Coronavirus - political views - supporting or otherwise...

[clubchamp98]

I agree.

Surely it would be the care home owners who, if there was a negligence claim, would be in the firing line.

Goverment issued guidance IMO it would have to start at the point of implementation: espacially if it was a Private business.

Yes possibly between the NHS and the care homes transfers.
Very messy.
the care homes could have said “NO” or could they?
That’s why I think courts are not the best places for these complicated arguments.
We need a little honesty here, if you made a mistake put your hand up and say your” sorry”
But they ( decision makers ) Rarely do these days .

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Yes possibly between the NHS and the care homes transfers.
Very messy.
the care homes could have said “NO” or could they?
That’s why I think courts are not the best places for these complicated arguments.
We need a little honesty here, if you made a mistake put your hand up and say your” sorry”
But they ( decision makers ) Rarely do these days .

Without being accussed of being rude etc, I’m not sure some on here actually read the link maxfli provided, she’s already been blanked when asking for information and has now gone down the litigation route.

Maybe if politicians (from all parties) were made more aware of their actions or words in public, they would not end up in these situations or adversely, good on her if it changes the way they behave in the future.

 

[SocketRocket]

Quite. We don't often agree( seems I'm one of your right wingers ?), but the above in bold is a very good point.
As soon as I see insurance mentioned in terms of health care, I.e private as opposed to NHS, then I am very wary.
The whole point of insurance is that some are low risk ( low premiums) and those at high risk face high premiums.Basic law if insurance as I see it.
So in a private health insurance scheme, if you become chronically sick, you surely face crippling premiums, or maybe even insurance cover is withdrawn.

In another thread, some on here have examples about their pets insurance rise in premiums as their dogs get older. Exponential rises in premiums.
Don't accuse me , in deflection, of likening people with dogs , ( I prefer the latter, BTW?)
but the same principles would be applied by insurance companies. I cannot see it any other way.
NHS is the only civilised system , IMO. Sure, it should be run better, but as system of health care for a nation, it cannot be bettered.
If you support the private health system , have a look at a speech made by JFK, about health care. (It's findable online). It may surprise you, considering he was an American.

The NHS is an insurance system, it may be free at the point of delivery but it's not free. The countries that use part state and part insurance (compulsary) the insurance is normally not for profit and that portion is payed by the state where people cannot afford it. If we were to look at such a system in tne UK there would be the cries of 'Privatising the NHS' even if it turned out to be a better system. Many European countries along with Australia, New Zeland seem to successfully run their health services this way.

 

[patricks148]

The NHS is an insurance system, it may be free at the point of delivery but it's not free. The countries that use part state and part insurance (compulsary) the insurance is normally not for profit and that portion is payed by the state where people cannot afford it. If we were to look at such a system in tne UK there would be the cries of 'Privatising the NHS' even if it turned out to be a better system. Many European countries along with Australia, New Zeland seem to successfully run their health services this way.

but don't these countries you mention have sig smaller populations than the UK and far less Poverty?

 

[SocketRocket]

but don't these countries you mention have sig smaller populations than the UK and far less Poverty?

Germany, France, Spain etc aren't so different in population but what's that to do with it, less people pay in less, more people pay in more, bigger insurance outfits tend to be the ones that are more secure.

Regarding poverty in these countries, I've not looked deeply into that but some of the eastern European countries seem to have quite good health services but I doubt if they have lower poverty levels. Does the UK rate badly against these countries, I've seen some pretty poor people in France and some areas of Spain and Italy. The UK looks to be around average in Europe at around 17%

 

[Foxholer]

but don't these countries you mention have sig smaller populations than the UK and far less Poverty?

Certainly NZ and Aus have a 'less extreme' range of wealth/income - i.e. Neither so many 'super wealthy, nor 'breadline' folk, save perhaps those Aborigines (and a small number of Maoris) who choose to continue their 'subsistence culture'. That means government can 'pitch' the equivalent of NI at a level that nobody really begrudges and Private Insurance isn't such a queue-jumping tool.
In NZ, wher I come from, so know most about....A visits to a Doctor costs (amount set by Practice) as do some prescriptions, though both are free for children (under 14) and approved ones are heavily subsidised. This tends to stop 'bludgers' and those who treat a visit to a Doctor as a social visit!
And Yes, their populations ARE smaller (NZ 5M and Aus 25M). But that has both benefits (more open spaces generally means healthier life) and disadvantages (capital expenditure is disproportianately higher). Both also have serious issues with skin cancer!
Overall management/co-ordination is by about 20 regional Boards (with all but 1 - DoH appointed - member publicly elected). There's a 'cost efficiency' organisation and some boards have set up joint companies to share/minimise administration costs. It's the Management/Admin setup that is most different from here.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Certainly NZ and Aus have a 'less extreme' range of wealth/income - i.e. Neither so many 'super wealthy, nor 'breadline' folk, save perhaps those Aborigines (and a small number of Maoris) who choose to continue their 'subsistence culture'. That means government can 'pitch' the equivalent of NI at a level that nobody really begrudges and Private Insurance isn't such a queue-jumping tool.
In NZ, wher I come from, so know most about....A visits to a Doctor costs (amount set by Practice) as do some prescriptions, though both are free for children (under 14) and approved ones are heavily subsidised. This tends to stop 'bludgers' and those who treat a visit to a Doctor as a social visit!
And Yes, their populations ARE smaller (NZ 5M and Aus 25M). But that has both benefits (more open spaces generally means healthier life) and disadvantages (capital expenditure is disproportianately higher). Both also have serious issues with skin cancer!
Overall management/co-ordination is by about 20 regional Boards (with all but 1 - DoH appointed - member publicly elected). There's a 'cost efficiency' organisation and some boards have set up joint companies to share/minimise administration costs. It's the Management/Admin setup that is most different from here.

...and in Australia the vinegar bottles by the beaches of Queensland isn't there to be used on your fish and chips...

 

[Mudball]

Any watched The Trump's speech in Oklahoma where he blames Testing for the rise in cases... so he has asked them to go slow on testing.. Pure genius i say.

Close home, it looks like GP and some healthcare workers who got infected and tested positive for Covid-19 are now being denied health insurance!! As they have not got any help from the Govt, the BMA is now informally asking GPs not to go for testing till this is sorted... pure genius.

 

[clubchamp98]

Without being accussed of being rude etc, I’m not sure some on here actually read the link maxfli provided, she’s already been blanked when asking for information and has now gone down the litigation route.

Maybe if politicians (from all parties) were made more aware of their actions or words in public, they would not end up in these situations or adversely, good on her if it changes the way they behave in the future.

The politicians gave advice according to the article.
You accept advice or you don’t.
They will have covered their backs.
I just think the courts are the wrong place for this .
A public enquiry would be the best route imo.
But that would have to come from the politicians.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

The politicians gave advice according to the article.
You accept advice or you don’t.
They will have covered their backs.
I just think the courts are the wrong place for this .
A public enquiry would be the best route imo.
But that would have to come from the politicians.

I think their will be a Public Enquiry sometime in the future and totally agree we should wait for that, but unfortunately by blanking this women she believes she has no choice but to take her particular issue a step further.

I won’t judge her for that as I’ve not suffered the loss she has.

 

[clubchamp98]

I think their will be a Public Enquiry sometime in the future and totally agree we should wait for that, but unfortunately by blanking this women she believes she has no choice but to take her particular issue a step further.

I won’t judge her for that as I’ve not suffered the loss she has.

Yes agree . Not judging her at all.
But for her own sake the courts are not a nice place to be.
It can consume your whole life for years.
But as you say it’s her choice. And her right.!

 

[Doon frae Troon]

July 4th Independence day...…….really.
Are the Tories bypassing the Mail/Express readers and now appealing to the Sun readers.

 

[Crazyface]

It's not our Independence Day.

Anyhoo, the ONE thing I'm taking from all this Covid stuff, is that we are no longer a united UK. Each country is doing things completely different to each other so it's about time we cut all ties from each other and had done with the stupid UK crpa anyway.

 

[Foxholer]

...
The courts are the last place for an argument like this imho.

What other place(s) is(are) available?
In many ways, that's exactly what courts are for - however 'pointless' 'getting a result' might be!
I don't believe there is general partisan political motivation involved. But that's also for the court arguments to reveal.

 

[clubchamp98]

What other place(s) is(are) available?
In many ways, that's exactly what courts are for - however 'pointless' 'getting a result' might be!
I don't believe there is general partisan political motivation involved. But that's also for the court arguments to reveal.

I don’t think spending your life savings And years of your life, on a court case Just to get a possible apology Is the best course of action.
If that is what she wants to do fine, it’s her right.
But it won’t bring her dad back ,and imo will do her more harm than good.
But that’s just me.

 

[Kellfire]

https://www.facebook.com/508955689/posts/10158244423890690

https://www.facebook.com/508955689/posts/10158259233925690

Tories gonna Tory.

 

[Deleted member 18645]

Wee Krankie in Scotland continues to take whatever opposite approach she can to the UK.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Wee Krankie in Scotland continues to take whatever opposite approach she can to the UK.

Three of the four components of the UK do not support the actions of Johnson.
England is the one that is 'taking the opposite action to the UK' and not supporting the majority.
Good luck to them I fully support their right to act independently of the other three but I do get annoyed when Johnson continually calls his actions as 'British' when they clearly are an 'England only' matter. He should be honest rather than make a poor attempt to bend history.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Three of the four components of the UK do not support the actions of Johnson.
England is the one that is 'taking the opposite action to the UK' and not supporting the majority.
Good luck to them I fully support their right to act independently of the other three but I do get annoyed when Johnson continually calls his actions as 'British' when they clearly are an 'England only' matter. He should be honest rather than make a poor attempt to bend history.

As over 80% of the UK population lives in England and is, therefore, affected by these changes it would seem that he is being honest.

After all we know that the devolved powers will soon follow suit once the posturing has finished.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Wee Krankie in Scotland continues to take whatever opposite approach she can to the UK.

Or whatever Nicola Sturgeon thinks is best for Scotland. Shame on her for not slavishly following the excellent example on how to deal with this crisis set by Boris. Still, you got the 'Jimmy Krankie' line in so fair play, it was worth posting just for that as we haven't seen that for a few weeks.