new driver like an Epic and it had better dispersion then I would either be swinging badly with mine or very hacked off with my expensive shaft![/QUOTE]



Lol. Keep your knickers on, we're talking about sticks.

You started the post by saying that if you hit a new club with less dispersion than your own, you would be, quote "very hacked off" because you spent more money on yours.
The whole discussion is about whether people are deluded or not in the thinking that different shafts make much difference to the majority of golfers.

It's very obvious, if club A performs better than club B for you, then club A is better FOR YOU, irrelevant of whether you had a fitting, got persuaded to spend more money etc etc.

What's wrong with that?

Absolutely nothing, it sums up my point exactly. However, I went through a pretty exhaustive testing to find the right shaft for me.

 

[Three]

If there's nothing wrong, how am I talking rubbish? 😃😃 It's the same as I wrote before.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Being "top end" or "expensive", really all that means is that they managed get you to pay more for their product.
You have to get out of the mindset that this shaft is somehow "better" than something which doesn't cost as much.

If there's nothing wrong, how am I talking rubbish? 😃😃 It's the same as I wrote before.

A bit like comparing a Dacia to a Merc S class. Both will get me from A to B but the Merc will do it quicker, more comfortably and more safely. If Mercedes are just 'getting me to pay more' then I'm happy to be ripped off.

 

[clubchamp98]

If you use a shaft that leaves the head open/ closed with your normal swing you would have to adjust your swing (not recommend ) to compensate .
so a shaft that produces square face is first .
spin is next for proper flight .
toe down sorted on the lie board.
if this feels ok that's you sorted.
Its got nothing to do with price.
i would have a teapot on a wooden pole if it hit it 260 yds down the middle.