rulie
Head Pro
You didn't answer the questions?
And your answers will be required to form the referee's outcome.
Creating a ramp with a Spurk golf mat.
- Thread starter clubchamp98
- Start date
And your answers will be required to form the referee's outcome.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
What is the issue at the end of th day ?
Someone adjust a mat to ensure the ball stays still
Using a mat to get a better lie
Swango1980
Well-known member
Surely the course still needs to be protected during competitions? And given the competitions are likely to be pretty relaxed off-season comps to keep the swing going over the winter, does it really matter if mats are used? It is the same for everyone. It is not like clubs play their club champs in the winter.it’s just a Mat
IMO you shouldn’t play off comps using a mat but that’s just my opinion
rulie
Head Pro
A questioning technique that I was taught to help identify the root cause of an issue was to ask "Why?" five times. And further advice, never try that with your spouse.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
Exactly that. The rule says what to do if the ball won't stay on the mat. It does not however tell you what lengths you can go to to try and make it stay on the mat before you take the next course of action.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
It wasn’t me but here we go.
1 Yes it was
2 yes he reduced the upslope he had to play from
3 he thinks it’s ok in his interpretation of MLR E-12
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
It’s a discussion about an incident at the club Saturday.What is the issue at the end of th day ?
Someone adjust a mat to ensure the ball stays still
Using a mat to get a better lie
I thought you liked a discussion
rulie
Head Pro
Ah, "asking for a friend"?
Well, imo, he's wrong on all three counts. It's not his interpretation of MLR E-12 that matters, it's the referee's interpretation.
I'm going for lunch today with a group of golfing buddies, we call ourselves the "grumpy old men". Maybe you want to join us?
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Thank you but no.Ah, "asking for a friend"?
Well, imo, he's wrong on all three counts. It's not his interpretation of MLR E-12 that matters, it's the referee's interpretation.
I'm going for lunch today with a group of golfing buddies, we call ourselves the "grumpy old men". Maybe you want to join us?
I couldn’t stand all those questions before I get an answer!
So now we know when playing off mats in a comp always make sure you have a referee with you
It was in a comp so questions were asked.
rulie
Head Pro
The comp Committee needs to make the ruling based on the Rules and the player's actions and intent. The referee is part of that Committee.Thank you but no.
I couldn’t stand all those questions before I get an answer!
So now we know when playing off mats in a comp always make sure you have a referee with you
It was in a comp so questions were asked.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
It’s a discussion about an incident at the club Saturday.
I thought you liked a discussion
But what’s the rule break ?
If the mat needed to be adjusted so the ball didn’t roll off then can’t see what is the issue
If the players mat position reduced the incline of the slop because of that what is the rule that’s broken ?
When playing preferred lies etc and you place a ball down on a slope and it keeps rolling then you move the ball to a spot where it’s still - is using the mat not essentially the same thing
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
We do not, although it has appeared in the suggestion book. Some in the swindle have taken to using one (they are the ones that put in to the suggestion book).
Crazyface
Tour Winner
It's not really helpful at all. As I said, he only hits it about 120 with a driver. Big fella too. I think it's a psychological thing.
rulie
Head Pro
Perhaps some posters should read Rule 14.2 and 14.3c(2), since those outline the procedure(s) that are contained in MLR E-12. Doing anything to alter conditions to get the ball to stay on on the spot is covered in Clarification 14.2c/3.
Please, just follow the Rules, their purpose is to ensure fair play. The Rules do not contain many lists of things that you cannot do, but do provide the consequences of not doing what the Rules outline how to proceed.
If it's a comp issue, bring it up to the Committee in charge - that's not me or anyone on here.
Now getting ready for lunch with the grumpy old men, leaving y'all to complain!
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Orikoru
Tour Winner
Those rules you've quoted are all irrelevant since they don't pertain to the ball being on a fairway mat.
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PaulMdj
Well-known member
Can you then clarify why the mat with the hollow bit built in, which is specifically designed to be used on a slope, as shown in the picture, is allowed as per rule and procedures you quote?
rulie
Head Pro
No, take it up with the Committee that permitted use of mats in the first place, or your national authority.
rulie
Head Pro
Only to you and others not familiar with the Rules of golf. Take it up with your national authority.Those rules you've quote are all irrelevant since they don't pertain to the ball being on a fairway mat.
RichA
Well-known member
4.3a
Allowed and Prohibited Uses of Equipment
A player may use equipment to help their play during a round, except that a player must not create a potential advantage by:- Using equipment (other than a club or a ball) that artificially eliminates or reduces the need for a skill or judgment that is essential to the challenge of the game, or
- Using equipment (including a club or a ball) in an abnormal way in making a stroke. “Abnormal way” means a way that is fundamentally different than its intended use and is not normally recognized as part of playing the game.
Swango1980
Well-known member
It's funny that this debate has only taken off in mid March, shortly before we are hopefully back to normal fairways.
I guess some of us have either been quite content about how we and others have used the mats. Whilst others have been very troubled about a lack of information and guidance as to what rules apply, but have not been troubled enough to ask the question earlier in the winter.
I've was taken aback when I saw people use the cheap mat upside down. Some even stuck it in the hole to stop it rolling about. Only becuase I wouldn't have thought about that if I used that mat. However, I had no concerns about it. We are in the preferred lies period. Even without mats, everyone is allowed to give themselved the best possible lie they can find within the relief area. So if mats must be used, as long as the mat is on the ground and the ball is on the mat, I really have no concern how they decide to use it. They can have it flat. They can have it angled up to be a "ramp" (although I'd not sure how that helps a lot, but each to their own). And I'll continue to think that until the authorities document otherwise.
I guess some of us have either been quite content about how we and others have used the mats. Whilst others have been very troubled about a lack of information and guidance as to what rules apply, but have not been troubled enough to ask the question earlier in the winter.
I've was taken aback when I saw people use the cheap mat upside down. Some even stuck it in the hole to stop it rolling about. Only becuase I wouldn't have thought about that if I used that mat. However, I had no concerns about it. We are in the preferred lies period. Even without mats, everyone is allowed to give themselved the best possible lie they can find within the relief area. So if mats must be used, as long as the mat is on the ground and the ball is on the mat, I really have no concern how they decide to use it. They can have it flat. They can have it angled up to be a "ramp" (although I'd not sure how that helps a lot, but each to their own). And I'll continue to think that until the authorities document otherwise.
